NOM

I am relatively new here but have been following you guys for years. But I think I'm getting to the point of maybe needing to go to a marriage counselor with or without my wife to deal with our relationship. She knows of my disaffection, yet she has a hard time compromising on things and doesn't like to discuss issues I have with the church. I have not been honest with her about drinking coffee. I told her a couple of years ago that I tried it and think I told her I wouldn't do it anymore but it has been hard to abstain especially when I prefer it over soda and I think it's probably healthier than soda? Does anyone have any suggestions for handling this or know of any good counselors who help people in our boat?

Thanks a ton

If you feel comfortable with it, can you share where you live? Some people may be able to recommend councilors in your area.

Hey JTC, good suggestion. I am in between Utah and Salt Lake counties in Utah so either county would probably work. In an effort to be more transparent with her last night I confessed to drinking coffee, not wearing my garment top while at work sometimes (too hot), and listening to Mormon Stories. She wasn't happy as I suspected. (I'm not ready to tell her about my involvement on this site) And she practically invited me to leave. Anyhow, we discussed the church and God and she would like me to try to focus on thinking about the possibility of there being a god. She wants me to do all I can to believe before she can feel ok with giving me my freedom to do what I want. So I asked her to think of something specific that I could do. I don't want to let our marriage die. I went to say goodbye to my son in bed on my way to work and he cried because he didn't want me to go and hugged me tight. I think the sight of this softened my wife towards me as well. Our kids really can pull at our heart strings and this is why people try to keep their marriages together for their kids I think and I would be included in that camp. I guess I just need to show my wife that I am a good husband and that I value and love her and show her that I am doing my best to believe in a god. She said I wouldn't even have to attend an organized religion. Do you guys have any suggestions in regards to this? Someone spoke at stake conference and said he was driving and heard a voice to stop and had he not he probably would have hit a child that ran out in front of him. I know this isn't unique to mormonism--so maybe there is something to this sort of thing. Any thoughts? Thanks for reading

Veon Smith is in South Jordan, DW and I went a few times and I thought he was a good therapist.

Compromise for a TBM is really hard, it's like admitting you don't have the faith to really follow the gospel. I think one possible path is to not require them to admit anything. Go on a vacation that includes a Sunday and don't go to church and don't talk about it. Drink your coffee now that she knows and never discuss it again. Don't pay tithing and use that money for a car payment or a vacation or savings and don't link the good to the lack of paying tithing. Eventually our TBM spouses may be ready to accept things, and maybe not, but we can have a livable lifestyle while we stick it out for the kids. (I would rather be in a world where we resolved these issues, but it just isn't going to happen, so this is my next best plan)

For my DW and me counseling wasn't particularly helpful. DW doesn't want to talk about this stuff with or without counseling. She also doesn't seem to want a divorce, so we go along without talking about it very much. There is no resolution in sight, but I'm trying to get comfortable with living with the paradox rather than trying to solve the problem (see this post for background).

Good luck!

stuck wrote: ↑

Mon Aug 19, 2019 10:15 am

Does anyone have any suggestions for handling this or know of any good counselors who help people in our boat?

You should check out the Mormon Mental Health Association. This is not some official LDS group. These are all licensed clinical therapists who understand the Mormon world and the challenges of faith transitions, mixed-faith marriages, and LGBT issues. This is not some ex-LDS apostate group. Some of these counselors are active Mormons, but all of them will have a much deeper understanding of LDS life.

I found a delightful therapist for my daughter through this organization. It was actually quite reassuring for my dear, believing wife that I found someone through this list. My wife was happy to see that I was not just finding some random, atheist counselor. If you are in the Phoenix area I would be happy to recommend my daughter's therapist with no reservation.

I’m too lazy to type this out but we did 15 months of marriage therapy and it helped us.

The therapist asked on the first day if any of our issues were deal breakers. I think she wanted to quickly assess what she was working with. We both said no and followed her path and assignments.

After looking back, all she did was help us to facilitate open communication and talking to each other. Not to quote Jesus but, it wasn’t easy but it was worth it.

We started by doing nightly check in’s.

1. What was the highlight of your day?
2. What could have gone better?

Then after a few weeks we added:

3. How is our emotional connection?
4. How is our physical/sexual connection?

There were a lot of good conversations, bad conversations, hurt feelings, great moments and in the end we are in a better place.

However the church divide still presents open wounds that will probably never heal.

