Forced Turning Point

This is for encouragement, ideas, and support for people going through a faith transition no matter where you hope to end up. This is also the place to laugh, cry, and love together.
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wtfluff
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by wtfluff » Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:09 pm

Red Ryder wrote:
Thu Apr 15, 2021 2:58 pm
Not sure what I’m trying to say other than it sucks all around for everyone. Spouses aren’t happy we stop believing. Mom and dad who sacrificed time and money. We’re not happy at the expense of our authenticity. It just sucks to be a part of Mormonism from any viewpoint.
Dear Ryder of the Red:

I hope that my statement about folks moving to avoid "callings" was not taken as derogatory towards you in any way.

The statement "I can always move to get out of my volunteer position" is just a bit crazy. (At least to my fluffy brain.)


Yes, the bottom line is: MORmONism sucks.
Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus

Keep the company of those who seek the truth - run from those who have found it -Václav Havel

The Beauty of Gray

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Red Ryder
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by Red Ryder » Tue Apr 20, 2021 11:39 am

Any updates Graey?

How was your first Sunday?
Those who do not move do not notice their chains. —Rosa Luxemburg

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Advocate
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by Advocate » Tue Apr 20, 2021 12:25 pm

Red Ryder wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 11:39 am
Any updates Graey?

How was your first Sunday?
It should be obvious! When Graey was set apart as a Bishop the Spirit(TM) moved Graey to immediately see the error in his ways and he has sworn to never visit the vile pit of despair that is Newordermormon.net.

Or it could be that he's just been busy getting up to speed with his new calling.

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moksha
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by moksha » Tue Apr 20, 2021 7:12 pm

Advocate wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 12:25 pm
Or it could be that he's just been busy getting up to speed with his new calling.
There are those two volumes of the Bishop's Handbook, plus that huge Unwritten Rules.
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

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græy
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by græy » Wed Apr 28, 2021 10:44 am

Advocate wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 12:25 pm
It should be obvious! When Graey was set apart as a Bishop the Spirit(TM) moved Graey to immediately see the error in his ways and he has sworn to never visit the vile pit of despair that is Newordermormon.net.
On the contrary, the Spirit(TM) confirmed to me that this is the only place I have to go that isn't completely bonkers! I mean, its a little bit bonkers, but just the right amount. Ya know?

If this is the pit of despair, the go ahead and hook me up to the machine (pincessbride) because I don't plan on leaving any time soon. :D
I'm better than dirt... well most dirt. Not that fancy store bought stuff, I can't compete with that... full of nutrients and everything. -Moe Sizlack

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Red Ryder
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by Red Ryder » Wed Apr 28, 2021 11:10 am

græy wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 10:44 am
On the contrary, the Spirit(TM) confirmed to me that this is the only place I have to go that isn't completely bonkers! I mean, its a little bit bonkers, but just the right amount. Ya know?
So how’s the new bishop’s office? Do you at least get a new chair? Stock up on fabreeze because if it’s like any I’ve been in, the priest quorum funky smell never leaves.

Not as bad as the mother’s lounge or kitchen, but clearly a bishops office is on the “top 5 most smelly rooms in a Mormon chapel” list.

Mothers lounge
Bathrooms
kitchen
nursery
Bishops office
Those who do not move do not notice their chains. —Rosa Luxemburg

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græy
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by græy » Wed Apr 28, 2021 11:21 am

Red Ryder wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 11:39 am
Any updates Graey?

How was your first Sunday?
First Sunday was... surreal. When I was asked to share my "testimony" I spoke about our ward family, about service, and quoted the two great commandments in Matthew 22 and serve neighbor serve God in Matthew 25. I did not mentioned RMN, I did not mention prophets, I did not mention priesthood. I felt good with that. My parents insisted on driving for two days to be here for 1 day, followed immediately by the two-day drive home. Previous bishop thoughtfully gave up his previous Saturday to handle a bunch of current items, leaving my Sunday mostly free once church was over. That meant I got to see my parents for a couple of hours between their 24-hour road trips.

Since then, things have been ramping up pretty quickly.

Second Sunday was definitely more hectic. I was finally released as EQP. For one week I held ALL the made-up priesthood keys in the ward. I also had two large keychains from both those callings. Definitely felt the weight of the physical keys much more literally. They called the ward clerk to be the new EQP.

I'm still trying to find my footing in terms of scheduling, and wrapping my head around the sheer amount of drama that goes on behind the scenes, hidden from the view of most of the rest of the ward.

I've pushed off all responsibility for sacrament talks to my counselors. All talks will be focused on core values - honesty, integrity, empathy, optimism, dependability, etc. Obviously, speakers will bring in their own doctrinal talks or quotes to support the core value, but that is okay.

Our YM advisors are good guys, though it feels like there is a definite lack of direction in planning activities for the YM. Parents' anxiety around COVID (understandable) makes is way more complicated.

