Fascinating Conversation with my Wife

This is for encouragement, ideas, and support for people going through a faith transition no matter where you hope to end up. This is also the place to laugh, cry, and love together.
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hiding in plain sight
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Fascinating Conversation with my Wife

Post by hiding in plain sight » Mon Sep 17, 2018 7:04 am

My wife and I were hiking early on Saturday morning and the topic of our family and religion came up.

And just to remind everyone, I am almost 9 years into the journey and now 9 of 12 of the HIPS family are out. That includes the daughter and son in law and 3 grandkids.

Here are the highlights from my wife. Who happens to be serving as RSP currently.

1) Loving to be to with your family here and now is the most important thing that matters. People who do the "no empty chairs in heaven" speeches at family reunions are just pushing their families away from them.

2) She likes the church experience. It works for her. But she totally gets that for many people, church is like listening to fingernails on a chalk board. I then piped up that part of what I needed was to be able to step away once in a while to keep the church experience working for me when I am there. And she was totally supportive.

3) She feels the church leadership is trying. But she totally gets that what is taught in sunday school is so simplified and forcing the faithful narrative that it is NOT true. The church has created its own problem with people losing their testimonies because they set a foundation of teachings and assumptions in sunday school that are NOT supported by the historical narrative.

4) She continues to be a believer, but doesn't take most of the truth claims as literal. For example, needing to give the signs and tokens received in the temple to get into heaven, DESPITE that is exactly what you are taught in the temple.

5) She acknowledged that many of the people who believed the most and took their faith the most literally are the ones leaving the church. And that the stereotype that the church leaders and members try to push of it is only those who are lazy or weren't in the bed far enough who fell out.

All in all a great hike with my wife.

We were definitely not having these conversations 6 years ago or even 3 years ago.

Happy Monday!

Wonderment
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Re: Fascinating Conversation with my Wife

Post by Wonderment » Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:35 pm

Happy Monday to you.......... sounds like a very productive conversation. Sometimes being out in nature, with the beautiful scenery, is so calming and edifying, that the surroundings contribute to a very useful exchange of ideas. :) - Wndr.

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Mormorrisey
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Re: Fascinating Conversation with my Wife

Post by Mormorrisey » Mon Sep 17, 2018 7:32 pm

Love reading stories like this, it gives me a lot of hope. Especially when you mention how incremental this progress was - I see similar signs in Sis. M that she's thawing from her strict TBMness, and even the kids have noticed. The marriage/family is the number one priority, it's great to see that you're both on the same page with that. That's great!
"And I don't need you...or, your homespun philosophies."
"And when you try to break my spirit, it won't work, because there's nothing left to break."

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slk
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Re: Fascinating Conversation with my Wife

Post by slk » Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:09 pm

You have a great family HIPS. I'm happy that your wife is putting you first. My wife still thinks it's all true because once in a while she'll hear a tear jerker story from a TBM so it must be true, right? Although my DW stll believes, lately she'd rather sleep in on second Saturday and even remind us not to move around or make noise on Fast Sunday and ignore the knock on the door. I LOVE HER!

Just jealous your wife goes hiking with you.

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MalcolmVillager
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Re: Fascinating Conversation with my Wife

Post by MalcolmVillager » Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:17 pm

Congrats. A milestone for sure. I get her approach. As a privileged person in every way I have taken that approach. I recognize that many dont have the same privilege and cannot make it work. I would prefer to make a change. I hope to do that once DW is completely on the same page. We are getting there.

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hiding in plain sight
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Re: Fascinating Conversation with my Wife

Post by hiding in plain sight » Tue Sep 18, 2018 7:18 am

slk wrote:
Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:09 pm
You have a great family HIPS. I'm happy that your wife is putting you first. My wife still thinks it's all true because once in a while she'll hear a tear jerker story from a TBM so it must be true, right? Although my DW stll believes, lately she'd rather sleep in on second Saturday and even remind us not to move around or make noise on Fast Sunday and ignore the knock on the door. I LOVE HER!

