I think my beliefs are shifting again

[Red Ryder]

December is the month I lost my faith in Mormonism nearly 14 years ago. It's been a long tedious faith journey with super highs and super lows. Over the years I've relied on the simple idea that I can own my own beliefs and change my mind at will. I decided this was my stance because I determined that all religions were recipes created by humankind to fill some sort of internal raw desire to belong to the universe. Religion was born out of innate desires to live beyond the scope of our immediate existence and propped up by men who saw this need and exploited it for power, money, and ego.

Fear is the greatest tool in the "God toolbox", that's the reason all Church's created the idea of hell. Mormonism is no different than any of the other religions of the world. The only difference is the level of surety they claim as truth. They know. I used to know. Then I found out there's a whole bunch of stuff I didn't know that shaded what I testified I knew. Then suddenly I didn't know and life became complicated.

As my religious snow globe of beliefs was shaken, suddenly things became beautiful in the sense that I could own my thoughts, think for myself, and relish in the silence of unbelief why I rebuilt my world view. I quickly saw people in need like the beggar on the corner of the freeway entrance. I gave $5 here and $5 there. It felt good. I quickly accepted gay marriage admitting that I couldn't pin point the exact moment I chose to be heterosexual, therefore gay people were more than likely born that way. Who was I to judge? I strived to find normalcy. Experimented with a few banned beverages, unauthorized underwear patterns of my choice, and dabbled in that new age feel good universalism stuff.

Perhaps I've matured or the universe has exposed the patterns of human nature. I don't know. Now I just see humans all trying to survive. Some on the backs of themselves. Others on the backs of defrauding everyone. My new reality is that the world is just an overall shitty place if you focus on it as that. It's also a beautiful place if you have enough extra money to pay your bills, go to the beach on occasion, and are surrounded by good friends, family, and food.

My new mantra is "life just is". I've found peace and don't need to rebuild belief in anything or try to figure out the mysteries of the universe.
I'm simply going to be happy today and hope my eyes open tomorrow when the alarm clock goes off. I don't simply care anymore if I live in some form of next life or not. I'll worry about that when the time comes.

Life just is!

[RubinHighlander]

Awesome! Lines up nearly perfectly with where I've come to as well.

One exception is that I'm very interested in the mysteries of the universe and now spend time trying to understand current scientific theories and discoveries across the sciences. I don't mind my tax dollars going toward NASA and other research to seek out and solve those mysteries. However, my interest in those topics does not decrease my joy in life or cause me any anxiety. I enjoy the continuous path of discovery. I am more in awe and gratitude of the universe and life on this planet, past and present, than every before. I feel free an unjaded from all the religious BS. I see the shitty religions and politics as artifacts of our tribalism, which may be a foundational contributor to homo sapien success, but now burdens us with unnecessary bias, and could result in our ultimate demise.

My attitude toward most decent humans is compassionate, not so good toward those humans that are dbags. I don't feel obligated to love all of them anymore, there are many humans the planet would be better off without, but it's not my place to sort them out. It is my obligation to raise the progeny I created in a way that would better humanity, so far so good.

If silicon based artificial intelligence takes over and ultimately removes humans from the equation in order to save the planet, I'd be okay with that and see it as another step in evolution.

I'm 95% atheist, but can't rule out that the big bang could have been kicked off by some intelligent power or that we may be in a simulation. There's certainly no white haired old man who is bi-polar, messing with the affairs of humans on this planet, and who only loves less than 1% of his kids enough to grant them access to a magic VIP kingdom of an afterlife.

For me, December is the month I submitted my official resignation from mormon corp, along with my DW and DD. I expect to be in limbo for a while, as quitmormon sorts things out with Kirton/McConkie, but that's okay. I'll be happy to chat with visiting ministers again, should they dare to knock at the door after their last visit.

[slavereeno]

I love these.

I am still in the throes of change and can't speak to where I may settle. However, I will say that, now that I am outside of the mind prison, I enjoy so much more of stuff. Re-watching movies is awesome! I have a whole new perspective and don't have to sit in judgement of myself and others every second. Humor seems more rich, less offensive and guilt free than it was before. Science, philosophy, discovery, literature, art and music are much more enjoyable without being encumbered by the guilt and cognitive dissonance souring everything. Its refreshing, and exhilarating.

Then reality hits when I try to share these feelings anywhere but here. All the guilt and loathing for so much of what's out there comes flooding back in. I led my children into the mind prison, the prison my parents, spouse and siblings are still living in. They are terrified of everything not-Mormon, plagued with anxiety, fear and loathing for themselves and others. Some of them contemplating suicide while outwardly professing to be the happiest people on earth. I am still at the phase where this aspect of the process is agonizing, I am surrounded on all sides by 110% TBMs.

(caveat: DW seems to be shifting a little, so she is probably not in the 110% category like most of the rest)

[wtfluff]

Life just is!

