I'm going in to be interviewed. Advice?

[oliver_denom]

I've tossed this around in my head a lot lately, and I came up with two possible responses to this interview request:

1) Write this person back and say, "Thanks but no thanks. Have a nice day."
2) Accept the interview request and go in person to say, "Thanks but no thanks. Have a nice day."

If I had gone with option one, then I think the ward would become increasingly aggressive. It's the face to face that they want, and I didn't want to put up with weeks of whatever they had planned just to get a meeting with me. So I've accepted a sit down. Maybe this is akin to negotiating with terrorists, but a direct in person conversation can be a lot better than writing a letter. First, when people are directly interacting, they tend to be more polite. Second, there's no danger of having my written words passed around all over creation. Both of us have plausible deniability.

No its just dealing with the wait. I don't know what this guy wants, but it's probably a calling, and he's a complete stranger that just moved into the ward. It's the unknowns that are making me anxious. Is this guy reasonable or is he a jerk? I'm walking into the conversation assuming he's a nice reasonable guy. I'll be polite, maybe he'll reciprocate, I'll say "Thanks but no thanks", and he'll say "That's cool, thanks for coming in." If that fails, then I'll still be polite, say "Thanks but no thanks", and if he asks why, then I'll explain that I don't want to discuss the reasons. If he asks more questions, then I'll keep saying the same thing in different ways. Then, hopefully, we can shake hands and part ways.

This will be my first time turning down a calling. Any advice from anyone who's already done this? What was it like?

[20/20hind]

I think your plan is good. You are in control of your life. Your an adult and can make your own decisions in life. You don't owe anyone an excuse or explanation for your choices. Leaders in the church like to take that power from you and control your behavior to further their personal and church agendas.

Good luck!

[2bizE]

Where are you meetings by at? Can you meet him at Starbucks or some here else?

[wtfluff]

"Thanks but no thanks"

Other appropriate answers are:

No.
No thank you.

All three are complete sentences, and as you have mentioned:

I don't want to discuss the reasons.

None of those complete sentences requires explanation or discussion.

Just rinse and repeat as necessary.

Don't be surprised if you get a blank stare when you actually say no; They're unaccustomed to hearing that word if / when proposing a "calling".

[Red Ryder]

I recently turned down an EQ calling.

I expressed my honest reasons why I didn't want to do it. Too much time commitment and I need to focus on my family and work right now. He said to think about it and get back to him. So I did and sent a text confirming my no and that was it.

Thanks but no thanks really works.

[Emower]

All good replies here. There is no replacement for doing awkward, unconventional stuff in person. Its kind of fun. My Bishop recently had a get to know you session with us (we just moved to the Ward). It was kind of amusing to see his facial expression when I told him I had lost my faith in the church and never got it back. He said, "So you think Joseph Smith just made it all up?" "Yep, thats what I think." *Mind blown* It was fun!

[Margarita]

You might get lucky...the last interview I had the 2nd counselor went to sleep!

[Linked]

I don't think they will be too surprised by the "no", but I would expect them to be taken aback by you not explaining why. I've declined callings before because I was busy with school and there was no problem. The bishopric at the time was very understanding though.

If you want to declare your independence to this local church leader then a "No." with no explanation is a good way to do it. It's basically setting up a boundary and telling them that it is none of their business. Church culture doesn't value boundaries or independence, so having those will make you stand out. If you don't want to stand out but also don't want the calling then providing an explanation of why you can't do it could work depending on the leader.

Good luck with the visit and the wait!

[Vlad the Emailer]

All good replies here. There is no replacement for doing awkward, unconventional stuff in person. Its kind of fun. My Bishop recently had a get to know you session with us (we just moved to the Ward). It was kind of amusing to see his facial expression when I told him I had lost my faith in the church and never got it back. He said, "So you think Joseph Smith just made it all up?" "Yep, thats what I think." *Mind blown* It was fun!

That's exactly the way I am. If they want to talk, fine, I'll call 'em like I see 'em. I'll tell 'em all kinds of stuff and have fun doing it.

In fact, once a member of the SP asked that I meet with him after stake conference. In my youth he and I were in the same ward and he had been my senior HT companion, but I had moved away and hadn't seen him much for several years. He said the interview was just a little chat that the stake president requested his counselors have with randomly chosen members (there was a line behind me). Just a quick how're a doin' type of thing. At the point in which I came out as a non-believer leaning toward atheism (there for the benefit of my TBM DW) he said he was disappointed, but didn't know what else to say. About all he could come up with was that science wasn't everything and that he was a believer and yet a (chemical) engineer. I think the "yeah, I don't get that either" look on my face was a big part of the reason he didn't pursue the topic any further.

Anyway, however you want to approach it, remember, you're in control and don't give that control up.

