Mormonism my way ?

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Mackman
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Mormonism my way ?

Post by Mackman » Mon Apr 12, 2021 8:38 am

Im considering showing up to church in a golf shirt and Jean's. Not doing any talks or taking any callings having it my way !!! Also considering trying to get excommunicated down the road!! Any thoughts on having it my way ? A long fall from grace after serving in the branch presidency, EQ president, GD teacher , primary teacher.

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jfro18
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Re: Mormonism my way ?

Post by jfro18 » Mon Apr 12, 2021 8:43 am

They won't ex you for wearing a golf shirt, but you'll get weird looks and lots of judgement.

If I were going to church still, I would make a lot of noise in the second hour every week - asking questions about history and bringing up church-sourced things that contradict what we're taught every week. Do it in a way that isn't saying "THIS IS NOT TRUE" but "Have any of you come across this and what does it mean?"

But that's just me... I had a friend who did that locally and he was effectively told to shut up on Sundays. :lol:

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Angel
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Re: Mormonism my way ?

Post by Angel » Mon Apr 12, 2021 10:22 am

While it is tempting to inflict uncomforted and pain on others as they have done unto us, it is best to take the high road. I was the first out in my family, did not attend church with them, used love and logic (did have those hard conversations with family - the people I cared about).

Best wishes to you!
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“You have learned something...That always feels at first as if you have lost something.” George Bernard Shaw
When it is dark enough, you can see the stars. ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson

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alas
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Re: Mormonism my way ?

Post by alas » Mon Apr 12, 2021 11:20 am

Too difficult now to get excommunicated for apostasy. They expect you to resign if you are merely unbelieving. It takes work and leading others out of the fold as a podcaster, stop youth interviews, or ordain women organizer to get exed. Me, I am too lazy to want all the work of organizing a huge ordain women movement, so if I wanted out badly enough in your position, I would just request name removal, then have that fight with my spouse. But as it is, my spouse just kindly requested that I keep my name on the records and be hard core inactive and he supports me in that by telling people to leave me alone.

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fetchface
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Re: Mormonism my way ?

Post by fetchface » Mon Apr 12, 2021 11:33 am

I was attending in jeans and colorful short-sleeved button-up shirts up until the Covid shutdown. I think it definitely sends the message that you aren't a company man, but nobody ever said anything to me. I was resigned and attending sacrament meeting with my wife, though. Zealous members might try to "correct" you if you are holding callings and wearing jeans.
Ubi Dubium Ibi Libertas
My blog: http://untanglingmybrain.blogspot.com/

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Palerider
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Re: Mormonism my way ?

Post by Palerider » Mon Apr 12, 2021 8:39 pm

Angel wrote:
Mon Apr 12, 2021 10:22 am
While it is tempting to inflict uncomforted and pain on others as they have done unto us, it is best to take the high road. I was the first out in my family, did not attend church with them, used love and logic (did have those hard conversations with family - the people I cared about).

Best wishes to you!

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Yep.

I may disagree with them (mormons) and their doctrine but people have a right to worship peacefully even in what others consider the wrong way. If one has a bone to pick with someone it's better done outside of their worship services.
"There is but one straight course, and that is to seek truth and pursue it steadily."

"Truth will ultimately prevail where there is pains to bring it to light."

George Washington

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jfro18
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Re: Mormonism my way ?

Post by jfro18 » Mon Apr 12, 2021 8:45 pm

Palerider wrote:
Mon Apr 12, 2021 8:39 pm
I may disagree with them (mormons) and their doctrine but people have a right to worship peacefully even in what others consider the wrong way. If one has a bone to pick with someone it's better done outside of their worship services.
My only push-back to this is that I believe members have a right to worship how they want, but they should also have all of the information.

The friend I mentioned above began asking questions as he began his faith journey - that he was shut down on Sundays only made him study outside information more thoroughly. I have to wonder if he might've stayed had he been given answers or at least had those questions at least entertained.

But yeah - if you go on Sundays trying to get excommunicated it's just never going to happen and it's going to alienate everyone around you... I tend to think you're not going to get ex'ed if they know you are aiming for it.

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2bizE
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Re: Mormonism my way ?

Post by 2bizE » Tue Apr 13, 2021 8:41 am

Mackman wrote:
Mon Apr 12, 2021 8:38 am
Im considering showing up to church in a golf shirt and Jean's. Not doing any talks or taking any callings having it my way !!! Also considering trying to get excommunicated down the road!! Any thoughts on having it my way ? A long fall from grace after serving in the branch presidency, EQ president, GD teacher , primary teacher.
There are plenty of ways to do it your way...consider over dressing in a tuxedo. Consider dressing like characters from the Bible or BOM. Like Satan, Joe Smith or Laman.
My wife said that the members started treating her differently when I wasn’t attending very often before Covid. So, also consider your spouse in the matter.
~2bizE

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Mormorrisey
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Re: Mormonism my way ?

