Are You a Failed Parent?

[Brent]

I remember when my mother and father were struggling with the idea that I was the only active child in the family. I have 3 brothers and that meant that the activity rate of my parent’s children was 25%. 1 in 4. Meanwhile, at Fast and Testimony meetings parents were getting up talking about their children and how proud they were that those kids were still active and in the fold. I never did tell my Mom that often they were talking about kids who I saw regularly at parties drinking and engaging in other illicit activities—but I imagine my Mom knew those parents were at best willfully blind or worse, simple liars. Nowadays the Church is struggling with a Young Single Adult activity rate of about—you guessed it—25%. Mom would always tell me she used a different metric to measure her success: what kind of person are my kids? She worried that we were honest, not a burden to society; that we treated others well. In all honesty her measure was simple: were we good Christian men? We weren’t stealing, or cheating on our taxes or any other kind of thieving and that counted for points in her system.
Most importantly we weren’t lying to her or to ourselves.

If we use LDS metrics to calculate her success then she’s got a goose egg; not one of us is active. 2 of us have formally severed ourselves from the Church. Of her grandchildren there’s a mixed bag; of my 4 kids one is active but appears he is because the ramifications with his spouse of not being “active” are unacceptable. Of my brothers 4 kids it looks like 1 is active and the rest are inactive or “go along to get along” which is to say “culturally active”. Looking at my parent’s legacy you could say that the Church has petered out. Are my parent’s failures? Remember no worldly success can compensate for failure in the home and I guess by LDS cultural standards they failed and failed big.

Or did they?

How should you measure another’s success or failure? How should you measure your own? Unfortunately for Latter-day Saints that measure is often superficial; “My children have all been sealed in the temple” is not a measure of success it is a measure of compliance; as is “All my kids are active” or “all my kids served mission” or “regularly attend the temple” is a metric that means nothing. If your kids are all sealed, active, temple attending heroes but cruel, cheating liars are you successful? I believe my Mom had made her own peace by understanding that measuring success by another’s metric is a mistake. Success is what you decide it is! Don’t use other’s exterior measurements. You know what kid of kid you raised. YOU have insight into their heart, their souls, their motivations and convictions so don’t measure using false outside appearances
.
ANYONE can lie to the Bishop and Stake President and themselves and get into the Temple weekly.

ANYONE can touch the cultural bases and go on a mission without integrity.

ANYONE can sleepwalk through meetings, callings and activities.

ANYONE can be “Active”.

ANYONE can fake it.

But your child isn’t anyone. You know them. Don’t measure them using the wrong yardstick. Trust yourself and your child. You did the best you could and guess what? It was sufficient, it was enough. You turned out OK. They turned out OK. Don’t let culture lie to you. You did the best you could and that’s all that matters.

[Corsair]

My parents achieved achieved several big items on the Mormon bucket list:

1. Larger than average number of children
2. All of the boys went on a mission and completed it successfully
3. All children married in the temple and no divorces
4. A large group of grandchildren

I'm obviously the undercover unbeliever who knows that their victory has a significant flaw. But I keep up appearances and I'm not sure if this is a good or bad thing in the long run. It is emblematic of a larger problem. These LDS parental achievements are all about "outward appearances" which assumes that these will reflect complete conversion and orientation towards eternal life.

They do not. I'm the apostate sitting with mortal sin of "coffee" on my desk among other enjoyable, non-destructive sins. My parents were successful because they produced a family that loves each other, not because all children checked the right boxes for a Mormon lifestyle. Similarly, my four children all love each other, particularly when two of my children are unlikely to ever seriously enter an LDS church building in the future. I have no interest in the judgement of LDS standards in regards to my "success" as a parent.

I don't think that my dear, faithful wife feels the same way. That's the toughest part of all of this. I still attend partially out of respect and deference to her. I don't know how successful she feels at all.

[Just This Guy]

The whole idea of "No success in the world can compensate for failure in the home" is a poisonous one in the church. If your kids don't follow you in the church, then it is your fault. It's the opposite of the 2nd Article of Faith. You will be punished for your children's transgressions.

I can imagine my parents are in a fair amount of hell.

My oldest sibling is transgendered. She left the church two decades ago because of that. She is not resigned as well.
My younger sisters are at best asexual. I wonder if they are really closeted lesbians, but they are the only active church members amungst us kids. They are in their late mid 30's and are both single and not actively dating.
I am completely out as well as DW. None of my kids are interested in the church and I have no intention of encouraging them. My kids are the only grans kids to my parents right now. We really don't expect my younger sisters to ever have kids. As thing are currently going, my parents church family will be dead with my generation. Good riddance.