[Hagoth]

Something that has worked so far for me is to say something like, "I'm at a place with the church where I no longer ______(e.g. accept callings) but thanks for thinking about me." It lets them know that you won't do what they want and that you have a reason that goes beyond laziness or a busy schedule without requiring you to get into a debate about Satan and stuff. And it shows an attitude that is not the expected apostate bitterness. This has worked for getting me out of callings, prayers, HPG attendance, PPI, and home teaching partner/family reassignments. And they don't call back the next time the same thing comes up because they know you aren't playing the game anymore.

I do have one funny story about this (I know I repeat myself a lot, but there are always new people coming aboard). A bishopric member showed up at my house unannounced and extended me a calling. I used the line above with the addition of "as far as I'm concerned, sitting next to my wife (she was present) in sacrament meeting is my only calling." He left with a look of panic on his face and about 20 minutes later I got a call from the Exec. Sec. telling me that the bishop wanted to see me right now in his office. I decided to go out of curiosity, expecting this to be my official coming out. The bishop chit-chatted with me for a few minutes and then asked, "so, what did you need to see me about?" I said, "wait, didn't you ask to see me?" We both went away confused. I later realized that the counselor must have beelined it straight to the ES and set up an appointment with the expectation that I would be blurting out a confession or something. Odd that he never said anything to the bishop.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that it's ok to leave them bewildered. They're going to make assumptions about your one way or another. Right now I'm focusing on being the pleasant non-believer that they can't explain away with the standard accusations.

[20/20hind]

If they call you to a job. Say you need to pray, and fast about it.

Then later tell them that you got a distinct answer that you should decline. Just keep doing this.

[Anon70]

No advice but I'm curious so I hope you'll do a follow-up!

[MoPag]

Just go in there and be like:

Churchsupervisor.png

Or get all excited about the calling they offer then start to say all the crazy stuff your going to do. Like "oh I'm so glad you want me to teach *blank* I don't need to use the manual though. I will write my own lessons. I've pulled a lot of my material from Waterman and Snuffer. They have great stuff. Have you read them?" Or "oh wow! I'm so excited to do scouts. I've always envisioned a troop that is really more like a choir where the boys sing mashups of Janice Kapp Perry and Michael McLean songs." Or, "Wow I can't wait to tell my friends at *insert either Mormons for Equality or Ordain Women* about this calling you've offered me. I'm am so honored to use this calling as a way to further *insert LGBT or Feminist* awareness to the humble people in our ward."

Good luck Oliver_denom. Go kick some a$$!

[trophywife26.2]

If they call you to a job. Say you need to pray, and fast about it.

Then later tell them that you got a distinct answer that you should decline. Just keep doing this.

This. 100. If you want to stay under the radar.

[PalmSprings]

My tactic at first was just to say, I can't meet with you. If they responded back, my response was "Please refer to my 1st email, TY." Then on the 3rd try I said please call my secretary to set up an appointment at (gave them a number to a Chinese take out place.) After that it was delete, block and ignore. No way I was going to waste me time on seeing them in person. IMO if they don't get it, too bad for them.

[oliver_denom]

I'll put this here in case it helps anyone else.

I want to preface this by pointing out the things that benefited the situation:
1) They guy interviewing me was not only a complete stranger, but had only just moved here. It's his first time in a bishopric so probably doesn't have a lot of experience. This made it a lot easier on my part.
2) There was no prior indication that I would say no, so this was a complete surprise.

So after some back and forth trying to find a place and time to meet, we finally met at the church when the building was completely empty. After shaking hands we engaged in probably ten to fifteen minutes of small talk where I asked about his background and how he liked it here, his new job, kids, etc. I told him the same sorts of things including where I served my mission and all that. He's a friendly guy.

When he got around to the business at hand, he became very solemn and began to describe the weight and seriousness of what it means to be in a bishopric, and how much they had struggled and prayed over each and every calling. What he probably didn't know is that I've been in hundreds of those meetings and know for a fact that this is complete bullshit, but I just solemnly nodded along anyway. Then, before he even told me what the calling was, he thanked me for being willing to serve the Lord. I thought, "don't thank me yet", but let him go on. At that point, I swear to god, he took a deep breath, looked down at his shoes, then quickly back up into my eyes with this strained expression and said, "Brother Oliver, the Lord has called you to be XXXXXX". I'm not going to mention the calling, but let's just say it's appropriate for someone who won't renew their recommend and whose family is inactive.

Being caught up in the moment, and almost instinctively copying his mannerism but not in a disrespectful way, I also took a deep breath, looked down at my shoes, raised my eyes, looking directly into his and said "It's because that I appreciate all the work that you've done, that I'm sorry to say I respectfully decline." Then we just sort of stared at each other for a moment. He didn't see it coming, I was waiting for him to speak, and there was just silence.

So I spoke again, "I need to decline at this time." Then I waited and rephrased, "I need to turn this down."

