"Came out" a fourth time to my family

Discussions about negotiating relationships between faithful LDS believers and the apostates who love them. This applies in particular to mixed-faith marriages, but relations with children, parents, siblings, friends, and ward members is very welcome.
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LSOF
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"Came out" a fourth time to my family

Post by LSOF » Sun Mar 12, 2017 9:57 pm

The third time was last week, which went down very similarly, and the second and first times are documented here.

I brought up my desire to transfer to another university last week, which brought on yet another discussion about why I don't believe in Mormonism. The talk was cut short by technical problems.

This week, after some cheerful chatter, my mother asked me about transferring. I said I'd looked a bit into it, but then she began insinuating that I didn't think my decision through and that I was taking it too lightly, &c. We entered another discussion about Mormonism. I confessed a fourth time that I disbelieve, and this really upset my eleven-year-old brother, who quite likes me.

My question is: How do I resolve all this?
"I appreciate your flesh needs to martyr me." Parture

"There is no contradiction between faith and science --- true science." Dr Zaius

Pastor, Lunar Society of Friends; CEO, Faithful Origins and Ontology League

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Enoch Witty
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Re: "Came out" a fourth time to my family

Post by Enoch Witty » Mon Mar 13, 2017 7:39 am

You have two real choices here:

1) Transfer, possibly losing parental assistance. (?)
2) Finish at BYU, putting yourself at risk of losing your academic progress should you ever be outed as a non-believer, and also hurting what should be some of the best, most exciting, exploratory years of your life.

If you decide to or are forced to stay at BYU, be extremely careful about what you post online. A motivated person may be able to go through your post history here, figure out who you are, and out you to the Honor Code office. This is no joke, so be careful.

If you are going to be losing parental support by transferring to U of U (for example), I can see how that would be a big hurdle. You'll have to weigh whether taking out student loans is worth having a better college experience. If you're not at risk of losing parental support, just pull the trigger and start sending applications to non-church-affiliated schools. You will ultimately be doing your career a service; BYU will have you pinpointed as anti-gay in job pursuits, if nothing else.

Good luck!

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alas
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Re: "Came out" a fourth time to my family

Post by alas » Mon Mar 13, 2017 7:46 pm

Discussing it will not resolve it. Your parents cannot comprehend not believing, so discussing your reasons will just go in circles. Make a decision about your life, and INFORM your parents of your decision. Or just do it and tell them after the fact.

I grew up in Provo and the logical university for me to attend was BYU. Otherwise I had to pay for a place to stay and be able to support myself. Well, I had misgivings about it, because even back then I had misgivings about believing. But other universities were out of the question. I had a scholarship to BYU, and the night of freshman orientation, my mother was in a snit about something and told me I couldn't take the car. I lived on the opposite side of Provo, so walking was not an option unless I planned ahead for time. So, I argued that if I did not make the meeting, then I could not register. She stuck to not letting me take the car. So, I said fine. I won't go. Two minutes later she came in and handed me the car keys. I said, nope, I am not going to freshman orientation. I am not going to BYU. Then next day, I started applying to another college in Utah, worked fall semester and went the next semester. Best decision ever. I never did explain that decision to my parents. But it gave my kid brother and sister permission to consider a university other than BYU and they both went to the U.

Basically, it is your life, not your parents, so you don't need their permission, approval, or understanding. There will be many times as an adult that you have to do what is best for you and not worry about if your parents understand or approve.

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Dravin
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Re: "Came out" a fourth time to my family

Post by Dravin » Tue Mar 14, 2017 6:05 am

alas wrote:
Mon Mar 13, 2017 7:46 pm
Discussing it will not resolve it. Your parents cannot comprehend not believing, so discussing your reasons will just go in circles. Make a decision about your life, and INFORM your parents of your decision. Or just do it and tell them after the fact.
Yep. At this point it's highly unlikely that his parents aren't getting it because he has failed to communicate well. No amount of communication can broach the barriers of someone who just doesn't want to accept things. It'll take time for them to comprehend that this isn't just some lark because categorizing it as some hastily thought out phase that he'll come to recant is a thread of hope that they're going to cling to until they, possibly with time, realize it is a false hope.

It's like trying to explain that I didn't leave to sin or because I was offended, or because I was lazy just bounces off a fair number of members. It's a defensive mechanism that protects the core idea that there is no legitimate reason for disbelief. It's a strong one and breaching it isn't a matter of eloquence.
Hindsight is all well and good... until you trip.

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Re: "Came out" a fourth time to my family

Post by Newme » Tue Mar 14, 2017 1:27 pm

LSOF wrote:
Sun Mar 12, 2017 9:57 pm
We entered another discussion about Mormonism. I confessed a fourth time that I disbelieve, and this really upset my eleven-year-old brother, who quite likes me.

My question is: How do I resolve all this?
Maybe you can spend some time with your brother - shooting baskets or whatever you do together, and ask him what he thinks or feels. Maybe point out how you don't like cheesecake but he does - should that be a problem? Of course not. Or maybe give the analogy (which a GA gave) of the elephant and blind men. Explain how for a long time, you had no idea the elephant pooped - (you didn't know the church had a stinky side) - and now you realize it, so you don't believe in the bad aspects anymore. But maybe you can point out any common beliefs you have - like in serving and loving others etc. If needed, teach him the real meaning of the 11th Article of Faith.

