“By their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) - Seven years of sex abuse: How Mormon officials let it happen

This is for encouragement, ideas, and support for people going through a faith transition no matter where you hope to end up. This is also the place to laugh, cry, and love together.
User avatar
annotatedbom
Posts: 210
Joined: Wed Dec 04, 2019 6:39 pm
Contact:

“By their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) - Seven years of sex abuse: How Mormon officials let it happen

Post by annotatedbom » Thu Aug 04, 2022 8:38 am

https://www.yahoo.com/news/seven-years- ... 44796.html

Most of the time now Mormonism is at most a minor irritant, like a mosquito bite that's all but disappeared. But, then shit like this comes up and I think of the condescending saying, "They can leave the Church, but they can't leave it alone." Never mind that many do seem to leave it alone; never mind that for those of us who don't, we share that in common with former members of all sorts of harmful Church's (Google Leah Remini condescending believers); never mind that the Church is the one who drilled into me to open my mouth and warn people.

Who the hell thinks it's right to leave it alone when IT hurts people with abandon and without accountability? What kind of moral compass is that?

/rant

Thank you for letting me vent,
A-BoM

ETA:
I forgot to implore any who have minor children. If local LDS leaders may have access to your minor kids, and you haven't already laid down the law regarding this, please consider unambiguously specifying the details of your prohibition of local leaders interviewing your kids alone and asking any questions about sex. In my mind, these sex interviews are among the most harmful practices of the Church. Here is the text of the certified letter I sent to my bishop formally prohibiting such interviews.

If your interested in the exchange that took place before:
  • Second email from me in which I tell him "not good enough; expect my letter prohibiting sex interviews of my kids"
Last edited by annotatedbom on Thu Aug 04, 2022 10:25 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
jfro18
Posts: 1949
Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2018 8:41 pm

Re: “By their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) - Seven years of sex abuse: How Mormon officials let it happen

Post by jfro18 » Thu Aug 04, 2022 9:26 am

Yep. Funny how choose the right, let the consequence follow turns into call the lawyers and protect the dudes when it's the church that needs to do the right thing.

Reading this article as I'm in a plane and trying not to gasp out loud. This is insane.

User avatar
Red Ryder
Posts: 3735
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2016 5:14 pm

Re: “By their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) - Seven years of sex abuse: How Mormon officials let it happen

Post by Red Ryder » Thu Aug 04, 2022 2:12 pm

That article needs to come with a trigger warning.

It’s infuriating to see the patterns of protection applied to the church and not the children.

If anyone is interested in an amazing podcast listen to episode 80 of the At Least She Said It podcast.

It’s the story of a women who suffered abuse and has since taken a break from the church because the church system and church itself isn’t safe for her as she works through healing. Amazing episode.
“I switched baristas” —Lady Gaga

Those who do not move do not notice their chains. —Rosa Luxemburg

User avatar
wtfluff
Posts: 3332
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2016 3:20 pm
Location: Worshiping Gravity / Pulling Taffy

Re: “By their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) - Seven years of sex abuse: How Mormon officials let it happen

Post by wtfluff » Thu Aug 04, 2022 2:48 pm

The cover-up of abuse in LD$-Inc. is something that a lot of "us" on the outside "know about" but don't discuss all that much. Kind of like polygamy and how much it gets discussed amongst believing MORmONs.

It is my sincere hope that this sort of news get enough traction to wake up some people on the inside, and also disseminate more among people on the outside. Shout it from the rooftops as they say.




("It is my sincere hope..." "Shout it from the rooftops..." How's that for some good old MORmON-Speak? :evil: )
Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus

Keep the company of those who seek the truth - run from those who have found it -Václav Havel

The Beauty of Gray

User avatar
Angel
Posts: 503
Joined: Thu May 31, 2018 8:26 am

Re: “By their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) - Seven years of sex abuse: How Mormon officials let it happen

Post by Angel » Thu Aug 04, 2022 4:28 pm

There were 18 years of videos recovered for the hell we went through. During this time, he had all the callings- worked with youth, scouts, bishopric.

Callings do not come from God.
No spiritual guidance or leadership.
18 years of kids watching this guy get sustained by everyone...
Purity culture teaches kids to be quiet, hide.
The Church was founded by pedophiles, many current members rationalize it.
Not just one bad apple - the "addiction" support groups enable it. They sealed him to wife #2 without alerting her to why wife #1 left (insinuated wife#1 had problems).
Did not follow mandated reporting laws.

1 out of 4... what we are told in training (teacher). 1 out of 4 women have been assaulted.
“You have learned something...That always feels at first as if you have lost something.” George Bernard Shaw
When it is dark enough, you can see the stars. ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson

User avatar
annotatedbom
Posts: 210
Joined: Wed Dec 04, 2019 6:39 pm
Contact:

Re: “By their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) - Seven years of sex abuse: How Mormon officials let it happen

Post by annotatedbom » Thu Aug 04, 2022 7:54 pm

Angel wrote:
Thu Aug 04, 2022 4:28 pm
There were 18 years of videos recovered for the hell we went through. During this time, he had all the callings- worked with youth, scouts, bishopric.

