Forced Turning Point

This is for encouragement, ideas, and support for people going through a faith transition no matter where you hope to end up. This is also the place to laugh, cry, and love together.
Reuben
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by Reuben » Sun Mar 28, 2021 10:28 am

græy wrote:
Fri Mar 26, 2021 4:30 pm
I don't care to continue my activity in the church, but my wife does care about her activity. And she intends on taking the kids with her. My goal is to be involved enough that I don't have to continually fight messaging that I am an unworthy father, or destined to hell for not doing priesthood-y things. This double life may be a bit duplicitous but I don't feel like I need to be any more honest with the church than the church has been with me.
So it seems you're going to experience cognitive dissonance no matter what.

Stay completely closeted, and dissonance will arise from the mismatch between your beliefs and your actions.

Come out of the closet, and dissonance will arise from the mismatch between what your friends think of you and what you know about yourself.

Do something in between, and you'll get a combination of dissonances.

What strategy gives rise to the least dissonance?

Also, and maybe more important, what strategy produces the least anxiety? Blashyrkh made a really good point here:
Blashyrkh wrote:
Sat Mar 27, 2021 9:13 am
The most powerful word in the English language is "No." I feel for your position with the wife and kids. I was in the same position. The church always felt like this huge weight on my shoulders which I don't believe God intended it to be. I finally just had to be honest and say no to callings. I believe that the anxiety over saying no was much worse than the actual outcome.
I read a fascinating article about a woman who has very rare brain plaques that have killed her ability to feel fear. She's been abused, beaten and robbed, but not traumatized. Of course she can remember feeling pain and avoids it, but not with the same primal intuition that the rest of us do. So she experiences no trauma but more pain.

I wonder if trauma is part of the price we pay for avoiding pain. A Buddhist might call it dukkha.
Learn to doubt the stories you tell about yourselves and your adversaries.

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2bizE
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by 2bizE » Sun Mar 28, 2021 12:42 pm

Remember those stories from past conferences and manuals where a man is called to be a bishop or Stake President but they drink coffee and smoke, drink alcohol, etc..but are told stop and they are called anyway? They used to love telling those stories in conference or church, but don’t hear them much anymore...

I would have a hard time staying as bishop if I were called, especially when I would start ordaining women to the priesthood....
Last edited by 2bizE on Mon Apr 12, 2021 7:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
~2bizE

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Mormorrisey
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by Mormorrisey » Mon Mar 29, 2021 10:09 am

That's a tough spot, graey. As one who has to hold a calling to keep the peace, it's not fun to not want to do stuff, yet be expected to do stuff. And then have people complain when you don't do stuff that they want you to do. So I'm the last person to give the advice "just say no," when I know that's a simplistic answer to a complex family situation.

At this point, the only advice I can give is just do everything on your terms, ignore the voices clamouring for you to improve your Mormon performance, and move on with your life, whatever decision you make to accept or decline a calling. If they don't like what you're doing, they know what they need to do, just release you. That's it in a nutshell. That's been my go-to answer for years, including when I had the big chair.

Keep us in the loop, though. I'm sure everyone will be fascinated to learn what they want from you.
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MoPag
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by MoPag » Mon Mar 29, 2021 10:39 am

Lots of great suggestions here!

You can also tell them you need to discuss any calling they extend to you with your gal pals over at Ordain Women. :lol:
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believing in old men’s lies...--Ezra Pound

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Just This Guy
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by Just This Guy » Mon Mar 29, 2021 12:33 pm

Also, when in doupt, stall.

Telling the Ex Sec you need to pray about a position is a Mormon acceptable way of punting a decision down the road and allowing you to avoid a high pressure sales pitch.
"The story so far: In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move." -- Douglas Adams

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Linked
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by Linked » Mon Mar 29, 2021 1:39 pm

That's a tough spot to be in græy, I'm sorry you are stuck between a rock and a hard place. Your concerns about the church painting you as evil to your own kids really resonates with me. Just let me keep the respect I've developed with my kids.
Just This Guy wrote:
Mon Mar 29, 2021 12:33 pm
Also, when in doupt, stall.

Telling the Ex Sec you need to pray about a position is a Mormon acceptable way of punting a decision down the road and allowing you to avoid a high pressure sales pitch.
I second this. Regardless of the reason they call you in, be ready to push your response to another time. I started using this tactic a while back and it really brought down the anxiety of these meetings for me. You are still at a bit of a crossroad in this case, but it doesn't have to come in a high-stress meeting with your wife staring at you.