Just jealous your wife goes hiking with you.
It sounds like there is great progress in your marriage.

Even though my wife is a believer as well (i.e., thinks that God works through the church and ordinances are important). She recognizes that other peoples beliefs that their ordinances in their church are important too. And also if someone doesn't believe in ordinances are needed at all, they will be okay as well.

Congrats on your second saturdays and not paying fast offerings. :-)

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hiding in plain sight
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Re: Fascinating Conversation with my Wife

Post by hiding in plain sight » Tue Sep 18, 2018 7:19 am

MalcolmVillager wrote:
Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:17 pm
Congrats. A milestone for sure. I get her approach. As a privileged person in every way I have taken that approach. I recognize that many dont have the same privilege and cannot make it work. I would prefer to make a change. I hope to do that once DW is completely on the same page. We are getting there.
I have always told my wife that I choose her first. If she wants to be in the church I will stay because I want to be with her.

These comments have usually come after a heart felt question on her part if I am planning to leave like 3 of my 4 kids have.

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Hagoth
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Re: Fascinating Conversation with my Wife

Post by Hagoth » Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:10 am

Great stuff, HIPS. It sounds like your wife and mine are moving in similar directions, except that Mrs. Hagoth has reached a point where she wouldn't consider a calling like RSP. Sam Young and the Joseph Bishop situation have really opened her eyes to the fact that the church is a corporation that puts self-protection above the needs of people. Has any of these current events had an effect on Mrs. HIPS?
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain

Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."

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hiding in plain sight
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Re: Fascinating Conversation with my Wife

Post by hiding in plain sight » Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:26 am

Hagoth wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:10 am
Great stuff, HIPS. It sounds like your wife and mine are moving in similar directions, except that Mrs. Hagoth has reached a point where she wouldn't consider a calling like RSP. Sam Young and the Joseph Bishop situation have really opened her eyes to the fact that the church is a corporation that puts self-protection above the needs of people. Has any of these current events had an effect on Mrs. HIPS?
I am not sure if it has had an effect. But it has definitely been an opportunity to have conversations.

Mrs. HIPS is quite a liberal and metaphorical believer it turns out.

On the conversation regarding Sam Young and inappropriate sexual questions by bishops she said things like this:

"I don't think it is appropriate to confess anything of that nature to your bishop."

"I don't think anyone should be talking to their bishop about masturbation and its no big deal anyway."

"I can see why people are up in arms about this. I just wish it didn't make the church look so bad."

Slowly but surely. But clearly she is far, far down the road compared to where I thought she was.

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MalcolmVillager
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Re: Fascinating Conversation with my Wife

Post by MalcolmVillager » Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:34 pm

hiding in plain sight wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 7:19 am
MalcolmVillager wrote:
Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:17 pm
Congrats. A milestone for sure. I get her approach. As a privileged person in every way I have taken that approach. I recognize that many dont have the same privilege and cannot make it work. I would prefer to make a change. I hope to do that once DW is completely on the same page. We are getting there.
I have always told my wife that I choose her first. If she wants to be in the church I will stay because I want to be with her.

These comments have usually come after a heart felt question on her part if I am planning to leave like 3 of my 4 kids have.
Spoken like Eddie Lane on The Path. DW and I are sitting here watching season 2 right now. 2 years ago she flipped out after one episode asking me if I think the cojcolds is a cult. Now she recommends that we watch it every night.

Anon70
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Re: Fascinating Conversation with my Wife

Post by Anon70 » Wed Sep 19, 2018 12:28 am

It’s been interesting here with TBM DH. He’s listened to me about McKenna, Sam, Kirby and now the gunshot at church. And instead of his usual knee-jerk defenses of the church he’s been dismayed and upset. He then encouraged our DD to go on a mission *sigh*. But I hope that we’re making progress on being open to these conversations and to less blind belief/obedience.

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