Cornered in the bathroom

[oliver_denom]

I put this in support because it's the closest fit, but I'm less traumatized by this than amused.

Just to bring everyone up to date, my wife and kids stopped attending two years ago, but because I was the stake executive secretary it took me a little bit longer to back away. A year ago I finally set down with my SP and asked for a release. Surprisingly he neither argued nor did he ask any questions. He just assumed I wanted to go back to the ward to "rescue" my wife and kids. I went back to the ward in order to bide my time a little because being so close to the stake presidency would cause a few waves if I were to just leave immediately. I took a calling playing the organ, turned down offers for anything else, didn't renew my recommend, and now only show up for sacrament meeting. I'm doing the slow waltz out the front door.

When I started this process a year ago, I had expected some push back and commentary from the local leadership, but I got exactly zero. It was a welcomed surprise. That doesn't mean my family isn't a topic a ward council, only that they seem to be too frightened to speak to me directly. That's fine. If they want to make up stories in their knitting circle, it makes no difference to me. Maybe if I were in a part of the country where all social life was wrapped up in the church then it would be different. As it stands all my work and social life is separate from the ward, so if they talk, it doesn't matter. It's been like this for a little over 12 months.

That changed last week when a guy I know suddenly decided to corner me at the organ and started sharing his personal divorce story after his wife apostatized. I thanked him for sharing and assured him that I'm not getting divorced. Then this past Sunday, instead of immediately exiting the building, I had to make a quick pit stop. I had noticed a counselor in the Bishopric nervously eyeing me after the meeting, we shook hands and traded pleasantries, no big deal. But then, after I'm in the bathroom, after I've unzipped and started my business, this dude creeps up behind me and starts asking why my family is inactive. Talk about a captive audience! I washed my hands, politely brushed him off, and walked out while he was still talking. As soon as I was in the hall though, the broke off and disappeared.

It's this crap that makes it difficult for people to attend church after they've been gone for awhile. They can't sit through a class or take a piss without worrying that someone's going to call them into a meeting or pry into their personal affairs. I really hate stupid awkwardness. The past 12 months have been filled with awkward silence and whispering. Now I'm worried that the next few months will be filled with more creepy behavior, back channel conversations about my kids, and me politely declining with my dick in my hand.

[20/20hind]

That's really a piss poor way to ask why you don't come to church anymore.

The lds culture is just so out of the ordinary. It's just weird. Why would he do that? They have this obsession about people coming to church. They even mention it in the prayers at church, especially sm prayers. They will say something like please help those who are not here today that they will feel the spirit and decide to come to church.

They talk about how to get people active and they become projects. It's bizarre that they obses over this topic so much. It creates this same type of behavior that you experienced in the church restroom. Weird and wacky stuff for sure

[FiveFingerMnemonic]

The thing to remember is this counselor was probably assigned to check up on you by the Bishop and unless he's a sociopath or on the spectrum somewhere was probably trying to work up the courage and opportunity to get that damn assignment fulfilled to ease the stress. Nevertheless doing the urinal ambush was a pretty lame move! Very culty haha.

[alas]

Thank you, Goddess, that women have private booths to pee in. Thank you thank you thank you.

See, my dear sisters, there are advantages in being female in this church. As pissy as they treat us some times, at least they can't be so creepy as to have someone ambush us while trying to relieve ourselves.

Now, for something constructive. My husband has a pretty good way of answering that question.

Them: "Why doesn't alas come to church anymore?"

DH: "Because she doesn't want to."

Them: "Why not?"

DH: "Why don't you ask her. She can explain much better than I can why she doesn't like church."

Nobody has ever followed up and asked me.

But they do assign Home teachers very very carefully. Our current HT counted an ATV trip we took together. My husband told him it counts, and so it counts. But the other day my husband went out in the desert where HT's ATV had broken down to bring them back to town. HT asked if rescuing him and his wife could count for March HT visit. DH said no, cause I didn't come. Has to be a visit with the whole family. I think I am going to get along with this guy.