"Hmmm, that's interesting about my tithing receipts, I'll have to review that and get back to you."
"I am humbled and honored that you would consider me for Bishop. I'll consider it and get back to you."
"Brother Next-Bishop thought of me for Counselor? How thoughtful of him. Let me think about it and I'll get back to you."
"I would write about life. Every person would be exactly as important as any other. All facts would also be given equal weightiness. Nothing would be left out. Let others bring order to chaos. I would bring chaos to order" - Kurt Vonnegut

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wtfluff
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by wtfluff » Mon Mar 29, 2021 5:13 pm

MoPag wrote:
Mon Mar 29, 2021 10:39 am
Lots of great suggestions here!

You can also tell them you need to discuss any calling they extend to you with your gal pals over at Ordain Women. :lol:
Another fun reply could be: Sure Mr. Steak President! I'd love to be bishop, as long as I can call my wife as First Councilor. :geek:
Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus

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græy
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by græy » Tue Mar 30, 2021 8:43 am

Just This Guy wrote:
Mon Mar 29, 2021 12:33 pm
Also, when in doubt, stall.

Telling the Ex Sec you need to pray about a position is a Mormon acceptable way of punting a decision down the road and allowing you to avoid a high pressure sales pitch.
Linked wrote:
Mon Mar 29, 2021 1:39 pm
That's a tough spot to be in græy, I'm sorry you are stuck between a rock and a hard place. Your concerns about the church painting you as evil to your own kids really resonates with me. Just let me keep the respect I've developed with my kids.

I second [Just This Guy's post]. Regardless of the reason they call you in, be ready to push your response to another time. I started using this tactic a while back and it really brought down the anxiety of these meetings for me. You are still at a bit of a crossroad in this case, but it doesn't have to come in a high-stress meeting with your wife staring at you.

"Hmmm, that's interesting about my tithing receipts, I'll have to review that and get back to you."
"I am humbled and honored that you would consider me for Bishop. I'll consider it and get back to you."
"Brother Next-Bishop thought of me for Counselor? How thoughtful of him. Let me think about it and I'll get back to you."
Mormorrisey wrote:
Mon Mar 29, 2021 10:09 am
That's a tough spot, graey. As one who has to hold a calling to keep the peace, it's not fun to not want to do stuff, yet be expected to do stuff. And then have people complain when you don't do stuff that they want you to do. So I'm the last person to give the advice "just say no," when I know that's a simplistic answer to a complex family situation.

At this point, the only advice I can give is just do everything on your terms, ignore the voices clamouring for you to improve your Mormon performance, and move on with your life, whatever decision you make to accept or decline a calling. If they don't like what you're doing, they know what they need to do, just release you. That's it in a nutshell. That's been my go-to answer for years, including when I had the big chair.

Keep us in the loop, though. I'm sure everyone will be fascinated to learn what they want from you.
This is all good advice too. Thank you guys. I will have to remember that I control the response, and if he wants it, he'll just have to wait a bit for it.

@Mormorrisey, I often think of you in your high council meetings putting up with much the same frustration. It helps to feel not as a lone. :)
I'm better than dirt... well most dirt. Not that fancy store bought stuff, I can't compete with that... full of nutrients and everything. -Moe Sizlack

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græy
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by græy » Tue Mar 30, 2021 9:02 am

So, last night was interesting. DW and I had a ~5 hour long discussion about where I stand in the church, our shared common and different experiences, our frustrations, and even some of the positives that we each see in the church. It was fairly intense. Tears were shed and laughs were shared on both sides, and I feel that we understand each other more now than ever before.

Unbeknownst to me she recently read David Ostler's Bridges. I bought and read it within a couple of days of it coming out and have been recommending it to anyone who will listen since then. She's the first to actually follow through on that invitation nearly two years after it came out. I do believe it opened her eyes to some things.

I would feel really good about the whole thing if not for this stupid meeting hanging over my head like a guillotine.

