BYU and Higher Education Rule Changes - Freedom to Discriminate?

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Not Buying It
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BYU and Higher Education Rule Changes - Freedom to Discriminate?

Post by Not Buying It » Wed Feb 06, 2019 10:26 am

The Trump Administration is currently proposing some fairly extensive rule changes that will have a major impact on higher education. Among these changes are new additional protections for religious institutions from accreditation requirements that conflict with their religious mission, such that an accrediting organization can't "deny preaccreditation or accreditation, or take action against an institution or program, due to a compliance gap that is the result of an institution's adherence to its religious mission in any of its policies and practices" (see https://www.politico.com/newsletters/mo ... les-470996).

These proposed changes are currently under review by the "2019 Committee on Accreditation and Innovation - Department of Education Negotiated Rulemaking Session". It is composed of representatives of various stakeholder groups, I am acquainted with someone who serves on that committee. That person shared with me the list of other representatives, and the representative for faith-based higher education institutions is from BYU.

That made my blood run cold. Look at the proposed new language - BYU (and other faith based institutions like it) wants to be able to limit the academic freedom of professors who "sow doubt", and wants to be able to discriminate against the LGBT community without any repercussions from accrediting agencies. That is what the proposed language is all about.

Faculty and students at BYU have precious little protection from the religious zealots who run the place. Those protections are about to get a lot smaller.
"The truth is elegantly simple. The lie needs complex apologia. 4 simple words: Joe made it up. It answers everything with the perfect simplicity of Occam's Razor. Every convoluted excuse withers." - Some guy on Reddit called disposazelph

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alas
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Re: BYU and Higher Education Rule Changes - Freedom to Discriminate?

Post by alas » Wed Feb 06, 2019 11:05 am

Sounds like they will no longer be required to teach evolution in order to be accredited to teach science. Yikes for the whole country.

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Re: BYU and Higher Education Rule Changes - Freedom to Discriminate?

Post by hiding in plain sight » Wed Feb 06, 2019 12:48 pm

Not Buying It wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 10:26 am


Faculty and students at BYU have precious little protection from the religious zealots who run the place. Those protections are about to get a lot smaller.
This.

Even now there is no/limited religious freedom protections at BYU. If you choose to be mormon one day or even baptist, you are good to go and attend BYU. But if you change your mind and exercise your religious freedom to believe how you want to believe and convert from mormonism to being a baptist you get kicked out. Even if you are willing to live the rules like a baptist would. It is just you no longer believe in mormonism.

How is that fair again?

How is that moral again?

How is that a defender of religious freedom again?

Reuben
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Re: BYU and Higher Education Rule Changes - Freedom to Discriminate?

Post by Reuben » Wed Feb 06, 2019 12:53 pm

alas wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 11:05 am
Sounds like they will no longer be required to teach evolution in order to be accredited to teach science. Yikes for the whole country.
Accrediting insitutions for biological sciences (and many others) will fight this tooth and nail, as they should. You can't be any kind of biologist without studying evolution, period.

The thing that worries me most is losing an avenue to push for LGBT rights.
You were born to trust, not fear. It is your birthright.

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Re: BYU and Higher Education Rule Changes - Freedom to Discriminate?

Post by Not Buying It » Wed Feb 06, 2019 1:10 pm

Reuben wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 12:53 pm
alas wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 11:05 am
Sounds like they will no longer be required to teach evolution in order to be accredited to teach science. Yikes for the whole country.
Accrediting insitutions for biological sciences (and many others) will fight this tooth and nail, as they should. You can't be any kind of biologist without studying evolution, period.

The thing that worries me most is losing an avenue to push for LGBT rights.
BYU administration can very easily say they don't care about program accreditation for Biological sciences, or any other department they find troublesome. They could still offer Biology degrees, nothing would stop them, they just wouldn't have an accredited Biology program, which might be a disadvantage in the marketplace for students earning those degrees. Accreditation for the entire institution controls access to federal financial aid dollars, and is a much bigger deal to them than whether a lack of Biology program accreditation affects how employers and transfer institutions look at their graduates' Biology degrees. Honestly, I have no idea whether their Biology department currently has any kind of program accreditation or not, maybe they already don't, or maybe they do, I don't know.

I don't really know if BYU would go after the teaching of evolution, but under the proposed rules that wouldn't impact their institutional accreditation if they did. I think the bigger goal in their minds is being able to persecute the LGBT community without having to answer for it.
"The truth is elegantly simple. The lie needs complex apologia. 4 simple words: Joe made it up. It answers everything with the perfect simplicity of Occam's Razor. Every convoluted excuse withers." - Some guy on Reddit called disposazelph

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alas
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Re: BYU and Higher Education Rule Changes - Freedom to Discriminate?

Post by alas » Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:06 pm

Not Buying It wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 1:10 pm
Reuben wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 12:53 pm
alas wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 11:05 am
Sounds like they will no longer be required to teach evolution in order to be accredited to teach science. Yikes for the whole country.
Accrediting insitutions for biological sciences (and many others) will fight this tooth and nail, as they should. You can't be any kind of biologist without studying evolution, period.

The thing that worries me most is losing an avenue to push for LGBT rights.
BYU administration can very easily say they don't care about program accreditation for Biological sciences, or any other department they find troublesome. They could still offer Biology degrees, nothing would stop them, they just wouldn't have an accredited Biology program, which might be a disadvantage in the marketplace for students earning those degrees. Accreditation for the entire institution controls access to federal financial aid dollars, and is a much bigger deal to them than whether a lack of Biology program accreditation affects how employers and transfer institutions look at their graduates' Biology degrees. Honestly, I have no idea whether their Biology department currently has any kind of program accreditation or not, maybe they already don't, or maybe they do, I don't know.

I don't really know if BYU would go after the teaching of evolution, but under the proposed rules that wouldn't impact their institutional accreditation if they did. I think the bigger goal in their minds is being able to persecute the LGBT community without having to answer for it.
I don’t know that they need new “protections” for their right to discriminate. Already, any one who is gay and married, or gay and sexually active can be kicked out under honor code violation. And they don’t care about celibate gays. Maybe they just want extra protection for their right to be bigots and homophobes. I just worry about the attack on science that this will be used for by other religious institutions.

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Re: BYU and Higher Education Rule Changes - Freedom to Discriminate?

Post by Linked » Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:38 pm

alas wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:06 pm
I don’t know that they need new “protections” for their right to discriminate. Already, any one who is gay and married, or gay and sexually active can be kicked out under honor code violation. And they don’t care about celibate gays. Maybe they just want extra protection for their right to be bigots and homophobes. I just worry about the attack on science that this will be used for by other religious institutions.
I agree, this probably a move to protect their current levels of homophobia and bigotry. BYU has been hurt by their positions with regard to its LGBTQ+ stance and campus rape issues in the media recently. I suspect this is a move to keep the law on their side so they have more options to run things how they want to.
"I would write about life. Every person would be exactly as important as any other. All facts would also be given equal weightiness. Nothing would be left out. Let others bring order to chaos. I would bring chaos to order" - Kurt Vonnegut

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