The man was absolutely dumbfounded. Then, out of nowhere he sort of opened his arms, leans back in his chair, folds his arms again, leans forward and asks, "Is there something you need to tell me?", half accusing, half confused. I responded, "Nope. I'm good.", then more silence. Then he said, "Well, I don't know what we're going to do because we don't have anyone to fill this calling over the next two weeks. Can you substitute?" Knowing this "can you fill in trick" from past experience, I again told him no. Then he said, "You know we're not a big ward. It's hard enough as it is to fill these positions." I responded by saying, "You just received a bunch of new families in a realignment, you'll be fine." He said, "All that means is that everyone will have two callings instead of three." I calmly told him, "It will be okay. You don't have to staff every conceivable opening, the handbook allows flexibility."

At this point he was just asking why, so I told him, "It's just a decision that my wife and I made together, that I need to have more flexibility and spend more time with my family." Then I got up to shake his hand and leave. He sort of followed me out in the hall looking confused, walked in and out of a room, then mumbled something about having to check on a thing in the chapel, then he sort of ran off down the hall.

That was that. I got one follow up text asking again to substitute. I gave him some suggestions for taking care of this non-essential calling, literally, without using anyone at all, and I haven't heard back.

At this point, I think my absolute best strategy is to accept meetings in person and then make the experience as awkward and uncomfortable as possible.

[Anon70]

I'll put this here in case it helps anyone else.

I want to preface this by pointing out the things that benefited the situation:
1) They guy interviewing me was not only a complete stranger, but had only just moved here. It's his first time in a bishopric so probably doesn't have a lot of experience. This made it a lot easier on my part.
2) There was no prior indication that I would say no, so this was a complete surprise.

So after some back and forth trying to find a place and time to meet, we finally met at the church when the building was completely empty. After shaking hands we engaged in probably ten to fifteen minutes of small talk where I asked about his background and how he liked it here, his new job, kids, etc. I told him the same sorts of things including where I served my mission and all that. He's a friendly guy.

When he got around to the business at hand, he became very solemn and began to describe the weight and seriousness of what it means to be in a bishopric, and how much they had struggled and prayed over each and every calling. What he probably didn't know is that I've been in hundreds of those meetings and know for a fact that this is complete bullshit, but I just solemnly nodded along anyway. Then, before he even told me what the calling was, he thanked me for being willing to serve the Lord. I thought, "don't thank me yet", but let him go on. At that point, I swear to god, he took a deep breath, looked down at his shoes, then quickly back up into my eyes with this strained expression and said, "Brother Oliver, the Lord has called you to be XXXXXX". I'm not going to mention the calling, but let's just say it's appropriate for someone who won't renew their recommend and whose family is inactive.

Being caught up in the moment, and almost instinctively copying his mannerism but not in a disrespectful way, I also took a deep breath, looked down at my shoes, raised my eyes, looking directly into his and said "It's because that I appreciate all the work that you've done, that I'm sorry to say I respectfully decline." Then we just sort of stared at each other for a moment. He didn't see it coming, I was waiting for him to speak, and there was just silence.

So I spoke again, "I need to decline at this time." Then I waited and rephrased, "I need to turn this down."

The man was absolutely dumbfounded. Then, out of nowhere he sort of opened his arms, leans back in his chair, folds his arms again, leans forward and asks, "Is there something you need to tell me?", half accusing, half confused. I responded, "Nope. I'm good.", then more silence. Then he said, "Well, I don't know what we're going to do because we don't have anyone to fill this calling over the next two weeks. Can you substitute?" Knowing this "can you fill in trick" from past experience, I again told him no. Then he said, "You know we're not a big ward. It's hard enough as it is to fill these positions." I responded by saying, "You just received a bunch of new families in a realignment, you'll be fine." He said, "All that means is that everyone will have two callings instead of three." I calmly told him, "It will be okay. You don't have to staff every conceivable opening, the handbook allows flexibility."

At this point he was just asking why, so I told him, "It's just a decision that my wife and I made together, that I need to have more flexibility and spend more time with my family." Then I got up to shake his hand and leave. He sort of followed me out in the hall looking confused, walked in and out of a room, then mumbled something about having to check on a thing in the chapel, then he sort of ran off down the hall.

That was that. I got one follow up text asking again to substitute. I gave him some suggestions for taking care of this non-essential calling, literally, without using anyone at all, and I haven't heard back.

At this point, I think my absolute best strategy is to accept meetings in person and then make the experience as awkward and uncomfortable as possible.

That was so awesome! You're my hero! I just said yes to a 3rd calling . And I'm a total non-believer!

[wtfluff]

The man was absolutely dumbfounded. Then, out of nowhere he sort of opened his arms, leans back in his chair, folds his arms again, leans forward and asks, "Is there something you need to tell me?", half accusing, half confused. I responded, "Nope. I'm good.", then more silence.

Ha! So incredibly classic!

[Emower]

That was awesome.

[MoPag]

Way to go Oliver_denom! You totally kicked A$$!