I don't think I have ever felt anxiety like this about anything in the history of forever. I slept MAYBE 2 1/2 hours last night after taking a triple dose of my kids' melatonin at 4:30am. I've had a headache for the past 12+ hours and neither ibuprofen nor tylenol have helped at all. I feel all.... shaky? Jittery? Its like I'm shivering uncontrollably but I'm not cold. And I periodically have these waves of butterflies in my stomach. Except they feel more like condors.

This just isn't me. I've never felt so worked up about something that shouldn't even be a thing in the real world.

As of last night, my wife is on my side and supports me in whatever I decide to tell the SP. I guess now it really comes down to how involved do I want to be? How involved will they let me be if I am honest about it all? Do I have the mental clarity to really convey where I'm at?

The SP is a good guy. I really do respect and admire him. He's one of the smartest people I think I've ever met. In 5+ years I've never seen him use notes when giving a talk regardless of the venue or length time he's speaking. He literally memorizes everything he wants to say - scriptures, quotes, all of it. He's not someone I want to have any kind of argument with, I'm just not that good at putting thoughts together on the fly. I don't think it will come to that any way.

Okay, I'm just rambling now. I need to focus on work if I can.
I'm better than dirt... well most dirt. Not that fancy store bought stuff, I can't compete with that... full of nutrients and everything. -Moe Sizlack

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Linked
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by Linked » Tue Mar 30, 2021 9:58 am

græy wrote:
Tue Mar 30, 2021 9:02 am
So, last night was interesting. DW and I had a ~5 hour long discussion about where I stand in the church, our shared common and different experiences, our frustrations, and even some of the positives that we each see in the church. It was fairly intense. Tears were shed and laughs were shared on both sides, and I feel that we understand each other more now than ever before.

Unbeknownst to me she recently read David Ostler's Bridges. I bought and read it within a couple of days of it coming out and have been recommending it to anyone who will listen since then. She's the first to actually follow through on that invitation nearly two years after it came out. I do believe it opened her eyes to some things.

I would feel really good about the whole thing if not for this stupid meeting hanging over my head like a guillotine.

I don't think I have ever felt anxiety like this about anything in the history of forever. I slept MAYBE 2 1/2 hours last night after taking a triple dose of my kids' melatonin at 4:30am. I've had a headache for the past 12+ hours and neither ibuprofen nor tylenol have helped at all. I feel all.... shaky? Jittery? Its like I'm shivering uncontrollably but I'm not cold. And I periodically have these waves of butterflies in my stomach. Except they feel more like condors.

This just isn't me. I've never felt so worked up about something that shouldn't even be a thing in the real world.

As of last night, my wife is on my side and supports me in whatever I decide to tell the SP. I guess now it really comes down to how involved do I want to be? How involved will they let me be if I am honest about it all? Do I have the mental clarity to really convey where I'm at?

The SP is a good guy. I really do respect and admire him. He's one of the smartest people I think I've ever met. In 5+ years I've never seen him use notes when giving a talk regardless of the venue or length time he's speaking. He literally memorizes everything he wants to say - scriptures, quotes, all of it. He's not someone I want to have any kind of argument with, I'm just not that good at putting thoughts together on the fly. I don't think it will come to that any way.

Okay, I'm just rambling now. I need to focus on work if I can.
5 hours!?! That's awesome you guys were able to connect. Sounds like you guys have a bright future. That is so great that she has expressed her support for you!

One thought on your SP. He can be a great guy and super smart and still not be someone you want to discuss this with because he represents the church and he will put the church first. Maybe consider what you would tell a generic SP and stick to that? Ultimately you know best about him.

Regarding anxiety, I'm an anxious guy and have a couple strategies I use if you would like to try them.

4 Step Anxiety Reduction Process:
1 - Recognize and Name the thing causing you anxiety. Go several steps deep (meeting tonight - worried about a confrontation - I don't want to be scolded)
2 - Take a slow, deep breath in and out (I've heard that this can stimulate your vagus nerve which can help induce relaxation. Don't quote me on that though)
3 - Express your desire to stop being anxious about the thing to yourself (Stop worrying about being scolded)
4 - Replace your thinking about what is causing your anxiety with something else. Get mindful. Read an article. Work.

If find it helpful to get as deep as possible on why I am really feeling anxious because it is often something that is beyond unlikely, or something that can be mitigated. It's often just a primal reaction. Also, lists and planning help me wrap my arms around whatever is causing the anxiety.

