Idontknowanymore,
I was a heavy reader/contributor for a few years about 9 years ago, then faded away into an occasional reader. Reading your posts made me go through the hassle of creating a new account just to post! (So, for whatever that's worth...) I just had so many thoughts after reading your intro and follow-up post that I had to share. I sure hope nothing comes off as preachy--that's the last thing I want to do.
Anyway, first--you're in a very painful spot. Even these many years later, I can remember those early months and years. It's a very difficult place to be, with a lot of uncertainty. It was difficult for my wife, too, who remains to this day both a believing member and, better still, my wife!
What worked for me (and has gotten my family and I to as good a spot as I could have hoped) was moving VERY slowly. Look at it this way--if 18 months ago you never would have imagined being where you are now, with regard to beliefs, why assume you know what you will believe 18 months in the future? And given that uncertainty, why rush monumental decisions? Kind of like remarrying after a divorce or death--good to take a year or two of cooling off, you know?
One of the challenges with moving from TBM to NOM is realizing that perhaps our very way of symbolizing the world in our minds is inadequate. Here's what I mean. When an active Mormon says "The Church is true," they mean it's teachings are correct and other church's teachings are lacking in some way. But that's not the only way to think about a church. I'm sitting in a chair. It's a true chair. Is it the only kind of chair? No. Are different chairs not chairs? No. Or take a temple recommend question--do you sustain the leaders of the Church? You bet I do. I'm not planning a coup. I don't want to do their job. I think they're well intentioned and to the extent I've known leaders at any level, they've been pretty genuine people. Does that mean I think every word they say is straight from God? No. But that's not the question, and most active Mormons don't really believe that either.
If I were to recommend a book, it would be this one:
Stages of Faith by James Fowler. It helped me realize that Faith is a life journey; a journey that everyone is on, and which has stages that can be painful to transition through. It helped me think more about symbols.
Words and complex ideas are symbols. Whether what they symbolize is literal truth is not always that important. Does the fact that Santa Claus doesn't run down every chimney mean that Christmas isn't about generosity? People become symbols all the time, and the fact that those people may have done bad things in other aspects of their lives (Martin Luther King, Ghandi, George Washington, etc.) doesn't have to remove the power of the symbol.
Life is lived in a lot of gray. When I was a believing member, I held a much more black & white view, and I've watched a lot of other people over the years just take that black & white view straight to the other side, rather than staying in the gray. Joseph was all about getting teenage girls, Monson's living large no duped members' tithes, members are all confused, etc.
Take your time in the gray. Over time I promise you will come to realize that many, many other members are there as well. The culture of the Church is to speak in absolutes, but that doesn't mean all members really feel that way.
I don't agree with a lot of things the Church has done in an official capacity. But I don't agree with a lot of things the United States government has done in an official capacity, either. Nevertheless, as a US citizen, I'm sticking around. There's an idea that the US represents to me, which is greater than any individual citizen or particular action of the government. I've found the Church to be similar in many ways. (Much easier to leave than the US, perhaps, but maybe not in my situation.)
Idontknowanymore wrote: ↑Wed Oct 11, 2017 1:57 pm
Some of the reply-ers suggested that I bring my wife in on my doubts which I did. I'm not so sure it was a good idea after all. We are currently not speaking. I decided that I didn't want to travel this road behind her back. I also didn't want to do it without her. After all, I do love her.
It's important to do this. And it's critical, if you want to stay married, to invest in your relationship for the sake of the relationship. The idea that a non-believing spouse will become a sociopath is so common. I don't know many folks that haven't gotten that reaction. So be sure to observe the weekly date night. Buy some flowers. Be romantic. Show that you're committed to her and the family, regardless. Man, I can't stress that enough. Do not try to "bring her along" as in "drag her away from the church." Respect is a two-way street.
Idontknowanymore wrote: ↑Wed Oct 11, 2017 1:57 pm
She asked me "What are you going to do if you decide the church isn't true? Drink alcohol? Start looking at porn?" I told her (not in these words) that if the church wasn't true then why would I follow the Word of Wisdom. She told me that I wasn't going to remain married to her if I drank alcohol. I reassured her that even if I came to the conclusion that the church wasn't true I would not look at porn because I love her and remain committed to her and I wouldn't do anything that would damage our relationship.
In a marriage, you have to decide what you're willing to live with, and what you're willing to skip for the rest of your life. Is drinking alcohol that critical of an experience for you? Maybe it is. For me, I didn't see the return on investment. Plenty of non-mormons never drink. I don't observe every rule in the same way that I used to. But changes have been minor. Why not contribute financially if my family uses the facilities? Why not skip the heroin addiction? Why not serve others in a church community--particularly if others are selflessly serving me and my family?
Idontknowanymore wrote: ↑Wed Oct 11, 2017 1:57 pm
I slowly lost interest in church mainly because of the awful, destructive guilt that I have born for a decade for my "sins". It took a complete loss of interest in the church and rejection of the belief that I was a bad person before I became willing to look up the "faith-chellenging" information that I knew was out there. I slowly developed a strong desire, even a wish, that the church was not true so I could get away from it before I started looking up evidence that it was in fact a falsehood. Unfortunately, my wife knows this.
This broke my heart to read, because I, too, have had long spells (years) of shame in the church. But now that I've lived a little longer, I know so many church members that are faithful and filled with joy. I've come to realize that shame and destructive guilt were coming from my personal challenges with anxiety, not church teachings. (Church teachings were a great vehicle, but without them, I would have found another reason to feel like a failure.) Addressing that head on is probably key. Food for thought, perhaps.
Idontknowanymore wrote: ↑Wed Oct 11, 2017 1:57 pm
Flying under the radar for the rest of my life sounds like a sentence. On the other hand I feel like de-converting my wife may be legitimately dangerous to her well being. Life sucks... and then you die, I guess. What should I do?
As I said above about living in the US, we associate with organizations we don't 100% support all the time in life. And, while some do not, I generally let stuff roll off my back. So while I may not like many of the current US President's actions, I'm not talking about it constantly, you know? I want to be a nicer person. I want to be more genuine in connecting with others. I want to raise my kids to be people of integrity. For me, the Church is a damn fine tool for that. If I found something I strongly believed would be better, I'd have to cross that bridge, but with a lifetime of personal experience, it's hard to imagine knowing something better.
Anyway, I'm sorry for your pain. You're at the toughest point right now, but it does get better.
) by his analysis. It's pretty long and I haven't taken the time to get all the way through it (if anyone knows of a detailed response to that response, I'd love to see it), but considering your situation, some faith promoting options might gain you some points with the little misses. If you were able to go so far (I know my DW wouldn't do this), you might even go through the reply together. That would give you both exposure to the same info and if it is hogwash you'll both be able to see it at the same time. If she's the apologetic type that will call hogwash "truth", then you're probably like me in that you'll likely have to Mormon up or move out.
