What do you say to someone who is dying?

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Red Ryder
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What do you say to someone who is dying?

Post by Red Ryder » Mon Apr 01, 2019 5:47 pm

I've got a co-worker who was diagnosed with cancer last year. They were given a decent prognosis considering the circumstances. Slow growing cancer with a 10-12 year life expectancy in similar patients.

As a TBM I would have suggested getting their life and relationships in order. Specifically their relationship with God.

Now?

I suggested that knowing how they were going to die was comforting and that the timing was nice because they still had time to live life! In a weird way I've concluded that the thought of knowing your expiration date is comforting.
Obviously their death could still come at any moment given other unforeseen circumstances.

I guess now that I think it's lights out and only hope for some form of after life, I don't really fear death.

My co-worker thinks I'm crazy for thinking this way. Knowing her prognosis keeps her scared of her death. She tells me my thoughts are silly because I don't have a prognosis like she does.

Maybe she's right. I dunno. It's really weird to change your mind about the afterlife and throw everything you once thought you knew out the window. Yet I'm still finding this weird sense of peace. Perhaps because their isn't a carrot anymore?

What do you think?
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trophywife26.2
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Re: What do you say to someone who is dying?

Post by trophywife26.2 » Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:23 pm

I was always more afraid of the stick than motivated in going after the carrot. I have more peace about MY death now that I am an atheist. Other people's deaths are more unsettling now, but mine I am no longer afraid for my own death, except maybe if I die in a painful way. When it's over, it's over and I won't even know it that I'm dead, if I'm right. It's the people left behind who will have to process it all and suffer.

It would be hard to have a specific amount of time left to live though I think... e.g. 10-12 years. I think that would give me anxiety. I would feel like I had to really carpe diem and make every minute count and even though we should all do that anyway and live our best life each day, the truth is over a lifetime and even just over a decade there will be dull days of monotony. Knowing I only had 10 years would make me feel very stressed about any "wasted" time.

Love and good thoughts to your friend/coworker.
Even if it's something disappointing, it's still better to know the truth. Because people can deal with disappointment. And once they've done that, they can feel that they have really grown. And that can be such a good feeling. -Fred Rogers

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Raylan Givens
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Re: What do you say to someone who is dying?

Post by Raylan Givens » Mon Apr 01, 2019 8:00 pm

trophywife26.2 wrote:
Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:23 pm
It would be hard to have a specific amount of time left to live though I think... e.g. 10-12 years. I think that would give me anxiety. I would feel like I had to really carpe diem and make every minute count and even though we should all do that anyway and live our best life each day, the truth is over a lifetime and even just over a decade there will be dull days of monotony. Knowing I only had 10 years would make me feel very stressed about any "wasted" time.

Love and good thoughts to your friend/coworker.
What a tough situation. I think I would feel the same way. Make it all count and wear myself out physically and emotionally trying to fit it all it.

During my dad's last two years (brain cancer). He just kept working, until six weeks before his death and did his normal stuff. With one nice long trip with my mom. He felt okay about it, he said "I did what I wanted to, I am a simple guy."

In addition, I would worry me is the milestones I would miss for my family (depending on age).


I would tell them, that I support them and that this is very hard and hard for me to grasp the complexity of it. That I will value my time with them.
"Ah, you know, I think you use the Bible to do whatever the hell you like" - Raylan Givens

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BriansThoughtMirror
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Re: What do you say to someone who is dying?

Post by BriansThoughtMirror » Tue Apr 02, 2019 8:12 am

This is something I don't like to think about. I guess I'm still in the middle of an existential crisis of sorts, and I still haven't gotten over the loss of eternal life... It makes me really sad to think about the finite nature of human existence. It also makes me really sad that I don't have anything comforting to say in times of loss and tragedy.

I'm really sorry about your coworker, that really sucks hard.
Reflections From Brian's Brain
https://briansthoughtmirror.wordpress.com/

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wtfluff
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Re: What do you say to someone who is dying?

Post by wtfluff » Tue Apr 02, 2019 9:25 am

Interesting.

Doesn't pretty much everyone hit the 10-15 years of life-expectancy at some point? If someone lives until they are ~70 years old, they'll likely not live more than 10-15 years, and we don't really talk about "what to say" at that point, do we?

I guess I'm a lot like you RR: I don't know that I would mind knowing my expiration date. Retirement planning would be a lot easier anyway.

In my current human state, there's nothing I can think of that I want to do for eternity. In fact, living for eternity sounds like hell. (Or maybe my life just sucks...)
Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus

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FiveFingerMnemonic
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Re: What do you say to someone who is dying?

Post by FiveFingerMnemonic » Tue Apr 02, 2019 10:00 am

An older man I know recently pointed out on social media how he had replaced his water heater and realized this will likely be the last time he does that. He'll be dead next time. Kind of a strange way to realize the limits of your mortality through home maintenance tasks.

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deacon blues
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Re: What do you say to someone who is dying?

Post by deacon blues » Tue Apr 02, 2019 10:10 am

I love a line from a pop song by Janis Ian: "And when I die, and when I'm gone, there'll be one child born in this world to carry on." The Human race has many shortcomings, but looking back through the history of Human progress :D gives me great hope for the future.
God is Love. God is Truth. The greatest problem with organized religion is that the organization becomes god, rather than a means of serving God.

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Corsair
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Re: What do you say to someone who is dying?

Post by Corsair » Tue Apr 02, 2019 11:27 am

I have comfortably come to a place of peace with my own death and the death of friends and family. That sounds kind of morbid, but it's a reality to deal with. Obviously, this is colored by the LDS Plan of Salvation, but most of us have little faith in that.