Good luck!
"I would write about life. Every person would be exactly as important as any other. All facts would also be given equal weightiness. Nothing would be left out. Let others bring order to chaos. I would bring chaos to order" - Kurt Vonnegut

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Journey
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by Journey » Tue Mar 30, 2021 1:30 pm

I am so sorry this is causing so much anguish. I would second everything that Linked said and add to make sure you’re drinking water and eating throughout the day as you sound exhausted after a 5-hour deep conversation with DW and very little sleep.
Would you consider canceling and rescheduling this meeting as an option? I understand if you want it over and done with and would rather not prolong but you just don’t sound to be in the best condition for it. Good luck!

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Red Ryder
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by Red Ryder » Tue Mar 30, 2021 2:50 pm

I don't think I have ever felt anxiety like this about anything in the history of forever. I slept MAYBE 2 1/2 hours last night after taking a triple dose of my kids' melatonin at 4:30am. I've had a headache for the past 12+ hours and neither ibuprofen nor tylenol have helped at all. I feel all.... shaky? Jittery? Its like I'm shivering uncontrollably but I'm not cold. And I periodically have these waves of butterflies in my stomach. Except they feel more like condors.
Sounds like you’re feeling the Spirit! 🤪

Sister Ryder just finished reading Bridges and has recommended it to a few other people to read. I think having your wife’s support is awesome! She’ll make a great Bishop’s wife!!
Those who do not move do not notice their chains. —Rosa Luxemburg

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græy
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by græy » Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:05 am

Title and Foreshadowing: What. The. Actual. F***?

Return and Report:

DW and I showed up to the interview. It started off like any church interview, exactly as expected. There was a brief minute of chit-chat. He noted that we also needed recommends renewed and then he jumped right into it.

He asked how COVID has been for my family specifically in regards to church and spirituality. I explained that I have continued to do sacrament at home and that our family has enjoyed the intimacy of being alone together. Being with just our kids has led to some awesome conversations when our kids speak up with questions, which is harder to do when we're constantly shushing them at church.

He asked about my thoughts on repentance. I told that I believe in the principle of repentance in terms of growth and change. The sacrament for all its doctrinal issues does give us time to self-reflect and commit to improvement.

He asked me about the role of mercy in repentance. I told him I have had times in my life where I felt mercy was extended to me and was deeply grateful for that and have learned that I wish to extend mercy whenever I can, whatever that looks like. I was kind of confused by this question and didn't know where to go from there, but he didn't really give me a chance anyway.

He asked me about my "relationship with Christ." I answered that I believe and strive to follow teachings of Christ that our primary purpose here is to love and serve those around us. I honestly feel good serving and helping others in any way I can, and I believe that is what Christ meant when he said that by serving others we are serving God. I told him that I feel my "relationship" (I didn't do air quotes or anything) which Christ is good in that I do respect those teachings. I have benefited from them, and I feel that following them blesses everyone. (I guess that statement could or should be significantly qualified, but I didn't elaborate).

From there SP jumped into the standard temple recommend questions. I had to do these a few weeks ago and strongly nuanced my way through them. But this time, as he got to question 3 Do you have a testimony of the Restoration of the gospel of Jesus Christ? I paused for long enough to clue him in that something was wrong.

I told him my story - about a simple conversation with a friend on racism leading to the essays and then a faith transition centered on church history. I told him that I watched several families leave our ward in recent years over those same issues and each time I would beg the ward council to find some way to address the elephant in the room, but got shot down every time. I told him that I've read and studied and that I still very much struggle with church history.

And he just sat there.

When he started talking he told me that he was raised in a part-member home and because of the conflicting messages he got as a kid he gravitated tot he gospel because of its consistency. :roll: He said that his testimony was based on his experiences and the feelings he has felt in answer to prayer and quote: "I've never had to reconcile the history as part of my testimony."

Then he went on with the recommend questions. I basically lied about tithing. Which also invalidates the question on honesty, I guess. But at this point, I really figured that I was out of the race for bishop and just wanted my recommend signed (for family reasons). I was actually a bit surprised when he got to the end of the interview and went ahead and signed my recommend.

Then he asked me to get my wife and he would complete her recommend interview. Up to this point there had been no specific mention of current bishop's release or pending changes and I was starting to question what the interview was even for.

DW did her interview and when she opened the door she said he wanted us both in the room. So I went back in, we all sat down, and he continued (I may get some of these words wrong so it isn't really a direct quote)...