But back to my husband's answer. There is something about bluntly saying that someone does not want to go to church that stops them in their tracks. See, most of them don't want to go either. They go out of obligation and guilt, not because they enjoy being there. So, how do you guilt someone into feeling guilty enough to go, when obviously guilt isn't working. They only have the guilt/shame tool in their tool box. They don't have a "fun" tool or an "inspiring" tool because they know Mormon church is not fun or inspiring. They have nothing to make someone want to go to church. They have guilt. If someone is sinning, then guilt can work. If someone is just too lazy, guilt can work. If someone is offended, then guilt can work because guilt can over power the anger at the offense. If someone says they don't believe, well, then shame them for their doubt and guilt them into going so they can fix their testimony. But if someone is honest enough to say they don't go because they don't want to, they don't have a clue how to fix that because they don't want to go either. And they know deep in their unhappy little hearts, that if they look too closely at why someone might not want to go, they will see all too well why they themselves don't want to be there. It doesn't feel good to them to know that they go out of guilt and would rather stay home and have a quiet day with family. It makes going for them harder if they know don't want to, so they retreat away from the cognitive dissonance.

There is another reason this works. It is a clear statement on my DH's part that he will not be used by the church to pressure me into going. If they want to pressure me, they have to do it themselves.

See, the assumption the church makes is that you feel terrible that your family doesn't go. So, you should be anxious to discuss this and looking for solutions. Together, you and them can find a way for you to pressure your family to go. Probably by guilting YOU into guilting YOUR FAMILY. See, you just need to be reminded that as the priesthood leader in the home, it is your job to be the spiritual leader who applies pressure and guilt to get them to go, you know, by setting an example of dictatorship.

[oliver_denom]

Them: "Why doesn't alas come to church anymore?"

DH: "Because she doesn't want to."

This is a pretty good suggestion. However, the one upside to my attendance is that I've been able to run interference between the church and my family. I won't be suggesting they ask my wife directly, but this may at least allow me to urinate in peace.

[alas]

I told my husband about your...um...situation and he offered another solution. You simply turn around without stopping the flow. As you pee on his shoe, quickly apologize, but sort of blame him for interrupting you as he did. He will never start another conversation in the john.

My husband never dares accuse me of being an evil apostate, cause when it comes to evil, he wins hands down.

[Emower]

Just zip up, turn around and offer your hand for a handshake. Trade awkward for awkward...

[RubinHighlander]

However, the one upside to my attendance is that I've been able to run interference between the church and my family. I won't be suggesting they ask my wife directly, but this may at least allow me to urinate in peace.

Dude, if your family is out, don't torture yourself anymore, unless you still believe it. I have a great resignation letter I can send you as a template that will shut them down and they won't bother you anymore. I tried to do the same thing with my 12+ year stake clerk job. I was actually glad to be out of the ward calling pool, but when my wife and kids were done with the church and only attending once a month the Ward Council put us on the project list and started up the harassment to fix us. I thought I was so close to finally getting out of my calling when the 3rd stake presidency came in, but they kept me in! I refused all the invitations to go and meet with the bishop and refused to let them meet with my daughter. I finally just had to put my foot down and send the letter. No problems ever since.

[Give It Time]

I told my husband about your...um...situation and he offered another solution. You simply turn around without stopping the flow. As you pee on his shoe, quickly apologize, but sort of blame him for interrupting you as he did. He will never start another conversation in the john.

My husband never dares accuse me of being an evil apostate, cause when it comes to evil, he wins hands down.

Oliver, I edited the OP on my thread. My son or I can be legitimately under the weather, but the way I answer the question about why he doesn't attend SS or Priesthood is "that's his story to tell". I love that response and Alas's, because it not only shuts down the third degree, it lets them know, you won't be providing them any fodder for gossip. They'll make stuff up, though.

I once had a Priesthood leader come to my home and have a brief meeting with my son about missionary prep. He held this meeting without informing me he was coming (he dropped by), nor did he let me know he was in my home. Presumably, because he assumed I didn't want my son going on a mission. Yours beats me by a mile.

I did speak to the bishop about this. It was one tough conversation, but my bishop was a mensch.

[Just This Guy]

I told my husband about your...um...situation and he offered another solution. You simply turn around without stopping the flow. As you pee on his shoe, quickly apologize, but sort of blame him for interrupting you as he did. He will never start another conversation in the john.

My husband never dares accuse me of being an evil apostate, cause when it comes to evil, he wins hands down.