Callings do not come from God.
No spiritual guidance or leadership.
18 years of kids watching this guy get sustained by everyone...
Purity culture teaches kids to be quiet, hide.
The Church was founded by pedophiles, many current members rationalize it.
Not just one bad apple - the "addiction" support groups enable it. They sealed him to wife #2 without alerting her to why wife #1 left (insinuated wife#1 had problems).
Did not follow mandated reporting laws.

1 out of 4... what we are told in training (teacher). 1 out of 4 women have been assaulted.
Jesus Angel, did this happen to you? I’m so sorry to hear this. I can’t imagine what you’ve gone through and maybe still go through.

I’ve read before what you said about 1 out of 4. Am I right to remember that this is an estimate for the US? Regardless, it speaks poorly of society. I can’t speak to how that compares to members of the Church, but certainly the strong patriarchal order of the Church fosters an environment where women and children are more vulnerable than they would be without the patriarchy. And, at the same time the Church enables “righteous” priesthood holders to benefit by the privilege of the deference given them by this system, so accountability is weakened. I’m just so sorry I supported that patriarchal system for so long.

User avatar
moksha
Posts: 4425
Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2016 4:22 am

Re: “By their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) - Seven years of sex abuse: How Mormon officials let it happen

Post by moksha » Thu Aug 04, 2022 8:44 pm

All those years of systematic abuse and silence only served to cement the complicity of the LDS Church in this and in thousands of other cases worldwide. This needs to be a much bigger story or else Kirton McConkie will never cease in their practice of harming these victims.
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

User avatar
fetchface
Posts: 121
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2016 6:45 pm

Re: “By their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) - Seven years of sex abuse: How Mormon officials let it happen

Post by fetchface » Thu Aug 04, 2022 9:49 pm

Oh, I feel sick after reading that.

To steal a line from Thomas Paine:
Speaking for myself, if I had no other evidence that the [church is false], than the sacrifice I must make to believe it to be true, that alone would be sufficient to determine my choice.
I just can't believe that this is the way the leaders want the church to function, yet it is. It's undeniable that it is.
Ubi Dubium Ibi Libertas
My blog: http://untanglingmybrain.blogspot.com/

Wonderment
Posts: 413
Joined: Fri Jul 21, 2017 3:38 pm

Re: “By their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) - Seven years of sex abuse: How Mormon officials let it happen

Post by Wonderment » Thu Aug 04, 2022 11:41 pm

I'm glad you posted this article, because I was just getting ready to post it. This is an absolute tragedy; and I fear that it has happened far more than we know about. -- Wndr.

User avatar
Not Buying It
Posts: 1284
Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2016 12:29 pm

Re: “By their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) - Seven years of sex abuse: How Mormon officials let it happen

Post by Not Buying It » Fri Aug 05, 2022 5:37 am

First, I want to express support for anyone of you who ever experienced something like this.

Second, the Church's response to situations like this tells you everything you need to know about the organization really - there is little concern for the victims, the organization's focus is always on defending itself in its statements. There is no more clear indication that people don't matter to the Church, even those who have endured horrific abuse - it only cares about itself.
"The truth is elegantly simple. The lie needs complex apologia. 4 simple words: Joe made it up. It answers everything with the perfect simplicity of Occam's Razor. Every convoluted excuse withers." - Some guy on Reddit called disposazelph

User avatar
annotatedbom
Posts: 210
Joined: Wed Dec 04, 2019 6:39 pm
Contact:

Re: “By their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) - Seven years of sex abuse: How Mormon officials let it happen

Post by annotatedbom » Fri Aug 05, 2022 7:55 am

Not Buying It wrote:
Fri Aug 05, 2022 5:37 am
First, I want to express support for anyone of you who ever experienced something like this.

Second, the Church's response to situations like this tells you everything you need to know about the organization really - there is little concern for the victims, the organization's focus is always on defending itself in its statements. There is no more clear indication that people don't matter to the Church, even those who have endured horrific abuse - it only cares about itself.
This^
The truth claims of the Church are silly, delusional, and demonstrably false in many instances, but we all believe silly things. It's the authority claims that are the kicker. They claim the authority to do whatever it takes (lie, cheat, and steal) to do whatever they say is the will of God. All too often, their claimed will of God seems indistinguishable from the desire to promote and protect a corporation, even at the expense of of the down-trodden and the forsaken.

User avatar
AdmiralHoldo
Posts: 354
Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2018 5:49 am
Location: Lazy Learner Land

Re: “By their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) - Seven years of sex abuse: How Mormon officials let it happen

Post by AdmiralHoldo » Fri Aug 05, 2022 9:09 am

Too bad Gordo isn't around to prophet-splain away this situation as "a blip here and a blip there."

User avatar
Angel
Posts: 503
Joined: Thu May 31, 2018 8:26 am

Re: “By their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) - Seven years of sex abuse: How Mormon officials let it happen

Post by Angel » Fri Aug 05, 2022 7:39 pm

annotatedbom wrote:
Thu Aug 04, 2022 7:54 pm
Angel wrote:
Thu Aug 04, 2022 4:28 pm
There were 18 years of videos recovered for the hell we went through. During this time, he had all the callings- worked with youth, scouts, bishopric.