"President Græy, I have here in front of me a letter from the first presidency authorizing me to call you to be the next bishop of your ward. The decision to extend this calling does not come lightly. Under normal conditions I would have spent time in the temple praying and pondering this decision. I have not been able to go to the temple due to COVID restrictions, but I have spent a great deal of time fasting and praying about this and I do feel this is the right choice."

Then he just kept talking for like 20 minutes and I basically heard none of it. It was mostly stuff like read the handbook, keep confidentiality, consult with your spouse on everything that isn't confidential, choose good counselors, blah blah.

When he stopped he asked me what I felt about all of that. I took a minute to think and then told him that I had assumed the interview was more of a preliminary interview where he would meet with 3 or 4 people before making a recommendation to SLC. And I assumed that when I brought up my struggles with church history I would basically be eliminating myself from selection. I told him that I certainly was not expecting this at all.

He said something along the lines of I feel this is the right thing for your ward and for you. All bishops struggle, and it may be that your particular struggles will be a great blessing to others in your ward.

At that point, DW was crying. He asked for her thoughts. She basically said she'd support me whatever my choice but that she felt I could understand people who were struggling because I have been or maybe still am there myself. He joked back that that is why I'd make a great bishop - I have a supportive wife.

He concluded saying that he felt the lord was calling me for a reason :roll: (isn't that what we tell EVERYONE for EVERY calling?). He then said he'd tentatively say I was accepting the calling, but that if I really felt bad about it I could call him within the next day.

There was no closing prayer. We got up, bumped elbows, and left. My head was (is) spinning.

Preliminary Results

Pro: DW is questioning revelation and inspiration. Callings are all about relation.
Pro: Haha, suckaz! I made it to tippy-top of my ward and when I finally do crack and leave, no one can say I didn't give it a fair try.
Pro: Maybe I can help be empathetic and understanding to those who are actually struggling.

Con: While in the bishopric previously I AGONIZED over every testimony I had to give. Finding things to say that didn't feel like a lie was terrible!
Con: I'd be expected to motivate people to go to the temple and do missionary work. No Thanks!
Con: I'd have to be over the YM. Maybe this could actually be fun?
Con: 5 years!? Maybe its time to start looking into that new home.
Con: So many whining people. "We've tried nothin! And we're all out of ideas!" - Does that contradict my last pro?

Notes

Red Ryder, I blame you.

I feel like I passed a test, but only because the teacher had no idea how to grade it. If SP has "never had to reconcile history" he has NO CLUE how damaging it is to testimony or the church's truth claims.

How the f*** did I get approved by the first presidency after not paying tithing for over a year? Did joblessness and drops in tithing during COVID just completely cover me up?

DW already called both sets of parents which greatly complicates things if I back out.
I'm better than dirt... well most dirt. Not that fancy store bought stuff, I can't compete with that... full of nutrients and everything. -Moe Sizlack

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Red Ryder
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by Red Ryder » Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:22 am

“Graey” wrote: Red Ryder, I blame you.
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. I’m laughing and crying at the same time! :lol:

Laughing because this is hilarious. The spirit whispered into my heart and soul that it would be you! I have a testimony of every bishop guess coming true!

Crying because damn.... I wish I was in your ward! You are going to be the best Bishop Graey! Someone who understands the nature of the church as it really is. Thinking of the mercy and love you can extend to people like us.

If you choose to accept, you have all of us here at NOM to support you and run ideas past us. You can make real change from the inside. We have your back if you ever need talks written or thoughts prepared. I will be honored to ghost write anything for you. Consider me your 3rd counselor! Well make it the 4th counselor as you should insert your wife in somewhere. Make her an honorary member of your trusted advisors as you lead your ward. You can do this man! You can lead with love.