Good luck - I hope you figure out your college stuff and that your relationships find new ways of relating.

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LSOF
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Re: "Came out" a fourth time to my family

Post by LSOF » Mon Mar 20, 2017 2:59 pm

An update:

It seems that it's finally stuck with my parents that I don't believe, since this week, they acknowledged the same and we established rules for my conduct which boil down to "don't be rude to visiting Mormons". They are supportive of my decision to transfer. Everyone's gotten over it mostly, and things are mostly the same as before. My parents and brothers are no less amicable than before. Short of everyone leaving the Mormon church with me, I couldn't have hoped for a better transition.
"I appreciate your flesh needs to martyr me." Parture

"There is no contradiction between faith and science --- true science." Dr Zaius

Pastor, Lunar Society of Friends; CEO, Faithful Origins and Ontology League

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Enoch Witty
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Re: "Came out" a fourth time to my family

Post by Enoch Witty » Tue Mar 21, 2017 12:52 pm

LSOF wrote:
Mon Mar 20, 2017 2:59 pm
An update:

It seems that it's finally stuck with my parents that I don't believe, since this week, they acknowledged the same and we established rules for my conduct which boil down to "don't be rude to visiting Mormons". They are supportive of my decision to transfer. Everyone's gotten over it mostly, and things are mostly the same as before. My parents and brothers are no less amicable than before. Short of everyone leaving the Mormon church with me, I couldn't have hoped for a better transition.
Yeah, this is pretty ideal. God(if one exists)speed to you!

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Lithium Sunset
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Re: "Came out" a fourth time to my family

Post by Lithium Sunset » Sat Apr 01, 2017 10:21 pm

LSOF wrote:
Mon Mar 20, 2017 2:59 pm
An update:

It seems that it's finally stuck with my parents that I don't believe, since this week, they acknowledged the same and we established rules for my conduct which boil down to "don't be rude to visiting Mormons". They are supportive of my decision to transfer. Everyone's gotten over it mostly, and things are mostly the same as before. My parents and brothers are no less amicable than before. Short of everyone leaving the Mormon church with me, I couldn't have hoped for a better transition.
Great news! I am sure there will be ups and downs but this is great progress with your family. Glad to hear you get to transfer. I can definitely tell being there is making you unhappy, or maybe that was just when you talked about politics haha ;)
"The real things haven't changed. It is still best to be honest and truthful; to make the most of what we have; to be happy with simple pleasures; and have courage when things go wrong." -Laura Ingalls Wilder

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redjay
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Re: "Came out" a fourth time to my family

Post by redjay » Sun Apr 02, 2017 2:14 am

LSOF wrote:
Mon Mar 20, 2017 2:59 pm
An update:

It seems that it's finally stuck with my parents that I don't believe, since this week, they acknowledged the same and we established rules for my conduct which boil down to "don't be rude to visiting Mormons". They are supportive of my decision to transfer. Everyone's gotten over it mostly, and things are mostly the same as before. My parents and brothers are no less amicable than before. Short of everyone leaving the Mormon church with me, I couldn't have hoped for a better transition.
:)

win
At the halfway home. I'm a full-grown man. But I'm not afraid to cry.

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MalcolmVillager
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Re: "Came out" a fourth time to my family

Post by MalcolmVillager » Mon Apr 03, 2017 3:18 pm

Congrats on the transfer!

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LSOF
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Re: "Came out" a fourth time to my family

Post by LSOF » Tue Apr 04, 2017 10:54 am

MalcolmVillager wrote:
Mon Apr 03, 2017 3:18 pm
Congrats on the transfer!
I should clarify, I haven't actually gotten a transfer yet, but I am moving to apply for one.
"I appreciate your flesh needs to martyr me." Parture

"There is no contradiction between faith and science --- true science." Dr Zaius

Pastor, Lunar Society of Friends; CEO, Faithful Origins and Ontology League

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PalmSprings
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Re: "Came out" a fourth time to my family

Post by PalmSprings » Sun Apr 16, 2017 12:46 am

LSOF wrote:
Tue Apr 04, 2017 10:54 am
MalcolmVillager wrote:
Mon Apr 03, 2017 3:18 pm
Congrats on the transfer!
I should clarify, I haven't actually gotten a transfer yet, but I am moving to apply for one.
Awesome! I'm glad it worked out for you. If want to transfer I wouldn't waste time. You are only young once and there is the possibility of your parents going backwards on this one.

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Korihor
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Re: "Came out" a fourth time to my family

Post by Korihor » Tue Apr 18, 2017 8:50 am

Congrats, I'm glad things are working out.
how much time is left on the calendar before you earn your degree?
Really, even if it costs a few more dollars to go to another school, it's only money. Don't spend stupidly, but your sanity has a value, too.

Glad to hear things are coming along without excessive backlash
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