Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

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Mackman
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Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

Post by Mackman » Sun Apr 04, 2021 5:32 pm

Anybody else kind of pissed off about doubters being called lazy learners by Russell M Nelson ??? Let me tell you something Rusty anyone who has ever doubted has done lots of research to try and find truth in the church , everyone wants it to be true but in the end it is what it is !!! The lazy ones are members who just pay, pray & obey. I spent over 6 years researching trying to find truth in the church reading many books and countless articles in the end you can put lipstick on a pig but it's still a pig you arrogant Ass !!!!!!!!

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jfro18
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Re: Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

Post by jfro18 » Sun Apr 04, 2021 6:57 pm

This stuff makes my blood boil because I know DW believes it and wants my kid to believe it too... and I know I'm not alone.

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Red Ryder
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Re: Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

Post by Red Ryder » Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:03 pm

I consider it the equivalent of Russel M Nelson sticking his fingers in his ears and while waiving saying “neener neener you’re a lazy learner!!”

I know the time I’ve spent learning the hidden truths of the gospel and I’ll I can say is I sure as hell wasn't lazy.

The message is the same. Apostates are lazy Mormons who just wanted to sin.

That’s all you can resort to when your product falls apart with real study and knowledge of truth.

I feel sorry for Nelson giving his whole life up to carry on a lie.
Those who do not move do not notice their chains. —Rosa Luxemburg

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wtfluff
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Re: Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

Post by wtfluff » Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:10 pm

I sure wish old Joe Smith had doubted his doubts and never made his supposed trip to the "sacred grove."
Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus

Keep the company of those who seek the truth - run from those who have found it -Václav Havel

The Beauty of Gray

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Red Ryder
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Re: Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

Post by Red Ryder » Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:18 pm

wtfluff wrote:
Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:10 pm
I sure wish old Joe Smith had doubted his doubts and never made his supposed trip to the "sacred grove."
Had he followed the advice of RMN and not rehearsed his doubts with God, the restoration would have never happened. Isn’t it ironic?
Those who do not move do not notice their chains. —Rosa Luxemburg

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Hagoth
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Re: Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

Post by Hagoth » Sun Apr 04, 2021 8:30 pm

jfro18 wrote:
Sun Apr 04, 2021 6:57 pm
This stuff makes my blood boil because I know DW believes it and wants my kid to believe it too... and I know I'm not alone.
I can't imagine any version of reality in which you could be labeled a lazy learner, jfro. If you have been lazy in your studies that makes pretty much every believer I know a comatose learner.
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain

Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."

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Culper Jr.
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Re: Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

Post by Culper Jr. » Sun Apr 04, 2021 9:48 pm

God that talk pissed me off. So I just had a 2+ hour post conference discussion with DW --again-- about my issues with the church and how it affects our kid. It is EXHAUSTING!!! I know so much more about the history and doctrines of the church from reading copious amounts of material but I'm the lazy learner. She keeps trying to find the one thing I don't want to do or commandment I don't want to live that I'm basing all this on.. I keep telling her that I just don't believe that any of it is true based on extensive verifiable research. It just doesn't compute.. I'm just lazy and want to sin.

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moksha
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Re: Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

Post by moksha » Sun Apr 04, 2021 10:33 pm

Doubters may be lazy learners but better lazy learners than never learners, eh?
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

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Not Buying It
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Re: Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

Post by Not Buying It » Mon Apr 05, 2021 5:23 am

President Nelson is a pig. But then, it's either vilify doubters or admit they can't answer their questions, so they always go with the former. Bunch of cowards. I promise you, I did more earnest study in my doubting period than most members do in a whole lifetime. And I finally settled my doubts - by coming to the unavoidable conclusion its all a bunch of hogwash.

Don't let him get under your skin. He's an old man at the top of a failing sham religion.
"The truth is elegantly simple. The lie needs complex apologia. 4 simple words: Joe made it up. It answers everything with the perfect simplicity of Occam's Razor. Every convoluted excuse withers." - Some guy on Reddit called disposazelph

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Mormorrisey
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Re: Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

Post by Mormorrisey » Mon Apr 05, 2021 5:56 am

It's been pretty quiet in the Mormorrisey home, and the only "discussion" that was had over conference was a bit of a testy exchange between one of my kids and the wife about Anderson's abortion talk, which I stayed out of.

But on NOMference we all agreed that Nelson's talk was egregiously horrible. I'm not even going to begin to discuss it with the missus, because deep down she knows I'm not a lazy learner. In fact, given that this woman only reads her scriptures and Facebook, I'm pretty confident if the epithet "lazy" ever gets used to describe learning between the two of us, it ain't me.

But NBI's right. This is just a frustrated old man rant as the ship is sinking. And they know it's sinking. I've posted it on one of the NOMference threads, but take a look at the membership stats that they no longer give to us in conference:

https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.or ... cal-report

Pretty bleak. No commentary, no "look how we're growing!" They know there are problems, and I guess the only way to fix it is to build 20 more temples in the middle of nowhere to try and stem the bleeding. Good luck with that.
"And I don't need you...or, your homespun philosophies."
"And when you try to break my spirit, it won't work, because there's nothing left to break."