My general approach is is just to kindly be with a person who is dying, in whatever way makes the most sense. Even if you have hope for an after life, that person is going to be gone, and it's going to hurt for a long time. I miss my mother every day. But I am glad that I spent a lot of time with her before she passed. My siblings and father are all believers and we certainly get together to almost recreate the sociality we had with my mother.

I actually enjoy when we are doing an activity with family and can say, "Mom would have loved doing this." It's a triumph that my family is still influenced by her. Will I actually be with her again? I'm not making distinct plans. But I'm not putting off any plans with people who are still here. I can at least count on that.

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Newme
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Re: What do you say to someone who is dying?

Post by Newme » Wed Apr 03, 2019 5:35 pm

Well, all of us who have passed our peak development are gradually inching toward death.

One friend, I told her I’m praying for her and here for her if she needs me (& I flew out to be with her when she was grieving before).

2 other tbm’s I dropped by with flowers and a note.

1 other who’s “inactive” I dropped by a note & book about NDEs.

For people who have hinted about suicide, I’ve explained they’re not alone & who knows - but there’s a good chance they’ll regret it. Suicide’s permanent “solution” to a temporary problem. The one constant is change - hang in there and things will get better - or work to see the blessings and silver lining.

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crazyhamster
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Re: What do you say to someone who is dying?

Post by crazyhamster » Thu Apr 04, 2019 2:20 pm

Other than perhaps, “I’m sorry to hear about your diagnosis, please know that I’m here for you.”, I don’t think it’s really necessary to say more. Let them lead the discussion, and if they want to talk about it, they will. I think if it was me though, I would already have thought about it enough and would love to just discuss normal, everyday things.

I have a friend who was diagnosed with neuroendocrine cancer 6-7 years ago. At the time, the life expectancy was about 5 years on the outside, but with modern treatment he has been almost symptom free most of the time. He is remarkably accepting of the whole thing and has been from the outset, but I always let him talk as much or as little as he wants, other that perhaps and occasional “how are you doing?” Unfortunately, just recently his symptoms (pain) have taken a turn for the worse. I think one has to just take it one day at a time.

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alas
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Re: What do you say to someone who is dying?

Post by alas » Fri Apr 05, 2019 10:39 am

I wrote a reply to this once, but we were in and out of internet connection as we played around in the San Raphael Swell area. My reply got lost when we went out of internet connection. But, I am still quite upset over my brother who is semi conscious, and his wife. As far as I can see, he is just in a very slow drug out death, and his wife is still in Egypt, you know, swimming in de Nile.

The other day she posted that one of the doctors who do rotation at his care facility ask her how she felt about the possibility he was going to wake up. She answered that she is positive he is going to fully recover. He asked why she believed that. Well, because once before he was brain injured, and he woke up, so of course he will this time. She said the doctor gave her a curious look like he thought she had lost touch with reality. Ummm, yeah. (I really hope

So, what do you say to someone whose loved one is dying? And they are in Lala land?

My own death doesn’t scare me at all. Never really has because I guess I have always trusted that *IF* there is a God, and he *IS* a God worth worshipping, not like Zeus, that he will be fair and judge us on what we did with what we were given. He isn’t going to punish the child soldier born in Africa, who is forced at 8 years old to carry a gun and kill people or be killed himself, as guilty of murder, while the rich American real-estate mogal (think tRump) who cheats, steals, lies, fails to ay people who work for him, and says things that inflame people to kill others gets off as not a murderer, or the rich religious leader (think Oaks or Nielsen) who says things that lead teen gay followers to commit suicide gets off as not a murderer. Nope, if God is God, then some people who think they are wonderful are going to be in big trouble and us little folk who apostasise from a crooked church will be judged as using our brain to determine good from evil and then choosing the good.

And if there is no God or after life, then I go back to the same state I was in before I was born. I just don’t exist. I wasn’t suffering when I didn’t exist, so why would I suffer if I go back to not existing. It just doesn’t scare me.

The things that bother me about death are what we go through before, any pain and suffering, and when death didn’t have to happen. I have had two friends who committed murder/suicide. One probably killed her husband in self defense, then killed herself. She was a battered wife and I was her visiting teacher. few people believed her and nobody was willing to help her leave. He was Mr. perfect Peter Priesthood. Those two didn’t have to die, because there SHOULD have been some kind of help and people should have believed her. Another friend committed suicide and took her children with her. That didn’t have to happen, because once again, there should have been help. My nephew committed suicide. My niece died because she could not afford her insulin. It came to a choice between medication for her, or her child and she couldn’t afford both. There should be help for things like that. Our society is so selfish and uncaring that when people get in mental health or medical problems, they don’t tell anyone or reach out for help because they think no one cares. Then they are dead and the people who lived them are shattered. My friend who killed her husband then herself, I still feel guilt because I saw evidence of the abuse, but I was a stupid 24 year old and didn’t know how to help, so I did nothing. Those deaths that didn’t have to happen are what bother me.

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moksha
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Re: What do you say to someone who is dying?

Post by moksha » Fri Apr 05, 2019 11:45 am

Thoughts of existence after death have been fairly universal in Mankind's beliefs throughout history. Even if you do not subscribe to previous beliefs being valid, there is no reason to give up hope for some existence after death. Such thoughts can bring you comfort and provide solace as the time grows near. No need to stare into a blank void when you can hope for something else.
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

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