Search found 870 matches

by Jeffret
Wed Feb 19, 2020 9:45 am
Forum: Support
Topic: Rumors of the Handbook Changes Generally True
Replies: 46
Views: 8743

Re: Rumors of the Handbook Changes Generally True

Some observations. The stuff on intersex and transgender individuals is just plain wrong. Besides the bad facts or lack of good ones, it's primary effort is to push the people and the issues off to the side and not have to deal with them. This line, under the Transgender Individuals section, is phen...
by Jeffret
Wed Feb 19, 2020 9:13 am
Forum: Support
Topic: Rumors of the Handbook Changes Generally True
Replies: 46
Views: 8743

Re: Rumors of the Handbook Changes Generally True

Basically, it's not as bad as it could be. That's pretty faint praise. It's not as punitive as the now-truly-excluded Policy of Exclusion. Now it's more along the lines of purposeful ignorance, of facts, but primarily of people they don't want to acknowledge, who might disturb their worldview. If th...
by Jeffret
Wed Feb 19, 2020 9:07 am
Forum: Support
Topic: Rumors of the Handbook Changes Generally True
Replies: 46
Views: 8743

Re: Rumors of the Handbook Changes Generally True

You too can now read the handbook: https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/stu ... e?lang=eng

No longer is the most important book in the Church super-secret and available only to the elect few.
by Jeffret
Tue Feb 11, 2020 4:14 pm
Forum: Support
Topic: EQ Return
Replies: 17
Views: 3322

Re: EQ Return

I still agree 100% with you. Your point is the point I was trying to make. I probably needlessly called out primary specifically, but I really meant any setting where you take the class manual at its face and use it word for word in the lesson. Mormon doctrine is a mile wide and an inch deep, but t...
by Jeffret
Tue Feb 11, 2020 10:14 am
Forum: Support
Topic: EQ Return
Replies: 17
Views: 3322

Re: EQ Return

Yes, but my point was that it really can't be blamed on Primary, either. It's the desired state for adult lessons. Decades ago I taught EQ (and my wife taught RS at the same time) and it was possible to use the lesson manuals as the starting point for decent lessons. With the introduction of the "Te...
by Jeffret
Mon Feb 10, 2020 4:17 pm
Forum: Support
Topic: EQ Return
Replies: 17
Views: 3322

Re: EQ Return

The guy with the calling, and one of the presidency members are terrible teachers. They mostly just lecture. Occasionally, one of us and break into their thought stream and get a (hopefully) thought-provoking comment or question in. Sometimes that will lead to an actual discussion for a minute or t...
by Jeffret
Sun Feb 09, 2020 9:14 pm
Forum: Support
Topic: EQ Return
Replies: 17
Views: 3322

Re: EQ Return

After about 5 years of being in the YM organization, I returned to the EQ. This was my first visit in 5 years, That's kind of what finally did it for me. With Primary, nursery, clerk, and YM it had been years since I had attended EQ / SS. My wife and I had been doing nursery together. They kept pro...
by Jeffret
Sun Jan 26, 2020 12:46 pm
Forum: Support
Topic: Lee Strobel -- case for Christ
Replies: 3
Views: 790

Re: Lee Strobel -- case for Christ

A quick search reveals that Strobel is very unreliable. His attempts at a scholarly support for Christ results from interviewing very biased experts from only one side. The claims he makes are not widely accepted by scholars and the evidence. He significantly distorts his own conversion story. Basic...
by Jeffret
Thu Jan 23, 2020 11:03 am
Forum: Doctrinal Discussion
Topic: Ministering, YM, EQ, and the Bishopric
Replies: 20
Views: 1735

Re: Ministering, YM, EQ, and the Bishopric

But the part of this that I didn’t talk about is that for those boys who enjoyed the scout camps and such, this will be a real demotion as far as fancy activities go. See, the girls on the church’s insurance could only travel X miles for girls camp and activities. Nothing like scuba diving was ever...
by Jeffret
Thu Jan 23, 2020 10:47 am
Forum: Doctrinal Discussion
Topic: Inerrancy among Church Employees about Church Materials
Replies: 11
Views: 1023