I was going to suggest the same, but you beat me to it.

[2bizE]

This is too funny. I would try to corner him in the bathroom and ask him if he would like to try some Amway products you are selling.

[Give It Time]

On the thread where it was asked what are the top three problems of the church? One of my answers was that the church is aggressive. As I was complaining on my thread about how they don't back off. Unfortunately, this aggression is institutionalized and is scriptural.

Oh, that I were an angel
Going forth without purse or scrip to spread the gospel


I even heard a talk where the speaker started out by saying "Love One Another" and then told a story about how one man brought his friend into the gospel by going into his home while he was asleep and waking him up and taking him to church before he could go surfing. He knew the next week his friend would lock the doors and get up earlier, so he was waiting on his friend's car. The friend joined, of course. That was the moral of the story and the justification for the behavior.

No presiding authority got up and said, we've heard some well intended counsel, but I don't think the Lord would have us breaking and entering into another person's home--even a friend, especially a friend--to bring them to church. Don't do it while they are awake. Don't do it while they are asleep. Creepy.

No, this behavior has scriptural backing and is advocated over the pulpit. It's within the program with any home visit. All of this aggression makes the church look anything like an organization where healthy behavior is advocated. It will eventually make any peaceful coexistence impossible.

[Meilingkie]

This just stinks, literally.
As a missionary I was cornered by a sister once.
She had a crush, badly.
And she cornered me in the bathroom.....

[Korihor]

This just stinks, literally.
As a missionary I was cornered by a sister once.
She had a crush, badly.
And she cornered me in the bathroom.....

That sounds like a golden investigator to me

[Corsair]

This just stinks, literally.
As a missionary I was cornered by a sister once.
She had a crush, badly.
And she cornered me in the bathroom.....

This sounds like the premise of a movie that you would not be allowed to watch on your mission.

[Give It Time]

This just stinks, literally.
As a missionary I was cornered by a sister once.
She had a crush, badly.
And she cornered me in the bathroom.....

All this aggressive hunting down reminds me so, so much of that person so desperate for romance. It's not a good look.

[Silver Girl]

Darn! Remind me not to ever again miss a day or two of NOM - best thread I've read in ages, on any site!

I vote for the apres pee handshake - more subtle and definitely disgusting. The shoe-spray is a great idea, too, though, depending on how aggressive the guy was.

Since you're likely to get even more questions about the family (maybe even some cookies at the door), another way to respond to questions about the family is to meet them eye-to-eye, smile in a slightly bored but patronizing way and say, "Why do you ask?" That can be followed with, "What business is it of yours?" and then punctuated with complete silence.

The most charitable idea that comes to mind is that perhaps the guy has doubts and sought out a private (cough!) spot in which he could get your thoughts.

Maybe you should have made a pass at him - then you'd be ex'd pretty quickly and the entire family could just disappear.

[Give It Time]

Darn! Remind me not to ever again miss a day or two of NOM - best thread I've read in ages, on any site!

I vote for the apres pee handshake - more subtle and definitely disgusting. The shoe-spray is a great idea, too, though, depending on how aggressive the guy was.

Since you're likely to get even more questions about the family (maybe even some cookies at the door), another way to respond to questions about the family is to meet them eye-to-eye, smile in a slightly bored but patronizing way and say, "Why do you ask?" That can be followed with, "What business is it of yours?" and then punctuated with complete silence.

The most charitable idea that comes to mind is that perhaps the guy has doubts and sought out a private (cough!) spot in which he could get your thoughts.

Maybe you should have made a pass at him - then you'd be ex'd pretty quickly and the entire family could just disappear.

Seriously. He's coming up behind you in the bathroom. Just go with it.

[SunbeltRed]

Yikes!

Fun times with Mormons who don't have any concept of boundaries.

I think what's actually more surprising to me in this story is that Oliver is still attending church

[Random]

I told my husband about your...um...situation and he offered another solution. You simply turn around without stopping the flow. As you pee on his shoe, quickly apologize, but sort of blame him for interrupting you as he did. He will never start another conversation in the john.

I can so visualize this: Counselor starts to talk to you. You act startled and turn to him, accidentally peeing on his shoe. Immediately, you apologize and say, "I'm sorry, but you startled me." Then turn around and finish up your business.