Hunger in Africa and Latin America

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2bizE
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Hunger in Africa and Latin America

Post by 2bizE » Mon Jul 12, 2021 2:09 pm

If only the Africans and other impoverished people would pay their tithing….
https://www.ksl.com/article/50203270/wo ... he-un-says
~2bizE

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Hagoth
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Re: Hunger in Africa and Latin America

Post by Hagoth » Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:52 am

The Mormon church has enough money to actually make a difference on a global scale. Instead we prayed. But I guess our prayers overlooked the tens of millions of people who will starve to death this year as a consequence, in part, of the pandemic.
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain

Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."

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Not Buying It
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Re: Hunger in Africa and Latin America

Post by Not Buying It » Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:24 am

Hagoth wrote:
Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:52 am
The Mormon church has enough money to actually make a difference on a global scale. Instead we prayed. But I guess our prayers overlooked the tens of millions of people who will starve to death this year as a consequence, in part, of the pandemic.
Hey, we didn't "just" pray. We fasted too. Because nothing brings the power of God down from the heavens more powerfully than going without food. For some weird reason.
"The truth is elegantly simple. The lie needs complex apologia. 4 simple words: Joe made it up. It answers everything with the perfect simplicity of Occam's Razor. Every convoluted excuse withers." - Some guy on Reddit called disposazelph

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2bizE
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Re: Hunger in Africa and Latin America

Post by 2bizE » Tue Jul 13, 2021 10:05 am

Not Buying It wrote:
Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:24 am
Hagoth wrote:
Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:52 am
The Mormon church has enough money to actually make a difference on a global scale. Instead we prayed. But I guess our prayers overlooked the tens of millions of people who will starve to death this year as a consequence, in part, of the pandemic.
Hey, we didn't "just" pray. We fasted too. Because nothing brings the power of God down from the heavens more powerfully than going without food. For some weird reason.
But the fast was for Covid and not for the starving.
~2bizE

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Not Buying It
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Re: Hunger in Africa and Latin America

Post by Not Buying It » Wed Jul 14, 2021 5:23 am

2bizE wrote:
Tue Jul 13, 2021 10:05 am
Not Buying It wrote:
Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:24 am
Hagoth wrote:
Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:52 am
The Mormon church has enough money to actually make a difference on a global scale. Instead we prayed. But I guess our prayers overlooked the tens of millions of people who will starve to death this year as a consequence, in part, of the pandemic.
Hey, we didn't "just" pray. We fasted too. Because nothing brings the power of God down from the heavens more powerfully than going without food. For some weird reason.
But the fast was for Covid and not for the starving.
Damn. Guess we should have thought of that. You have to be specific when you fast from something from God I guess, how is he supposed to know what you really need?
"The truth is elegantly simple. The lie needs complex apologia. 4 simple words: Joe made it up. It answers everything with the perfect simplicity of Occam's Razor. Every convoluted excuse withers." - Some guy on Reddit called disposazelph

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Hagoth
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Re: Hunger in Africa and Latin America

Post by Hagoth » Wed Jul 14, 2021 5:59 am

The church's relationship with the poor and starving was made clear when Elder Anderson explained to Zimbabweans (just days before the Ensign Peak leak, if I recall correctly) that we cannot help them drill fresh water wells because "we are not a wealthy people." Not. Our. Problem.

We will happily collect tithing from them, though, if they are willing to forego things like what little food and medical care they might be able to afford. It sounds horrible that I'm even suggesting that, but I'm paraphrasing General Conference and the Ensign.
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain

Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."

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StarbucksMom
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Re: Hunger in Africa and Latin America

Post by StarbucksMom » Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:09 am

Hagoth wrote:
Wed Jul 14, 2021 5:59 am
The church's relationship with the poor and starving was made clear when Elder Anderson explained to Zimbabweans (just days before the Ensign Peak leak, if I recall correctly) that we cannot help them drill fresh water wells because "we are not a wealthy people." Not. Our. Problem.

