Responsibility

This is for encouragement, ideas, and support for people going through a faith transition no matter where you hope to end up. This is also the place to laugh, cry, and love together.
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Brent
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Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2016 9:39 am

Responsibility

Post by Brent » Tue Jul 17, 2018 8:35 am

Had a 30 year old, returned missionary, who "couldn't find the right girl" commit suicide because of "clinical depression". Sweet kid, not a mean or cruel bone in his body. Was in my YM when I was YMP, attended high school where I was teaching. Trying to process the situation and the code-words and just sad.

I struggle with blame. I'd love to blame the church but it's just a thing, sheet rock and bricks; it cannot feel shame or guilt. Responsibility (blame?) needs a human face because institutions are amoeba, just things that chug along and can't realize they've done wrong. I'm coming to a place where I need to find a brain to blame. A brain SHOULD understand its responsibility and feel remorse and potentially change its behavior. An amoeba bumps into and goes around. Brains should be able to process action and consequence.

There are those who claim Jesus is at the wheel. I'll offer he's not the brains of the outfit and isn't the right one to blame...

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Corsair
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Location: Phoenix

Re: Responsibility

Post by Corsair » Tue Jul 17, 2018 9:52 am

This is an awful situation. I can hear the harried apologetic response like they were suddenly caught off guard by this unfortunate death. "Correlation does not imply causation! Maybe it was the altitude! The church is perfect but the members are not! He was clinically depressed and it's so sad that no one caught it!"

Deep down under all of their excuses and apologia is a single, thin explanation. Expectations were misplaced within this organization that claims it speaks for God. The LDS prophet speaks for God, but don't expect ultimate answers from Him. The prophet is the watchman on the tower, but don't expect him to see everything. The LDS church has the divine keys of the priesthood, but we cannot expect the priesthood to be a reliable power to change measureable outcomes.

I'm so sorry for you. I expect to feel some deep sadness when I see the young men in my ward experience some ultimate traged in the future.

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Red Ryder
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Re: Responsibility

Post by Red Ryder » Tue Jul 17, 2018 11:07 am

Sorry for your loss. Suicide is an extremely difficult thing to process for everyone involved.

Is it reasonable to blame his brain? His brain didn't stay in "self preservation" mode or maybe switched off that mode for a second too long?
Those who do not move do not notice their chains. —Rosa Luxemburg

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Brent
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Re: Responsibility

Post by Brent » Tue Jul 17, 2018 12:33 pm

Red Ryder wrote:
Tue Jul 17, 2018 11:07 am
Sorry for your loss. Suicide is an extremely difficult thing to process for everyone involved.

Is it reasonable to blame his brain? His brain didn't stay in "self preservation" mode or maybe switched off that mode for a second too long?
I think it's clear that his thought processes were impaired. He was also being crushed into a box and was probably unable to find a means to keep wedging himself in. Grandfather was a patriarch, Uncles all bishops or high councilmen, GAs in the family tree...

The brain I consider as lucid and rational and most likely at fault is Russell M Nelson. In a simple sentence he could release all that pressure by making the box bigger so kids like this have room to breathe.

Make the box bigger.

Reuben
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Joined: Sat Oct 28, 2017 3:01 pm

Re: Responsibility

Post by Reuben » Tue Jul 17, 2018 1:12 pm

Brent wrote:
Tue Jul 17, 2018 12:33 pm
Red Ryder wrote:
Tue Jul 17, 2018 11:07 am
Sorry for your loss. Suicide is an extremely difficult thing to process for everyone involved.

Is it reasonable to blame his brain? His brain didn't stay in "self preservation" mode or maybe switched off that mode for a second too long?
I think it's clear that his thought processes were impaired. He was also being crushed into a box and was probably unable to find a means to keep wedging himself in. Grandfather was a patriarch, Uncles all bishops or high councilmen, GAs in the family tree...

The brain I consider as lucid and rational and most likely at fault is Russell M Nelson. In a simple sentence he could release all that pressure by making the box bigger so kids like this have room to breathe.

Make the box bigger.
Is he in a box that doesn't allow him to make the box bigger?

This is where I always get hung up when apportioning blame.
Not all those who wander are lost.

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Brent
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Re: Responsibility

Post by Brent » Tue Jul 17, 2018 2:23 pm

The LDS church puts a premium on:

Image

I believe that my young friend isn't going to face this sort of thing on the other side. Rather he'll be embraced, loved and accepted for who he is instead of swirling down in a swamp of self-shame that ended with an not unexpected outcome.

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achilles
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Re: Responsibility

Post by achilles » Tue Jul 17, 2018 4:36 pm

When I turned 30, I thought my life was over. It really felt like dying. Aging out of the single adult ward. Basically getting kicked out. I was deeply depressed for over a year. There are structural reasons for unmarried 30-31 year olds feeling like a failure in the Church.
“For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.”

― Carl Sagan

"The cave you fear to enter holds the treasure you seek."

-Joseph Campbell

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