Hey guys thanks for your responses! Having a faith crisis or should we say the church is having a truth crisis is difficult. It is nice to know that it is not true but being married to a tbm makes life quite challenging right?! May the universe or God help us all! Hopefully the truth will continue to pose a problem for the church to the point of forcing them to make some admissions and making our lives easier.

Linked wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 20, 2019 11:33 am

Veon Smith is in South Jordan, DW and I went a few times and I thought he was a good therapist.

That’s who my wife and I see. My kids see him as well when they feel they need it. DW and I just had another appointment last week. He is wonderful! Can’t say enough good about him. He has been a life saver for us and our family.

Hermey wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 21, 2019 7:57 pm

Linked wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 20, 2019 11:33 am

Veon Smith is in South Jordan, DW and I went a few times and I thought he was a good therapist.

That’s who my wife and I see. My kids see him as well when they feel they need it. DW and I just had another appointment last week. He is wonderful! Can’t say enough good about him. He has been a life saver for us and our family.

Care to elaborate on how/what has helped?

Thanks for the feedback on Veon. Subsequently I bought my wife some flowers and wrote her a card sort of giving her some thoughts that I thought may persuade her to cut me some slack. I mentioned pres. Nelson's quote about being free to choose a different religion if new knowledge justified it and mentioned that if God was loving and merciful he wouldn't condemn us for worshipping or living according to the dictates of our conscience. Finally I think I mentioned the scripture in 1 cor that says that the believing spouse would sanctify the unbelieving spouse. She seemed to soften a bit. I was worried that the card would anger her to the point of wanting to leave me because I called her a couple of times that day and she didn't answer my calls so I was worried; but she was just preocupied with family and other things (whew!). She still wants me to do something where I must try to believe in God. It might be interesting to attend a progressive Christian church to see how they worship. Does anyone have any suggestions on where to attend?

Red Ryder wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 22, 2019 1:52 pm

Hermey wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 21, 2019 7:57 pm

Linked wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 20, 2019 11:33 am

Veon Smith is in South Jordan, DW and I went a few times and I thought he was a good therapist.

That’s who my wife and I see. My kids see him as well when they feel they need it. DW and I just had another appointment last week. He is wonderful! Can’t say enough good about him. He has been a life saver for us and our family.

Care to elaborate on how/what has helped?

First off, we both equally want our marriage to succeed and we are committed to that. Therapy is so important. Finding a therapist that works for both of you is key. We see 'V' both separately and together. What we both like about 'V' is that he leaves the religion out of it. If we can build and maintain a solid, sturdy, and effective three-legged stool, we'll be able to navigate the mixed faith marriage issues just like any other issue that arises.

What's this three-legged stool?....Communication, Trust, and Loyalty.

Those are the areas that we work on -- communication being the primary one for us right now. Communication is a skill. It's something that you need to work on, practice, develop, etc. We've improved a lot over the years, but have a long ways to go still. When we have something (whether for one or both of us) that is creating an issue or wedge in our relationship, we try to step back and look at it as something that we need to work on together to either 1.) improve it, so it becomes a "positive" positive in our relationship, or 2.) eliminate it, so it doesn't cause a larger crack or divide and weaken our relationship. The trick is to be able to take a step back and not take or make it personal.

There so much more to this, but it would take forever to type. I keep threatening to make and post a whiteboard video(s) to share a more complete version of this. Should I?

Also, our three kids all see 'V' when they feel the need for a tune-up. They just pick up the phone and set an appointment for themselves. They understand that mental health is just as important as anything else.

I think if you posted a video that would be great Hermey!

stuck wrote: ↑

Sun Aug 25, 2019 7:55 am

I think if you posted a video that would be great Hermey!

Please do!

stuck wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 20, 2019 10:56 am

Someone spoke at stake conference and said he was driving and heard a voice to stop and had he not he probably would have hit a child that ran out in front of him. I know this isn't unique to mormonism--so maybe there is something to this sort of thing. Any thoughts? Thanks for reading.

I don't have anything to say in regards to marriage, because I was divorced when my path took a serious turn away from the Corporation - and my kids' dad had died a couple years earlier (and my (3) kids were not into Church anyway; none identify as LDS now, and two resigned after I did).

My experience has been that there is definitely something to this (your quote, above). No religion has a corner on the market or, as someone I know put it, The LDS Church "doesn't have a franchise on the Holy Ghost."

I honestly don't know if it is God, some kind of connection between humans and life, a 6th sense we are born with but rarely learn to use, or what - but there is definitely something.