We will happily collect tithing from them, though, if they are willing to forego things like what little food and medical care they might be able to afford. It sounds horrible that I'm even suggesting that, but I'm paraphrasing General Conference and the Ensign.
Exactly. This makes me sick to my stomach. The top 15, knowing full well how filthy rich their “church” is, stand up and say “This is Jesus’restored church because he stands at the head of it and directs it through Russ/Tommy/Gordon” and then completely ignore everything He said in the New Testament. They have even traveled to 3rd world countries on numerous occasions. I served in Guatemala. I have seen poverty up close and personal. How can they just not even care? Like stand up in conf. and demand tithing from these people and then turn around and build malls and condos?
Several years ago my son came home and told me about how they read “A Long Walk to Water” at school, based on a true story about a refugee boy and a 9yo girl who walks 2 hours every day to get fresh water from a pond. He also told me about a charity that the bot in the story started called “Water for South Sudan.” From their site:
Water for South Sudan's operations teams, based in Wau, work in remote villages in the Bahr el Ghazal region of South Sudan. These isolated villages have extremely limited access to clean water, and often can only access contaminated water that will lead to sickness or even death.
To date, WFSS has drilled more than 450 wells.

A well takes three to four days to build.

Each well pumps approximately 1,800 gallons of water per day and serves anywhere from 500 to 1000 people.

WFSS aims to drill 40-50 new wells each year, while also rehabilitating older wells and providing hygiene education.

One to two people in each village are trained on simple well maintenance.
In addition to not dying of disease, access to fresh water also allows girls to attend and finish school, helps villages not starve bc they can grow crops, etc etc. Imagine how many of these wells the mormons could build? African leaders actually asked for help directly, and Russ and Co said “nope.”
Please, if you are paying tithing, stop. Today.

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nibbler
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Re: Hunger in Africa and Latin America

Post by nibbler » Wed Jul 14, 2021 2:36 pm

It's pointless to ask such things but my human nature compels me...

Why? Why doesn't the church doesn't do more to help people with physical needs? Why doesn't the church buy equipment and train missionaries to drill wells? Or if they see missionaries drilling wells as taking too much time away from proselyting for new converts, why don't they fund other organizations that are dedicated to that work?

What are the reasons?

I'll take several stabs.
  • Not enough resources or worry about resources to cover future needs. tommy_lee_jones_peering_over_newspaper.jpg
  • Rich people-itis. After a certain point it becomes all about seeing how much larger the number representing your assets can get. Can't spend any because that subtracts from the total.
  • Leaders that formed their values either during or in the aftermath of the great depression.
  • Leaders descended from Scottish ancestors.
  • Hardcore bootstrappers. If we help them they'll never learn to help themselves.
  • Hardcore prosperity gospelers. Can't rob people of an opportunity to repent to escape poverty.
  • Don't want to create dependencies.
  • If you help people they'll keep coming to you for help.
  • Classic greed/selfishness.
  • What you don't know is that when a village gets a well, warlords come in and take over the town (or any unintended consequence that isn't visible on the surface).
  • We can't give money to the well digger group because only 60% of donations actually goes towards drilling wells and the other 40% goes to the CEO and administration costs.
  • Hoarding all the wealth to curb issues with global money supply/inflation. Money printer goes brrr? Mormon money vacuum goes vreeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.
Just curious as to what it could be. At this stage they need an entire committee to determine how to spend the money. I'd suggest multiplying every single ward's budget by five as a place to start.
We don’t see things as they are, we see them as we are.
– Anais Nin

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moksha
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Re: Hunger in Africa and Latin America

Post by moksha » Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:28 pm

Global warming will lead to more drought and food shortages. Water in the Hoover Dam is at a historic low.
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

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w2mz
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Re: Hunger in Africa and Latin America

Post by w2mz » Thu Jul 15, 2021 2:59 pm

moksha wrote:
Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:28 pm
Global warming will lead to more drought and food shortages. Water in the Hoover Dam is at a historic low.
This ^^

The church is building a multi-hundred million dollar temple just around the corner from my home. Why? Wouldn’t that money be much better spent building infrastructure to help preserve the water resources we so desperately need and will continue to need into the future? Are the church leaders just fnuking stupid or blind? Or maybe both?

Recently I’ve started to lose patience with true believers who don’t see the real issues we face as a people, and instead continue to worry about having a palace to do Masonic rituals for people long dead.
The church has engineered your eternal family into a commodity that can be purchased with an annual fee. The fact that full tithing payment is a requirement for saving ordinances is the biggest red flag imaginable. Hagoth

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moksha
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Re: Hunger in Africa and Latin America

Post by moksha » Fri Jul 16, 2021 2:18 am

w2mz wrote:
Thu Jul 15, 2021 2:59 pm
The church is building a multi-hundred million dollar temple just around the corner from my home. Why?
I know my heart weeps for all those homeless people just blocks from the Temple in SLC.
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

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