NOM

I don't live anywhere near Utah. I understand that a lot of Mormons are upset about the new flag. It looks to me like it has the beehive as the dominant feature. What is the problem with the new flag for Mormons?

I just find it funny that the Utah flag now features a symbol that came from the Masons.

blazerb wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 22, 2023 10:04 am

I don't live anywhere near Utah. I understand that a lot of Mormons are upset about the new flag. It looks to me like it has the beehive as the dominant feature. What is the problem with the new flag for Mormons?

MORmONs think the new flag is too "Woke" .


Yes, I laughed when I heard the above sentence and looked at the new flag. I don't get it. I mean... the new flag is the old flag with some mountans and a bit more color. They will continue to use the old flag as the "ceremonial flag" which to me means they'll probably display both of them constantly.

Maybe whining about the new flag feeds the MORmON persecution complex?

I have not seen the new flag. Does it have a picture of the SL temple on it or a picture of a prophet?

My problem with it is that it's a complete waist of my state tax money!

blazerb wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 22, 2023 10:04 am

I don't live anywhere near Utah. I understand that a lot of Mormons are upset about the new flag. It looks to me like it has the beehive as the dominant feature. What is the problem with the new flag for Mormons?

My sister in Law reported that the Daughter's of the Utah Pioneers recent meeting had much weeping and sadness.

2bizE wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 22, 2023 12:14 pm

I have not seen the new flag. Does it have a picture of the SL temple on it or a picture of a prophet?

wtfluff wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 22, 2023 1:29 pm

2bizE wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 22, 2023 12:14 pm

I have not seen the new flag. Does it have a picture of the SL temple on it or a picture of a prophet?

Simple. Plain. Looks like the colors of the USA (red, white, blue). I’m surprised the colors aren’t Red, Yellow and Blue. I get the beehive. Not sure what the lone star means. Will have to google.
https://flag.utah.gov/

2bizE wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 22, 2023 3:14 pm

Simple. Plain. Looks like the colors of the USA (red, white, blue). I’m surprised the colors aren’t Red, Yellow and Blue. I get the beehive. Not sure what the lone star means. Will have to google.

This design will also not age well IMO. The star is like the kitch some folks like to put on their middle class fancy houses around here:

The old flag looks like they were trying REALLY hard to convince the rest of the nation that they were real Americans, not weirdo polygamist separatists that they really were. Kind of like they're still trying to convince the nation that they are real MAGA Christians, not weirdo cultists.

I read somewhere that there was another design that had a star with one point of the star for each native tribe that was in Utah. Tribes that were there years ago before a half-a-dozen of these Mormons arrived in upper Utah (now they number over twelve hundred).

Someone scrapped that and it looks like they ended up with a star that's a copy and paste from the USA flag.

blazerb wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 22, 2023 10:04 am

I don't live anywhere near Utah. I understand that a lot of Mormons are upset about the new flag. It looks to me like it has the beehive as the dominant feature. What is the problem with the new flag for Mormons?

I can't imagine

Not enough MAGA symbolism?

The furor of the very idea of changing the flag is basic conservatism -- Someone is suggesting to change something that I've never ever thought of before. This is an assault on everything I've ever stood for. It's just these "others" trying to ruin everything for the rest of us.

It's even worse when the thing to be changed is a symbol, because conservatives take the symbol as the thing and then get upset when someone changes "everything".


The Utah state flag, like those of many other states, is awful. Quite a few of them just take their state seal and slap it onto a blue background and call it their state flag. The Utah seal isn't bad, but as a flag it's terrible. A couple of years ago we walked down the display of flags at Mount Rushmore and Utah's was impossible to pick out from all of the others that are so similar. And then, for many decades, the Utah state flag was actually wrong. Someone created a version that was an incorrect depiction of the seal and sold it and then all flags created afterwards persisted the mistake. They discovered that only in 2010, showing just how much people have paid attention to the Utah flag.

There are a number of other good examples of state flags and, interestingly, many of them are from states near Utah. The New Mexico one is generally considered one of the best. The Colorado and Arizona ones are often highly regarded. Wyoming and California have pretty decent, recognizable, meaningful flags. Texas has a good one.

IMO, the new proposed flag isn't as good as some of the finalists. It's too busy. They intended to cram too much meaning into it, when the flag should just be an identifiable symbol.

If you want to see an example of a great flag, look at Ukraine's. It's very simple and easily identifiable. It's very meaningful to the people it represents. It's easy to make, which has enabled it to bloom wherever the invaders have been repulsed.

The U.S. Flag Code states, "The flag should never be used as wearing apparel, bedding, or drapery. It should never be festooned, drawn back, nor up, in folds, but always allowed to fall free." This is one of the things that really annoys me about right-wing "patriots", how they proclaim their allegiance to the country and get terribly upset about anyone else dissing any symbol but freely abuse the ignore the actual guidelines for those symbols.

Personally, I think the Flag code is overly obsessive at times, and I think of the flag as merely a symbolic piece of cloth, but I do try to adhere to the Flag Code, unless there's a reason not to. And I recognize that there are reasons and that the Code is being violated. (The Flag Code, like the pirate code, is really more of a guideline than actual rules.)

The Colorado flag, in contrast, has no similar flag code provisions. It is marketed and sold for clothing, signs, household decor and many other things. The team colors of our local university are green and gold, but they also have uniforms based upon the Colorado state flag, which is after all fitting, because they are the Colorado State University. (They also have orange uniforms, to honor their history as Aggies.)

Jeffret wrote: ↑

Fri Mar 24, 2023 8:38 am

This is one of the things that really annoys me about right-wing "patriots", how they proclaim their allegiance to the country and get terribly upset about anyone else dissing any symbol but freely abuse the ignore the actual guidelines for those symbols.

And they have no problem with their favorite president humping their beloved flag.

Jeffret wrote: ↑

Fri Mar 24, 2023 8:38 am

The U.S. Flag Code states, "The flag should never be used as wearing apparel, bedding, or drapery. It should never be festooned, drawn back, nor up, in folds, but always allowed to fall free." This is one of the things that really annoys me about right-wing "patriots", how they proclaim their allegiance to the country and get terribly upset about anyone else dissing any symbol but freely abuse the ignore the actual guidelines for those symbols.

Personally, I think the Flag code is overly obsessive at times, and I think of the flag as merely a symbolic piece of cloth, but I do try to adhere to the Flag Code, unless there's a reason not to. And I recognize that there are reasons and that the Code is being violated. (The Flag Code, like the pirate code, is really more of a guideline than actual rules.)

The Colorado flag, in contrast, has no similar flag code provisions. It is marketed and sold for clothing, signs, household decor and many other things. The team colors of our local university are green and gold, but they also have uniforms based upon the Colorado state flag, which is after all fitting, because they are the Colorado State University. (They also have orange uniforms, to honor their history as Aggies.)

One of my pet peeves. Also add to the list flags still up in really bad weather or so dirty or tattered it is disgusting. I have seen flags in Trump country that are so dirty and tattered I wouldn’t use a dishcloth in that shape. One was so frayed and the stripes had come unsewn and then torn off that it was half sized, the stripes being wind tattered until it was almost up to the stars portion.

I see one like that and say to DH, “wasn’t that person ever a Boy Scout?” And my sweetly replies, “Most likely as we are in Mormon country, but Trumps style of patriotism trumps anything they learned in scouts.