Callings do not come from God.
No spiritual guidance or leadership.
18 years of kids watching this guy get sustained by everyone...
Purity culture teaches kids to be quiet, hide.
The Church was founded by pedophiles, many current members rationalize it.
Not just one bad apple - the "addiction" support groups enable it. They sealed him to wife #2 without alerting her to why wife #1 left (insinuated wife#1 had problems).
Did not follow mandated reporting laws.

1 out of 4... what we are told in training (teacher). 1 out of 4 women have been assaulted.
Jesus Angel, did this happen to you? I’m so sorry to hear this. I can’t imagine what you’ve gone through and maybe still go through.

I’ve read before what you said about 1 out of 4. Am I right to remember that this is an estimate for the US? Regardless, it speaks poorly of society. I can’t speak to how that compares to members of the Church, but certainly the strong patriarchal order of the Church fosters an environment where women and children are more vulnerable than they would be without the patriarchy. And, at the same time the Church enables “righteous” priesthood holders to benefit by the privilege of the deference given them by this system, so accountability is weakened. I’m just so sorry I supported that patriarchal system for so long.
I'm #823

https://protectldschildren.org/823-name-hidden-cs-5/

1/4 is from my safer colleges training.
“You have learned something...That always feels at first as if you have lost something.” George Bernard Shaw
When it is dark enough, you can see the stars. ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson

User avatar
AdmiralHoldo
Posts: 354
Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2018 5:49 am
Location: Lazy Learner Land

Re: “By their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) - Seven years of sex abuse: How Mormon officials let it happen

Post by AdmiralHoldo » Sat Aug 06, 2022 7:23 am

These fruits aren't just rotten. These are fruits where, when you bite into them, a swarm of hornets comes out and stings your face.

User avatar
Just This Guy
Posts: 1367
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2016 3:30 pm
Location: Almost Heaven

Re: “By their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) - Seven years of sex abuse: How Mormon officials let it happen

Post by Just This Guy » Sat Aug 06, 2022 8:58 am

annotatedbom wrote:
Thu Aug 04, 2022 8:38 am
I forgot to implore any who have minor children. If local LDS leaders may have access to your minor kids, and you haven't already laid down the law regarding this, please consider unambiguously specifying the details of your prohibition of local leaders interviewing your kids alone and asking any questions about sex. In my mind, these sex interviews are among the most harmful practices of the Church. Here is the text of the certified letter I sent to my bishop formally prohibiting such interviews.
I came close to sending something similar to the ward where my parents would take my kids to church. Fortunately, my kids got bored with church and stopped going with my parents.

One suggestion on your letter. I would include a clause stating that you will record any interview that you attend with your children. Furthermore, you reserve the right to publicly publish any part of the interview. Knowing that you will hold them accountable for their actions publicly will have a reaction.
"The story so far: In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move." -- Douglas Adams

User avatar
alas
Posts: 2024
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2016 2:10 pm

Re: “By their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) - Seven years of sex abuse: How Mormon officials let it happen

Post by alas » Sat Aug 06, 2022 1:00 pm

Sometimes the only thing I can do is incoherent screaming. I try to avoid that, but then I am just too exhausted and my feelings have gone completely numb. So, forgive me for not adding anything worthwhile to this discussion. I just can’t.

User avatar
stealthbishop
Posts: 319
Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2018 9:25 am

Re: “By their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) - Seven years of sex abuse: How Mormon officials let it happen

Post by stealthbishop » Mon Aug 08, 2022 10:50 am

What can I say? How many people including Alas and many others all the way through Sam Young and beyond have been talking about this sh*t for years and trying to beg and plead and scream and shame the church for some measure of reforms. The bottom line is that the LDS church is not a safe place for children. What did Jesus say again about offending the little ones? LDS church--you deserve a millstone.
"Take second best
Put me to the test
Things on your chest
You need to confess"

-Depeche Mode

User avatar
annotatedbom
Posts: 210
Joined: Wed Dec 04, 2019 6:39 pm
Contact:

Re: “By their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) - Seven years of sex abuse: How Mormon officials let it happen

Post by annotatedbom » Tue Aug 09, 2022 9:59 am

AdmiralHoldo wrote:
Fri Aug 05, 2022 9:09 am
Too bad Gordo isn't around to prophet-splain away this situation as "a blip here and a blip there."
OMG! I imagine this being said in the voice of one of my daughters who not infrequently uses the term "man-splain."

Prophet-splainin' is just a further extension of the problemed patriarchy.


Mackman
Posts: 291
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2018 10:03 am
Location: Mjchigan

Re: “By their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) - Seven years of sex abuse: How Mormon officials let it happen

Post by Mackman » Tue Aug 09, 2022 10:25 am

Wow this is terrible, I knew of Sam Youngs efforts but somehow this post hit me really hard especially being a sex abuse survivor as a child although well before my days of being in the church. My abuse was at the hands of my Dad. I am sorry to all those that went through this abuse my heart goes out to you. Pretty obvious the church is a very very sick and twisted organization that needs to go straight to Hell !!!

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 22 guests