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græy
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Re: Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

Post by græy » Mon Apr 05, 2021 6:50 am

Hagoth wrote:
Sun Apr 04, 2021 8:30 pm
jfro18 wrote:
Sun Apr 04, 2021 6:57 pm
This stuff makes my blood boil because I know DW believes it and wants my kid to believe it too... and I know I'm not alone.
I can't imagine any version of reality in which you could be labeled a lazy learner, jfro. If you have been lazy in your studies that makes pretty much every believer I know a comatose learner.
Well said, and very true!
I'm better than dirt... well most dirt. Not that fancy store bought stuff, I can't compete with that... full of nutrients and everything. -Moe Sizlack

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Mormorrisey
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Re: Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

Post by Mormorrisey » Mon Apr 05, 2021 7:43 am

græy wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 6:50 am
Hagoth wrote:
Sun Apr 04, 2021 8:30 pm
jfro18 wrote:
Sun Apr 04, 2021 6:57 pm
This stuff makes my blood boil because I know DW believes it and wants my kid to believe it too... and I know I'm not alone.
I can't imagine any version of reality in which you could be labeled a lazy learner, jfro. If you have been lazy in your studies that makes pretty much every believer I know a comatose learner.
Well said, and very true!
Amen, brethren.
"And I don't need you...or, your homespun philosophies."
"And when you try to break my spirit, it won't work, because there's nothing left to break."

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Red Ryder
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Re: Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

Post by Red Ryder » Mon Apr 05, 2021 8:27 am

I think they purposely say stupid stuff to feed the TBM’s with a quick dose of Fundy Fabreeze to cover up the real problems.

They never address the foundational problems. Just push the look away doctrine.

Elder Ballard knows what I’m talking about.
Those who do not move do not notice their chains. —Rosa Luxemburg

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jfro18
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Re: Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

Post by jfro18 » Mon Apr 05, 2021 8:33 am

Red Ryder wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 8:27 am
I think they purposely say stupid stuff to feed the TBM’s with a quick dose of Fundy Fabreeze to cover up the real problems.

They never address the foundational problems. Just push the look away doctrine.

Elder Ballard knows what I’m talking about.
It's like the recent articles in the Ensign, I mean Liahona, that talk about those who leave and mixed faith families/marriages.

They will always say "My sweet Lilly left the church because she had doubts about the restored Gospel," but they'll NEVER say what they were in any specifics whatsoever.

That way the believing member can read it, think "Oh that's such a pity that Lilly couldn't be as righteous as me," and move on.

And it happens every time.

(ps: thanks for those who said I wasn't lazy - it's appreciated even though tomorrow I head to AZ to be around believing family for a week. I feel more anxious now which I know is dumb, but you always here those little comments that just rub you the wrong way)

Mackman
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Re: Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

Post by Mackman » Mon Apr 05, 2021 8:58 am

I predict this will send a few over the edge to resign !!!!!
Last edited by Mackman on Mon Apr 05, 2021 8:59 am, edited 1 time in total.

Mackman
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Re: Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

Post by Mackman » Mon Apr 05, 2021 8:58 am

I predict this will send a few over the edge to resign !!!!! Myself included. Perhaps someone knows the email address to resign

Reuben
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Re: Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

Post by Reuben » Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:27 am

Mackman wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 8:58 am
I predict this will send a few over the edge to resign !!!!! Myself included. Perhaps someone knows the email address to resign
Did you do that once already? I know someone here did, but I can't recall if it was you.

If it helps, the talk wasn't about you. I mean, yeah, it sounded like it was, but it was really about buttressing the framework of social threats used to keep believers loyal. It was "Don't become bad in the future" more than "These people are bad." Only leaders in weak positions need to do this.

Church leaders have been doing it since... uh, Joseph Smith, actually.

If you'd like a fun exercise you can share with a believer - depending on how you define fun - find all the stories in the Gospels where Jesus deals with doubt, and make a note of what he says and does about it. (I think there are ten and a handful.) Does he blame them and try to isolate them?

FWIW, I'm only sharing what I've come up with that keeps me from shouting and throwing things. The talk seriously pissed me off.
Learn to doubt the stories you tell about yourselves and your adversaries.

Mackman
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Re: Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

Post by Mackman » Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:42 am

Yes it was me. Ready to move on now with or without my wife.

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LSOF
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Re: Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

Post by LSOF » Mon Apr 05, 2021 1:07 pm

Lazy learners! They had better be hardworking and incurious, all the better to enrich us!!
"I appreciate your flesh needs to martyr me." Parture

"There is no contradiction between faith and science --- true science." Dr Zaius

Pastor, Lunar Society of Friends; CEO, Faithful Origins and Ontology League

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Linked
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Re: Doubters are lazy learners!!!!!

Post by Linked » Mon Apr 05, 2021 2:54 pm

LSOF wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 1:07 pm
Lazy learners! They had better be hardworking and incurious, all the better to enrich us!!
Hahaha, "lazy" isn't modifying "learners", both apply unmodified to the doubter! Good catch LSOF. If you have time to be a learner, you must be slacking on your many many assignments.
"I would write about life. Every person would be exactly as important as any other. All facts would also be given equal weightiness. Nothing would be left out. Let others bring order to chaos. I would bring chaos to order" - Kurt Vonnegut

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