NOM

My oldest lives at home and is in his 2nd year at college. He is underage, and he wants to go to parties and drink. He said he wanted to stay overnight at a friend's place because he wants to drink and not worry about driving home. I was not okay with that, and told him why. After relenting, he said we would have to revisit the issue. He told me he got drunk at a convention he went to for a group club out of town months ago. I am not surprised at that. I just don't really know how to handle this because his dad and I have no experience with drinking in college. Anyway, any advice? I told him not drinking until he is 21 is the best way to go. He said it's just a random number, and that police weren't going to storm the party he planned on attending anyway. I know alcohol is readily available at social stuff he goes to at college, so this isn't going to really go away.

Generally alcohol tastes bad. People pursue it for other reasons related to it's psychological and physical reactions.

It might just be individuation and exploring.

If it's the euphoria, relaxation effects, then some form of meditation might be something they would find meaningful in addition to the effects they can learn to self induce/achieve.

They might find psilocybin a better path even.

If it's social lubrication, some form of self help or anxiety therapy might be beneficial.

If it's self medication, therapy is in order.

From a physical health perspective, no amount of alcohol is safe. My kids think it tastes revolting. I'm glad.

I came across a post on Reddit a week or two ago that I found helpful. It was about similar circumstances. The advice came down to this. Your children will either choose to drink or not. If they do, they need to understand what it means to be responsible and that their life can change in an instant due to their choices. For example, they need to know that they should never drive drunk. In the Reddit post, the person responding said their parents had a “call us anytime for a ride… no questions asked.” Another person responded that their parents left a $100 bill in a kitchen drawer so they always new they could call a cab for a ride home and pay for it once dropped off at their house. Again, no questions asked. Just be safe. I’m sure the same set up could be done with An Uber or Lyft. Prepaid ride or credit card attached to Uber etc.

College is a time where kids will explore alcohol regardless of legal age limits. Considering your son still lives at home, I think it’s appropriate to set boundaries and rules under your roof. I also think a few hard conversations need to happen to help educate an underage minor. When it comes to alcohol there’s a level of safety that both male and female should be careful about. Drinks getting spiked with roofies. Etc. no means no. A lot of date rape situations occur when alcohol is involved.

I think the best thing a parent can do is to be open and honest and educate so that when the time come they can make a (better) educated decision.

We’ve recently learned our college age daughter has had a few drinks. When we expressed concern and interest she was able to describe her safety measures and it turned into a great teaching moment. She also knows she can call anytime for any reason and we will be there for her. No questions asked. At least until time has passed and cooler heads prevail.

It’s rough parenting even the older kids who are adults.

But love and caring goes along way.

I recently read an article that said that if the person’s first experience with alcohol was getting drunk before their brain was mature, that it permanently changes their brain leaving them craving alcohol. That is the first step to alcoholism. Their first drinking experience can cause alcoholism.

And no, 21 is not an arbitrary number. Young men’s brains are not mature until about 22 and young woman’s brains mature faster being mature about 20. There is a good scientific reason that the age of 21 was designated as the minimum age that drinking is safe. The rule was set up because immature brains cannot make choices that take into consideration the possible consequences of their behavior. Meaning they don’t know when to stop drinking or if doing certain things is stupid or if they are too drunk to drive. They can know intellectually that drinking and driving are not safe, but in situation they do not have the cognitive ability to make safe choices. It is a real part of being young and the reason so many collage are people are killed by drinking too much or by making stupid choices while under the influence.

dogbite wrote: ↑

Sat Aug 27, 2022 8:52 pm

Generally alcohol tastes bad. People pursue it for other reasons related to it's psychological and physical reactions.
......
From a physical health perspective, no amount of alcohol is safe. My kids think it tastes revolting. I'm glad.

If alcohol tastes bad, then you are trying the wrong alcohol. There are MANY options out there and some are better than others.

And, no, alcohol is not all bad, medically. There are plenty of studies that show health benefits from moderate drinking. There are downsides. So the science is still undecided and ongoing.

Here is one article about the health benefits of red wine on a person's heart from the Mayo Clinic.
https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-con ... t-20048281

Harvard talks about beer and wine decreasing risk of heart attack here:
https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritions ... er-better/

To the OP:

First off, I find that making something forbidden is one way to make a child more interested in it. So you have to be very careful telling them not to do something. Now that they are over 18, you are very limited in how much you can do for them. At this point, it may be better to stress safe drinking other than no drinking.