Love it!

Along those same lines, I've tried to embrace the saying: "The purpose of life is: To live it." I've been attempting to live by that by embracing things that were previously out of the question because of the: "I can't, I'm mormon" mantra.

Maybe I'll have to change my mantra to: Life just is! What now?

[jfro18]

This is a great post... and I agree that I take much less offense at things than I used to esp when it comes to religious humor.

It's nice to be able to support gay marriage without feeling like I was somehow disappointing God, and it's been so great wearing normal clothing that doesn't have ritualistic marks on them.

But maybe that's just me.

[MerrieMiss]

Perhaps I've matured or the universe has exposed the patterns of human nature. I don't know. Now I just see humans all trying to survive. Some on the backs of themselves. Others on the backs of defrauding everyone. My new reality is that the world is just an overall shitty place if you focus on it as that. It's also a beautiful place if you have enough extra money to pay your bills, go to the beach on occasion, and are surrounded by good friends, family, and food.

That's interesting. It seems like a lot of people leaving church embrace a "feel good, life is wonderful, people are good" universalist attitude/belief. It's interesting that it didn't last and you've seemed to settle on a more moderate or pragmatic take.

I spent a few years wrestling with belief in god - who was god, was he there? which god was the right one? If there isn't one, why do I like the idea of one? Is life empty or meaningless without god? Not too long ago, upon discovering I'm a non-believer, I was asked what my belief in god was. I replied, "I don't worry about it anymore." I don't think that satisfied them, I'm not sure they believed me. I wouldn't have twenty years ago. But it's true. I don't worry about god anymore. I just feel like I've moved past it (at least for now). These days I always add the caveat when talking about my thoughts/beliefs, "I reserve the right to change my mind and my opinions at any time."

[wtfluff]

"I don't worry about it anymore." I don't think that satisfied them

Next time they ask, tell them you're an apatheist. Maybe a "big, important sounding" word will satisfy them.

[Red Ryder]

"I don't worry about it anymore." I don't think that satisfied them

Next time they ask, tell them you're an apatheist. Maybe a "big, important sounding" word will satisfy them.

That combines the label I've been using; apathetic agnostic.

That's interesting. It seems like a lot of people leaving church embrace a "feel good, life is wonderful, people are good" universalist attitude/belief. It's interesting that it didn't last and you've seemed to settle on a more moderate or pragmatic take.

MerrieMiss, I think the ability to see multiple sides of an issue is a learned response that developed over time for me. I noticed that I would automatically think of the opposite viewpoints I grew up with (in Mormonism) and accept them as my new beliefs. I'll openly admit that gay marriage was one of these pendulum swings for me. I no longer accepted Mormonism, and Mormonism never accepted gay marriage, therefore I (now) accept gay marriage. This was my thought process on a lot of things. Then I would think through things from every angle and come up with reasons for and against and try to understand multiple points of view. This happened as I asked myself if I was just accepting the opposite of my limited faith induced beliefs. I went back and thought about gay marriage. I now see the beauty of same sex relationships as well as the natural and mental problems that also result. I see the same in monogamous hetero relationships as well.

Over time this becomes extremely exhausting much like trying to determine what form of theism, deism, or whatever ism was running through my head. I don't believe it's mentally healthy to analyze every aspect of everything which is probably why our brains latch on to group think, cognitive resonance, and the path of least resistance. It's a survival mechanism to align with a tribe and to stay there. That's why humans develop a need for community.

Over the last year I've begun to de-clutter my life beginning with my head space. I tossed out a lot of stuff that I was thinking about that just didn't really matter. I've begun to do this at home with certain material possessions like the boxes of spare nuts and bolts, screws, and random cardboard boxes in the garage. I've tossed a few toxic ideas surrounding what I perceived as "needed" within certain of my relationships I was holding onto for far too long. In particular I was holding onto the idea that I shouldn't disappoint my parents. I was holding onto the idea that I needed physical affection to validate my marriage. I needed financial means to be happy. I needed this. I needed that. I needed.... Validation? Once you realize that seeking validation through religion, relationships, and material possessions is one giant hamster wheel; it's easy to step off. I would have never figured this out without losing my faith.

In essence, I lost my faith and figured out that the only thing I truly need is oxygen to breath, and just enough food, water, and shelter to not starve or freeze to death. Everything else is gravy. I have found myself and I am zen!

The irony here is that I've replaced "knowing my life path" via the religion of my birth with "I don't know anything" and have found peace with it. It's an individual process and yet like this great secret the universe tries to tell you; but you can't listen or hear because you're too busy trying to figure it all out.

[Stig]

December is the month I lost my faith in Mormonism nearly 14 years ago. It's been a long tedious faith journey with super highs and super lows. Over the years I've relied on the simple idea that I can own my own beliefs and change my mind at will. I decided this was my stance because I determined that all religions were recipes created by humankind to fill some sort of internal raw desire to belong to the universe. Religion was born out of innate desires to live beyond the scope of our immediate existence and propped up by men who saw this need and exploited it for power, money, and ego.