PS:

Where do I send my ward records? :lol:
Those who do not move do not notice their chains. —Rosa Luxemburg

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wtfluff
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by wtfluff » Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:36 am

græy wrote:
Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:05 am
He concluded saying that he felt the lord was calling me for a reason :roll: (isn't that what we tell EVERYONE for EVERY calling?). He then said he'd tentatively say I was accepting the calling, but that if I really felt bad about it I could call him within the next day.
Did I miss the part where you said any word close to "yes" or hinted at any sort of acceptance of this 5-year-sentence?
Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus

Keep the company of those who seek the truth - run from those who have found it -Václav Havel

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græy
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by græy » Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:37 am

wtfluff wrote:
Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:36 am
græy wrote:
Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:05 am
He concluded saying that he felt the lord was calling me for a reason :roll: (isn't that what we tell EVERYONE for EVERY calling?). He then said he'd tentatively say I was accepting the calling, but that if I really felt bad about it I could call him within the next day.
Did I miss the part where you said any word close to "yes" or hinted at any sort of acceptance of this 5-year-sentence?
You did not. I never said yes. I was given a day to opt-out.
I'm better than dirt... well most dirt. Not that fancy store bought stuff, I can't compete with that... full of nutrients and everything. -Moe Sizlack

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wtfluff
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by wtfluff » Wed Mar 31, 2021 12:02 pm

græy wrote:
Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:37 am
wtfluff wrote:
Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:36 am
græy wrote:
Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:05 am
He concluded saying that he felt the lord was calling me for a reason :roll: (isn't that what we tell EVERYONE for EVERY calling?). He then said he'd tentatively say I was accepting the calling, but that if I really felt bad about it I could call him within the next day.
Did I miss the part where you said any word close to "yes" or hinted at any sort of acceptance of this 5-year-sentence?
You did not. I never said yes. I was given a day to opt-out.
"Personal Revelation" takes time you know...

Edit: Meaning, you can opt-out telling the Prez, of Steak you're still waiting for "confirmation" that you should accept. You can keep waiting until they move on to their next victim.
Last edited by wtfluff on Wed Mar 31, 2021 12:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus

Keep the company of those who seek the truth - run from those who have found it -Václav Havel

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Corsair
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by Corsair » Wed Mar 31, 2021 12:17 pm

græy wrote:
Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:05 am
Title and Foreshadowing: What. The. Actual. F***?
I know you probably don't want congratulations or anything like that. Let us know how this is going to proceed for you and your family. Whether or not you accept a call to be a bishop, this strongly indicates that LDS leadership is either desperate or incompetent. I vote for whichever option results from too much money and too many yes-men. It also means that the undercover unbelievers like myself are in danger of getting a similar call.

Here's a tactic that might help make a change from the top: Contact John Dehlin and ask for an interview on Mormon Stories. Tell him your story, use your name, and simply say that you are going to be the kind of bishop that would make yourself glad to be in such a ward.

If that does not incite a hasty retraction of the calling, let your stake president know that if God wanted you in this calling, then you will follow your inspiration as you feel led by the spirit. Hand out temple recommends to anyone who asks nicely. Hold your first "Casual Sunday". Invite a sacrament meeting speaker with profound theological differences. Show up to bishopric meeting drinking some "hot drink" out of Starbucks cup and act like you are not seeing the obvious infraction.

I truly do not know what to tell you. This is your decision and their is not path that does lead through emotional turmoil. But today you still have the option of which turmoil and when you want it to fall on you. Good luck and let us know your ward because some of us still might need a temple recommend.

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A New Name
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by A New Name » Wed Mar 31, 2021 12:27 pm

When your SP started asking questions about repentance and mercy, I knew it was a "pre-bishop" interview.

And yes, I was numb for a couple of weeks after being called as Bishop. I talked to a friend, (former companion) that was SP at the time, and told him I didn't believe the BofM was historically true. He said that was not a requirement to be Bishop, and to go ahead and accept it.

So much of the Bishop's job in administrative, and you can do that. I was very hands off with RSP, Primary Pres, and YW pres. I let them plan their own activities with me not needing to know the details. I let them select their own counselors, teachers, and officers.

I really liked meeting with the people one on one and helping them out. I knew my limits, and referred to people to professional counselors, and paid for it when needed quite a bit.

If you'd like to talk more, PM me with your e-mail address.
Last edited by A New Name on Wed Mar 31, 2021 3:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Stig
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Re: Forced Turning Point

Post by Stig » Wed Mar 31, 2021 1:42 pm

I'm going to take this as another data point in the column that reads - "There is no such thing as 'revelation.'"
“Some say he’s wanted by the CIA and that he sleeps upside down like a Bat. All we know is he’s called the Stig.”

“Some say that he lives in a tree, and that his sweat can be used to clean precious metals. All we know is he’s called the Stig.”

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