People like to say how inspired RMN was to do the whole Come Follow Me, Home Centered/Church Supported (TM) thing just before COVID hit (Nevermind that it was in the works for a LONG time before him). But I think the youth PISS program's timing could not have been worse. Activities are supposed to be based on individual goals, we just bring the whole group along for the experience for a night. The kids themselves are supposed to be planning that activity, but you can guess how well that goes. The result is that most kids don't really care about any of the activities, even the ones that do get planned. A lot of the time no one really knows what is going on. Best case scenario it was supposed to be an in-person activity everyone just winds up playing basketball or 4-square. Worst case, it was a zoom activity and most everyone leaves after 20 minutes.

We have a lot of work to do to get some fun activities happening.

The YW are marginally better organized, but communication between YM and YW has been broken for some time it seems.

Anyway, things are going well enough so far. A lot of good people have offered help. I have my NOM family to keep me sane. And I have a few things in the works I hope can make a difference for some few in our ward, but I might start some new threads about those things.
I'm better than dirt... well most dirt. Not that fancy store bought stuff, I can't compete with that... full of nutrients and everything. -Moe Sizlack

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græy
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by græy » Wed Apr 28, 2021 11:30 am

Red Ryder wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 11:10 am
So how’s the new bishop’s office? Do you at least get a new chair? Stock up on fabreeze because if it’s like any I’ve been in, the priest quorum funky smell never leaves.

Not as bad as the mother’s lounge or kitchen, but clearly a bishops office is on the “top 5 most smelly rooms in a Mormon chapel” list.
Ha! Febreze is a great idea. Will definitely have to stock up!

To be honest, I haven't spent much time there just yet. Previous bishop was doing all interviews via zoom, so I've just left that going for now.

There are three large paintings on the wall in the bishop's office. Two are generic atonement pictures. The third, a picture of angels helping to push handcarts through the snow, was apparently purchased by the previous bishop and it will one day be taken out to move into his newly built house.

History Lesson! Our first bishop was poor (temporary situation, he had just finished his PhD) and several families (us included) pitched in to buy him a painting for his office. He took that painting with him when he was released. All bishops since then have been somewhat wealthy and purchased their own pictures, which again, they took with them.

It sounds like I will be expected to shell out personal money for a large painting for that third wall so that I can take it with me when I'm done. I've toyed with the idea of finding some NOM friendly painting, possibly something that isn't even strictly religious in nature. But in the end I just don't want to spend money on art that I don't need for an office I don't want. The wall will likely just stay blank if the current painting leaves.
I'm better than dirt... well most dirt. Not that fancy store bought stuff, I can't compete with that... full of nutrients and everything. -Moe Sizlack

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Red Ryder
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by Red Ryder » Wed Apr 28, 2021 12:19 pm

Thanks for the updates!

May I suggest you skip the painting and go with a quilt or something like minded from the relief society?

Or go with a cheap cork board and pin up drawings from the primary kids?

Or a white board with YM/YW planned activity notes and timelines?
Those who do not move do not notice their chains. —Rosa Luxemburg

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Linked
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by Linked » Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:00 pm

græy wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 11:30 am
History Lesson! Our first bishop was poor (temporary situation, he had just finished his PhD) and several families (us included) pitched in to buy him a painting for his office. He took that painting with him when he was released. All bishops since then have been somewhat wealthy and purchased their own pictures, which again, they took with them.

It sounds like I will be expected to shell out personal money for a large painting for that third wall so that I can take it with me when I'm done. I've toyed with the idea of finding some NOM friendly painting, possibly something that isn't even strictly religious in nature. But in the end I just don't want to spend money on art that I don't need for an office I don't want. The wall will likely just stay blank if the current painting leaves.
This sounds fun to me. Maybe you could do rotating posters of things you are into. I would put up a different Kursgesagt poster for the first few months about things like Black Holes and Chemistry and Evolution. Maybe some webcomic posters that you find particularly amusing for other months.

If you do have interest in putting something up but don't want to bear all the cost let me know and I can help out some.
"I would write about life. Every person would be exactly as important as any other. All facts would also be given equal weightiness. Nothing would be left out. Let others bring order to chaos. I would bring chaos to order" - Kurt Vonnegut

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Stig
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by Stig » Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:02 pm

græy wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 11:30 am
Red Ryder wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 11:10 am
So how’s the new bishop’s office? Do you at least get a new chair? Stock up on fabreeze because if it’s like any I’ve been in, the priest quorum funky smell never leaves.

Not as bad as the mother’s lounge or kitchen, but clearly a bishops office is on the “top 5 most smelly rooms in a Mormon chapel” list.
Ha! Febreze is a great idea. Will definitely have to stock up!

To be honest, I haven't spent much time there just yet. Previous bishop was doing all interviews via zoom, so I've just left that going for now.

There are three large paintings on the wall in the bishop's office. Two are generic atonement pictures. The third, a picture of angels helping to push handcarts through the snow, was apparently purchased by the previous bishop and it will one day be taken out to move into his newly built house.

History Lesson! Our first bishop was poor (temporary situation, he had just finished his PhD) and several families (us included) pitched in to buy him a painting for his office. He took that painting with him when he was released. All bishops since then have been somewhat wealthy and purchased their own pictures, which again, they took with them.