Post by Mormorrisey » Tue Apr 13, 2021 8:53 am

I like Lindsay Hansen Park's description of being an "independent Mormon." That's how I look at it, and that's pretty clear what I am. And generally, regular "conformed" Mormons give such creatures a wide berth, as they give me. You don't have to be a giant d$#*head to be one, either. Just gently disagree with the perceived wisdom, and see what happens. Some have called for my head, some have ignored me, and thankfully, none have tried to save me. So if you are prepared for what happens, you too can be an independent Mormon.
"And I don't need you...or, your homespun philosophies."
"And when you try to break my spirit, it won't work, because there's nothing left to break."

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Angel
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Re: Mormonism my way ?

Post by Angel » Tue Apr 13, 2021 10:54 am

alas wrote:
Mon Apr 12, 2021 11:20 am
Too difficult now to get excommunicated for apostasy. They expect you to resign if you are merely unbelieving. It takes work and leading others out of the fold as a podcaster, stop youth interviews, or ordain women organizer to get exed. ...
Natasha Helfer is getting ex's soon - has been called to a disciplinary... I mean... "membership" council.
JD
As announced yesterday, my dear friend and colleague Natasha Helfer is facing excommunication from the Mormon church this Sunday for apostasy - and particularly for adhering to professional ethics and best practices regarding healthy sexuality.
In this video Natasha shares how we can best support her. This includes writing letters or emails to her stake president, spreading the word on social media, and showing up at her disciplinary council in Wichita this Sunday.
I’m looking into flights now. Is anyone interested in flying to Wichita as a group?
I will be interviewing Natasha tomorrow night at 6pm on Mormon Stories Podcast to discuss the background to this situation, and her thoughts and feelings. You can access the interview on the Mormon Stories Podcast Facebook page, or on our YouTube channel.
Let’s show Natasha our full love and support!!!! And please reach out if you want to travel to Wichita with us.
https://fb.watch/4RBjyCtPBj/
“You have learned something...That always feels at first as if you have lost something.” George Bernard Shaw
When it is dark enough, you can see the stars. ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson

Wonderment
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Re: Mormonism my way ?

Post by Wonderment » Wed Apr 14, 2021 1:03 am

Natasha Helfer is getting ex's soon - has been called to a disciplinary... I mean... "membership" council.

JD
As announced yesterday, my dear friend and colleague Natasha Helfer is facing excommunication from the Mormon church this Sunday for apostasy - and particularly for adhering to professional ethics and best practices regarding healthy sexuality.
In this video Natasha shares how we can best support her. This includes writing letters or emails to her stake president, spreading the word on social media, and showing up at her disciplinary council in Wichita this Sunday.
I’m looking into flights now. Is anyone interested in flying to Wichita as a group?
I will be interviewing Natasha tomorrow night at 6pm on Mormon Stories Podcast to discuss the background to this situation, and her thoughts and feelings. You can access the interview on the Mormon Stories Podcast Facebook page, or on our YouTube channel.
Let’s show Natasha our full love and support!!!! And please reach out if you want to travel to Wichita with us.

https://fb.watch/4RBjyCtPBj/

Speaking of Natasha Helfer and her upcoming disciplinary council, she did an interview with John Dehlin last night which was absolutely heartbreaking.
She's a marriage, family, and child therapist, who has helped many Mormons, including the LGBT community, with issues of sexuality and relationships. Her treatment from church officials has been pretty brutal.
My apologies to Mackman, as I don't mean to hijack this discussion thread about independent Mormons. But, rather than try to purposely aggravate officials into scheduling a hearing for you by wearing jeans, etc., I would consider another way of distancing from the church. The agony that the family goes through when one member is facing a disciplinary council can be fairly intense. I hope that never happens to you.

Here's the link to the YouTube video. Trigger warning- it's a very emotional interview. - Wndr.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uV7pJ2Q-2Hg

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moksha
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Re: Mormonism my way ?

Post by moksha » Wed Apr 14, 2021 3:13 am

Wonderment wrote:
Wed Apr 14, 2021 1:03 am
She's a marriage, family, and child therapist, who has helped many Mormons, including the LGBT community, with issues of sexuality and relationships. Her treatment from church officials has been pretty brutal.
I imagine all the people she helped will be leaving the Church as well.

The Church hates the LGBTQ community and all those associated with it. Proof? Look at what they do and not what they say.
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

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Hagoth
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Re: Mormonism my way ?

Post by Hagoth » Wed Apr 14, 2021 5:40 am

There you go, Mackman. If you want to make the local leaders uncomfortable enough to excommunicate you, just start openly supporting same-sex marriage and telling teenagers that masturbation is not a sin that affects your worthiness, and that there's a difference between a values model (whatever that means) and an addiction model regarding pornography. Sexuality is the scariest of Satan's tools.

Also, rather than a hawaiian shirt, you might try a shirt that buttons up on the other side, and maybe some fabulous shoes.
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain

Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."

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