However, you may want to stress the legal implications of what they are doing. They are under 21. What they are doing is illegal. What is worse is that the consequences for whoever is enabling them is a lot worse than it would be for them. Do they want to risk their friends being charged with providing alcohol to under age people? Next what are the consequences from the school if they get caught? Many universities will have zero tolerance policies to providing under age drinking, meaning that if caught, they are kicked out of the school.

If he want to go drinking, than you may want to consider having him move out. If he wants to act like an adult, then he can have everything that goes with it.

I know you may not like the idea, but if he goes out partying, consider calling a tip into your local police department to report underage drinking.

Just This Guy wrote: ↑

Mon Aug 29, 2022 9:04 am

...
And, no, alcohol is not all bad, medically. There are plenty of studies that show health benefits from moderate drinking. There are downsides. So the science is still undecided and ongoing.

Here is one article about the health benefits of red wine on a person's heart from the Mayo Clinic.
https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-con ... t-20048281

Harvard talks about beer and wine decreasing risk of heart attack here:
https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritions ... er-better/
...

I have heard skeptical doctors say that articles such as those linked above "pick and choose the data" from the studies that claim that alcohol consumption can be "good for you."

Those skeptic's basic argument is: If you really dig into the studies, most of them look at people who drink too much, and then start drinking less (for example: a male who drinks 4 drinks a day cuts back to 2 drinks a day and becomes "healthier.") I personally haven't "dug into" any of the actual studies myself. I have seen LOTS of these articles with headlines about alcohol being "healthy." I guess you should take my preaching with a few grains of hear-say salt.

Personally, I'd be highly suspicious of any doctor that would recommend that someone "Start drinking for the health benefits."

All of the above Fluffy typing was produced by someone who enjoys a bit of ethanol now and then...



And, I have no advice about how to deal with kiddos. Mine were all raised in a thick enough MORmON bubble that they're still obeying the WoW because of their beliefs, or they're deathly afraid of the stuff because it "will kill you," even though they are of legal age. The younger of the crew has no interest whatsoever.

I’ve heard alcohol can unwind years of Mormon sexual repression and inhibitions in one evening.

I won’t argue about health benefits as common sense tells me abstinence is probably the true healthy choice when it comes to alcohol. Read through the alcohol related subreddits if you want a taste of what it takes to quit drinking.

It’s a bit of irony that some of us are trying to start in our later years and having a hard time finding what we like. The bar tender doesn’t care if you grew up Mormon but will make you a sweet drink to accommodate the Mormon palette.

We could play dueling links, but just for contrast,

Brain damage
https://www.forbes.com/sites/elvaramire ... 93142e7eaa
cancer risks override other claimed benefits
https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/ ... 8585ff4737

If they're adults they'll make their own choices. They have to and they should. You've really got to start from that foundation. (Even when they're younger than they'll still make their own choices, but that's not the discussion here, I don't think.)

As parents of adults, we really cannot dictate to them what they can and cannot do. We cannot tell them they cannot drink. Well, we can, but it's counter-productive. What we can try to do is to help them understand the choices and consequences of the choices. Drinking before age 21 is against the law in the U.S. (mostly). Choosing to drink is a choice that should be understood. Choosing to not drive and stay over after drinking is generally a better choice. Choosing to get drunk is generally not really a great choice, but is commonly socially acceptable.

At the university where our kids have attended they require incoming freshmen take an online course about info on alcohol and possible dangers. I reviewed it when at least one of our kids took it and it was generally informative and useful. It's valuable for anyone who chooses alcohol to have some info like that. We can help our kids to obtain that if it isn't required for them like with our kids.

Our youngest drank before he turned 21. We took a family trip through France and Italy. Unlike on my trips to France years ago, this time we enjoyed the integration of wine with the local cuisine. There is essentially no minimum drinking age for wine in France and Italy. We ordered wine when we wanted and shared it around the table, especially when it came by the pitcher. Our kids, all of legal U.S. drinking age now, choose to drink little alcohol. When we have some with dinner table sometimes they choose to drink it.

It's about learning to make wise choices. Sometimes we can help our kids learn some ways to do that.