Fear is the greatest tool in the "God toolbox", that's the reason all Church's created the idea of hell. Mormonism is no different than any of the other religions of the world. The only difference is the level of surety they claim as truth. They know. I used to know. Then I found out there's a whole bunch of stuff I didn't know that shaded what I testified I knew. Then suddenly I didn't know and life became complicated.

As my religious snow globe of beliefs was shaken, suddenly things became beautiful in the sense that I could own my thoughts, think for myself, and relish in the silence of unbelief why I rebuilt my world view. I quickly saw people in need like the beggar on the corner of the freeway entrance. I gave $5 here and $5 there. It felt good. I quickly accepted gay marriage admitting that I couldn't pin point the exact moment I chose to be heterosexual, therefore gay people were more than likely born that way. Who was I to judge? I strived to find normalcy. Experimented with a few banned beverages, unauthorized underwear patterns of my choice, and dabbled in that new age feel good universalism stuff.

Perhaps I've matured or the universe has exposed the patterns of human nature. I don't know. Now I just see humans all trying to survive. Some on the backs of themselves. Others on the backs of defrauding everyone. My new reality is that the world is just an overall shitty place if you focus on it as that. It's also a beautiful place if you have enough extra money to pay your bills, go to the beach on occasion, and are surrounded by good friends, family, and food.

My new mantra is "life just is". I've found peace and don't need to rebuild belief in anything or try to figure out the mysteries of the universe.
I'm simply going to be happy today and hope my eyes open tomorrow when the alarm clock goes off. I don't simply care anymore if I live in some form of next life or not. I'll worry about that when the time comes.

Life just is!

This seems like a very healthy point to reach in your journey. I hope I can find that someday, too.

[MalcolmVillager]

I love this group. That is all. MoStories isnt the same. My other FB groups are nothing like NOM. I suppose my increased apathy on the FB groups could lead me to more conversations here. I am just not patient enough to type on my phone. RR you are so eloquent which means you are either really patient, or you are at a desktop.

Anyway, I love your thoughts here.

I listened to the Infants OT podcast today about the meaning of life (not really exactly on that topic). I love those guys. I realized clearly that I dont believe life has purpose outside of perpetuating itself. The creator, simulation, serendipity from big bang models all imply different purpose (or lack thereof).

Mormonism used to tell me there was purpose, that someone cared, and that there were consequences (eternal and commensurate to action or even thought). I dont think there is any interventionalist super power, regardless of the model. Maybe there was an intelligent creator to the simulation or that initiated the big bang. I just do not see evidence that anything besides luck, statistics, and confirmation bias have any impact on anything.

Cancer goes into remission, cars nearly miss pedestrians, people miraculously recover from fatal injuries/infections.

So what? Sp what now? Be happy! Live a good life! Help others do the same where possible.

It can spiral to nihilism but it doesnt have to.

[IT_Veteran]

I was starting to think I was alone in not concerning myself with what happens next. Nice to know it’s not just me.

Eat, drink, and be merry and all that.

[Just This Guy]

One of the thing I find in like is that it is what you make out of it. You personal mind set is the biggest factor in how happy you are. Life may suck at times, but in the end, there is only one person who can control your outlook on life and that is the person in the mirror.

I find that religion is a tool to help with your mind set. A good religion can help improve your self or degrade yourself, based on what you let it do. It is also the the only way of doing the same thing. Other tools can accomplish the same job.Religion is like using a flat head screwdriver in a Phillips head screw. Yes, it can be made to work to do what you need to do and you could get away with just having that being the only thing in your toolbox, but there are better tools out there to accomplish the same task if you look at your options.

It means your future hasn't been written yet, no one's has. Your future is whatever you make it, so make it a good one. Both of you!
-Doc Brown, Back to the Future, Part III

[Corsair]

My new mantra is "life just is". I've found peace and don't need to rebuild belief in anything or try to figure out the mysteries of the universe.
I'm simply going to be happy today and hope my eyes open tomorrow when the alarm clock goes off. I don't simply care anymore if I live in some form of next life or not. I'll worry about that when the time comes.

That's a good place to be. It would be pleasant if there was a class at church to discuss ideas like this. There never will be, so NOM will have to do.

[Brent]

"So it goes." Vonnegut

[Random]

RR and Reuben, thanks for sharing your thoughts.


I have come to the point that whatever we believe is a choice, and I choose to believe certain things that others do not (including many on this site, and you have all been kind and respectful of our differences; I very much appreciate that). I am exploring life to see what is really possible with the power of my belief (or faith). I want to push the limits to see if there is any truth in "woo woo" stuff, and I have learned that belief in God and belief in what the Gods are or aren't is totally between myself and them. I feel so free not being tied to any authority figure.