Re: Inerrancy among Church Employees about Church Materials

I’d posture to suggest it comes from the top. I’ll give him a pass though because he did say “some” cancerous faith destroying messages. Responsibility does have to be placed at the feet of those at the top. They've carefully nurtured the environment for this sort of behavior, at adds with what rea...
by Jeffret
Mon Jan 20, 2020 9:54 am
Forum: Doctrinal Discussion
Topic: Church says it was an "error" that their Come Follow Me manual called the black skin curse a... black skin curse
Replies: 26
Views: 1605

Re: Church says it was an "error" that their Come Follow Me manual called the black skin curse a... black skin curse

If they would just make a big public announcement that we are sorry for early doctrine that got into the church because it was started at a time when many people including early church leaders, and that it was false doctrine when Nephi wrote it down and it was false doctrine when Joseph Smith trans...
by Jeffret
Sat Jan 18, 2020 8:59 pm
Forum: Doctrinal Discussion
Topic: Church says it was an "error" that their Come Follow Me manual called the black skin curse a... black skin curse
Replies: 26
Views: 1605

Re: Church says it was an "error" that their Come Follow Me manual called the black skin curse a... black skin curse

I saw an interesting theory on reddit. The church found the error in the printed manuals but still sent them out. Then it changed the online manual. This was the older members, who are more likely to use the printed manual, get to see the same doctrine they have always known. The younger members, w...
by Jeffret
Fri Jan 17, 2020 7:44 pm
Forum: Doctrinal Discussion
Topic: No innuendo when discussing safe sex
Replies: 18
Views: 1740

Re: No innuendo when discussing safe sex

I would guess that the courts would accept this argument. I'll be honest. I think that the state park is promoting religion. If it were worth discussing, I'd like to hear what a lawyer would say. Moving on. It's been ages since I've been to "This is the Place" State Park. Probably 30 years. I see t...
by Jeffret
Fri Jan 17, 2020 3:40 pm
Forum: Doctrinal Discussion
Topic: No innuendo when discussing safe sex
Replies: 18
Views: 1740

Re: No innuendo when discussing safe sex

Admittedly I certainly got off into some tangents there, but my basic point is that the condom wrapper isn't making fun of the Church. It's making fun of the Utah State Park "This is the Place Heritage Park" and the founding of the government. It says it right there, it's a Heritage Park and not a R...
by Jeffret
Fri Jan 17, 2020 11:33 am
Forum: Doctrinal Discussion
Topic: New LDS video on temple clothes and garments
Replies: 2
Views: 270

Re: New LDS video on temple clothes and garments

I love this juxtaposition from the video: Simple white clothing symbolizes purity [slight pause] and equality. The most senior church leader and the newest member are indistinguishable when dressed in the same way. Men and women wear similar clothing ... Somehow I really don't think it works that --...
by Jeffret
Fri Jan 17, 2020 10:33 am
Forum: Support
Topic: Breasts in the news
Replies: 31
Views: 2657

Re: Breasts in the news

There was recently a vaguely related court development. Three New Hampshire women involved in a Free the Nipple organization were arrested and fined a few years back for going topless at a lake. They appealed the inequality of the law, which was supported based on “the traditional understanding of w...
by Jeffret
Fri Jan 17, 2020 10:15 am
Forum: Doctrinal Discussion
Topic: No innuendo when discussing safe sex
Replies: 18
Views: 1740

Re: No innuendo when discussing safe sex

Debate: was the “this is the place" statement by BY a religious statement, or was it the voice of the founder of the city and first governor of the territory? I could argue it was not a statement of the church, but rather of the future city. Yeah, that's basically the tangential discussion between ...
by Jeffret
Thu Jan 16, 2020 5:57 pm
Forum: Doctrinal Discussion
Topic: No innuendo when discussing safe sex
Replies: 18
Views: 1740

Re: No innuendo when discussing safe sex

I hope bears don’t chase me. Some guys like bears to chase them. When we were in Paris we saw a bunch of them at The Bear's Den. You can see them standing around the bar as my kids walk past. https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-W6WFcpc/0/de20f83b/M/i-W6WFcpc-M.jpg But, the health department does wa...
by Jeffret
Thu Jan 16, 2020 4:32 pm
Forum: Doctrinal Discussion
Topic: No innuendo when discussing safe sex
Replies: 18
Views: 1740

Re: No innuendo when discussing safe sex

The only one that I would have a problem with is "This is the place." Clearly that's a religious reference. The government should not be in the business of religious teasing. Just because the church acts badly in the political arena doesn't mean everyone else should. The others are harmless. I'm no...