It sounds like I will be expected to shell out personal money for a large painting for that third wall so that I can take it with me when I'm done. I've toyed with the idea of finding some NOM friendly painting, possibly something that isn't even strictly religious in nature. But in the end I just don't want to spend money on art that I don't need for an office I don't want. The wall will likely just stay blank if the current painting leaves.
I say you go with one of these for the third picture:

Image
“Some say he’s wanted by the CIA and that he sleeps upside down like a Bat. All we know is he’s called the Stig.”

“Some say that he lives in a tree, and that his sweat can be used to clean precious metals. All we know is he’s called the Stig.”

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moksha
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by moksha » Wed Apr 28, 2021 10:32 pm

The people who should celebrate are the members of Græy's ward who will have a good bishop.
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

hmb
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by hmb » Thu Apr 29, 2021 5:23 am

I'll make you a quilt. I've made a few wall hangings. The first could be called, "The Godhead."


rsz_godhead.jpeg
rsz_godhead.jpeg (68.52 KiB) Viewed 505 times



The nativity isn't complete. I lost my stitching mojo and moved on. I don't like how Mary's right hand is big like a dudes and baby J's blanket looks like it's draped in bacon.


rsz_nativity.jpeg
rsz_nativity.jpeg (37.58 KiB) Viewed 505 times

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beetbox
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by beetbox » Thu Apr 29, 2021 11:44 am

græy wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 11:30 am
It sounds like I will be expected to shell out personal money for a large painting for that third wall so that I can take it with me when I'm done. I've toyed with the idea of finding some NOM friendly painting, possibly something that isn't even strictly religious in nature. But in the end I just don't want to spend money on art that I don't need for an office I don't want. The wall will likely just stay blank if the current painting leaves.
I recommend one of those magnetic dart boards. When you and your counselors need to assign a new calling, place the eligible ward members' names on the board, and see where the Spirit directs your dart.

Good luck with figuring out how to do bishoping your way. While I might think you're crazy for agreeing to do it, your ward is going to love having a good guy like you calling the shots.

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Corsair
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by Corsair » Fri Apr 30, 2021 12:05 am

græy wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 11:21 am
First Sunday was... surreal. When I was asked to share my "testimony" I spoke about our ward family, about service, and quoted the two great commandments in Matthew 22 and serve neighbor serve God in Matthew 25. I did not mentioned RMN, I did not mention prophets, I did not mention priesthood. I felt good with that.
This whole saga is amazing and I am hoping that you find time to pop in with updates as your schedule permits. You have the inside track on lots of new craziness coming down to the ward level and I am impressed that you are taking this tapir by the horns. While I cannot conceive about how we could possibly help you, you should know that we definitely have your back if there truly is some way we could assist you.

Wonderment
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by Wonderment » Fri Apr 30, 2021 12:40 am

hmb wrote:
Thu Apr 29, 2021 5:23 am
I'll make you a quilt. I've made a few wall hangings. The first could be called, "The Godhead."



rsz_godhead.jpeg




The nativity isn't complete. I lost my stitching mojo and moved on. I don't like how Mary's right hand is big like a dudes and baby J's blanket looks like it's draped in bacon.



rsz_nativity.jpeg
I’m a quilter, and your work is fabulous! The applique on your Nativity quilt is perfect. Nothing wrong with the proportions. If you’re in Utah, I think you should submit your work to the Springville Museum of Art for their annual summer show. Everyone would love to see this!
I’m sorry for delving off topic, but you’re very talented. 😊Wndr.

hmb
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by hmb » Mon May 03, 2021 5:55 am

Wonderment wrote:
Fri Apr 30, 2021 12:40 am
I’m a quilter, and your work is fabulous! The applique on your Nativity quilt is perfect. Nothing wrong with the proportions. If you’re in Utah, I think you should submit your work to the Springville Museum of Art for their annual summer show. Everyone would love to see this!
I’m sorry for delving off topic, but you’re very talented. 😊Wndr.
Thanks, Wonderment. I don't know that "everyone" would love to see these, and a few others I've made. I tend to get negative feedback because it's irreverent, blah blah blah. I remember a time when humor was taken as fun. Oh well, I'm sure it will return someday.

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moksha
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by moksha » Mon May 03, 2021 6:22 am

This might help your parishioners express their authentic feelings:

Image
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

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MalcolmVillager
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by MalcolmVillager » Mon May 03, 2021 8:01 pm

Bishop G.

Congrats and condolences. I couldn't do it. I had a friend who served as bishop for about a year and asked for a release. That is an honorable way out too.

You will do a great job. Just take it one day at a time.

On a brighter note, some convicted murderers get less time than a bishop calling. ;-)

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græy
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by græy » Tue May 11, 2021 10:28 am

hmb wrote:
Thu Apr 29, 2021 5:23 am
I'll make you a quilt. I've made a few wall hangings. The first could be called, "The Godhead."
I'm late getting back tot his, but those are amazing hmb! I agree with Wonderment, you've got real talent.
I'm better than dirt... well most dirt. Not that fancy store bought stuff, I can't compete with that... full of nutrients and everything. -Moe Sizlack

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