[wtfluff]

“My children have all been sealed in the temple” is not a measure of success it is a measure of compliance; as is “All my kids are active” or “all my kids served mission” or “regularly attend the temple” is a metric that means nothing.

I LOVE this. I hope my fluffy brain can retain it.

As far as LD$-Inc. compliance is is concerned, my parent's statistics are going downhill. All of us served missions, and 80% married in the temple, BUT, the "temple married" siblings have a 50% divorce rate among the siblings (that 50% re-married in the temple, so does that erase the divorce rate? ) Because of "me" we're now actually sitting at a 40% "inactive" rate, where we were only at 20% "inactive" rate for many years. My parent's grandkids LD$-Inc. compliance success rate "looks" pretty good at this point, but methinks it is going to go downhill in the future. (I'm too lazy to do the actual math.)

As has been mentioned: All of my parent's posterity are successful human beings so far. That's what really counts in "my book."

[2bizE]

If you haven’t read this, please do so. It is by Lindsay Hansen Park called The Myth of the Unrighteousness Parent.

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/yearofpol ... us-parent/

[crossmyheart]

It took a while but my mother has come around. My parents were married over 50 years before my dad passed. But between 5 children: 2 missions, 6 temple marriages, and 4 divorces. One has died but was active at the time of death, and only 2 of the remaining 4 are active. One of the active children is married to a man who has committed multiple sex crimes against young girls and of course they are active temple workers.

When I first went inactive I had to deal with heavy guilt from my mother for my decision. She berated me with verbal self-flagellation of her failure as a parent and tried hard to shame me back into activity. It took years of my refusal to feed into it before she turned a corner and started to see me for my life successes. Occasionally she brings up her mourning of who I used to be, but I end the conversation quickly and she knows I mean business.

Typing this out is more cathartic than anything- but also sharing this as an example that parents can come around...eventually.

[Palerider]

Measuring.

Seems that word comes up a lot in this conversation.

Don't get me wrong. There are behaviors in life that need to be judged (be careful with that word) as to whether they are edifying or destructive to individuals and families. But wasn't this measuring thing the problem that the Savior was trying to correct in the false paradigm of the Pharisees? As if the Law of Moses wasn't enough, the Rabbis had to add all kinds of intricate metrics to it which made it even worse.

Men and women can't help but judge the success or lack thereof of others around them. It's human nature apparently. But the LDS faith makes an obsession of it....and then out of the other side of their mouths they tell us not to be judgmental. Right....

Temple worthy does not a righteous person make. It only keeps the coffers full.

As I understand it, it's God's job to do the measuring. What man can look into another's heart and see what is truly there? I feel badly for those who carry such burdens because of how they perceive others view them.

If we really want to get into the comparison and measuring business, let's compare the righteousness and successful parenting of the Q15 to Heavenly Father's righteousness. I can tell you with absolute assurity that they STINK!

There isn't a person on Earth who's righteousness compares to God's. So why would God set up a kingdom whereby judgement, religious success and measuring by man is the standard culture?

He wouldn't....

[Palerider]

Double post

[DPRoberts]

I certainly felt like a failed parent as a believer. Now I can brag to the NOM, post-mo crowd that I haven't raised a single adult tithe payer. The weight of the failure was crushing as a believer.

I very much worry about how my TBM wife handles the burden. Does she have amazing confirmation bias defenses? Or does her undying magical worldview have her believing we'll all come back? It's my concern for this weight on her that has me wishing she could come along more on my journey. Life has enough real difficulties without the need for those manufactured in the imagination of past and present church leadership.

[hmb]

I am. Society says I am. Mormons definitely say I am. I have a troubled, adult child who made bad decisions and is now in the prison system. I can't tell you how hurtful it is to read shared memes about how all of that kind of trouble is born in the home. Parents fault...PERIOD! Sometimes children make their own poor choices, completely out of the parents control. I remember an older couple in my ward who were raising their grandkids because their son murdered his wife. Wife is dead and son is in prison. Think of the judgement there. So yeah, even though I have a successful kid, I also have one who is locked up. I play the "what if" game, but I don't take the blame for my child's choices.

[2bizE]

A parent who allows children to decide for the selves on church activity has a lot of credibility as far as i see it. A mother who allows her kids to choose and risks social isolation for not having all kids at church is has the best interest of her kids at heart. It is not about conformity, but about allowing kids to think for themselves and make choices.