Martinsburg Abuse Coverup Case

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Just This Guy
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Re: Martinsburg Abuse Coverup Case

Post by Just This Guy » Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:06 pm

ABC's Night line is airing a program about this coverup late tonight. I am being told it is scheduled for 12:35 AM eastern time, Saturday 6-29-19. Maybe a more reasonable time for people further west. Myself, that is way too late.

I'll post links when they are available.

So, once this program hits, what major change will the church roll out next week to take attention away from this?
"The story so far: In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move." -- Douglas Adams

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wtfluff
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Re: Martinsburg Abuse Coverup Case

Post by wtfluff » Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:24 pm

Just This Guy wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:06 pm
So, once this program hits, what major change will the church roll out next week to take attention away from this?
Ready.

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Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus

Keep the company of those who seek the truth - run from those who have found it -Václav Havel

Brilliant.

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blazerb
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Re: Martinsburg Abuse Coverup Case

Post by blazerb » Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:26 pm

wtfluff wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:24 pm
Just This Guy wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:06 pm
So, once this program hits, what major change will the church roll out next week to take attention away from this?
Ready.

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The problem is that Homer needs to be popping vitamins.

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2bizE
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Re: Martinsburg Abuse Coverup Case

Post by 2bizE » Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:33 pm

thanks. I have it set to record.
~2bizE

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Hagoth
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Re: Martinsburg Abuse Coverup Case

Post by Hagoth » Sat Jun 29, 2019 7:22 am

Did anyone see it?
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain

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Anon70
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Re: Martinsburg Abuse Coverup Case

Post by Anon70 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:35 am

I watched part 1 & 2 from the links. Sickening. I also felt like there were some details missing based on what I’ve read about the case over the last year. The mother should have been prosecuted for actively pursuing homes with children for her son to be in/babysit for. She knew he was a predator and basically gave him additional victims. Those poor families.

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Palerider
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Re: Martinsburg Abuse Coverup Case

Post by Palerider » Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:42 am

I read the extended article on the program. Terribly sad for those kids involved.

An honest person can come to no other conclusion than that the church's reputation takes priority over any sense of truth telling or harm that might come to innocent children.

The "church" is a godless monstrosity masquerading as an exclusive club provided by God for his special people. Cult, cult, cult, cult. :(

https://www.google.com/amp/s/abcnews.go ... d=63690802
"There is but one straight course, and that is to seek truth and pursue it steadily."

"Truth will ultimately prevail where there is pains to bring it to light."

George Washington

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jfro18
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Re: Martinsburg Abuse Coverup Case

Post by jfro18 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 11:41 am

I just read the article - it is horrifying.

As I read the first two parts I thought "This is terrible but it's really nothing the church itself could've prevented," and then you're just slammed over the head in the last part with how the church hid details of Jensen's abuse when they moved to WV along with how they let him go on a mission and then denied meetings with the victims whether it was the bishop of the church itself.

Awful. Awful. Awful.

TBMs love to speak of the power of discernment when things are OK and then blame people having free agency when they abuse it. When will they ever admit leaders have no #$%$# discernment and it's all a gigantic MLM masquerading as a religion.

This is so angering... he was given a temple recommend and sent on a mission even after the church knew he was charged in Utah and then accused in WV. Must be nice.

ETA: That mom should absolutely be in jail with her son - she knew what he was doing and actively pushed him out so that he would do things to other kids and not her own. Without question she should be in jail.

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Just This Guy
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Re: Martinsburg Abuse Coverup Case

Post by Just This Guy » Sat Jun 29, 2019 4:46 pm

"The story so far: In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move." -- Douglas Adams

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Hagoth
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Re: Martinsburg Abuse Coverup Case

Post by Hagoth » Sun Jun 30, 2019 6:32 am

The statement by the church at the end is really interesting. They paid off the families an undisclosed amount but denied that the church was responsible in any way. I wish they had shown the instructions in the handbook that advise bishops to call not the police, but the church's lawyers when such abuse is reported.
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain

Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."

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wtfluff
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Re: Martinsburg Abuse Coverup Case

Post by wtfluff » Sun Jun 30, 2019 8:18 pm

Hagoth wrote:
Sun Jun 30, 2019 6:32 am
The statement by the church at the end is really interesting. They paid off the families an undisclosed amount but denied that the church was responsible in any way. I wish they had shown the instructions in the handbook that advise bishops to call not the police, but the church's lawyers when such abuse is reported.
That last statement from LD$-Inc. though:
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints wrote:It is unreasonable to believe that the Church could have foreseen what child psychology experts and the state's legal system did not.
Spirit of discernment?

Prophets?

Seers?

Revelators?


ABSOLUTELY NOT. Just a bunch of good-old-boys paying millions, if not billions of dollars of tithing money to protect their corporation and themselves. Sickening, cowardly old men.
Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus

Keep the company of those who seek the truth - run from those who have found it -Václav Havel

Brilliant.

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moksha
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Re: Martinsburg Abuse Coverup Case

Post by moksha » Sun Jun 30, 2019 11:41 pm

wtfluff wrote:
Sun Jun 30, 2019 8:18 pm
That last statement from LD$-Inc. though:

"The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints"]It is unreasonable to believe that the Church could have foreseen what child psychology experts and the state's legal system did not.
The difference is that the LDS Church had knowledge of past abuse in Arizona and yet placed this young man in a direct situation where further abuse was likely. Too bad they could not have recommended the troubled young man for the position of a grocery clerk rather than a baby sitter.

Why does the Church always feel compelled to lie and then cover things up with even more lies?
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

Exiled
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Re: Martinsburg Abuse Coverup Case

Post by Exiled » Fri Jul 05, 2019 9:13 am

moksha wrote:
Sun Jun 30, 2019 11:41 pm
wtfluff wrote:
Sun Jun 30, 2019 8:18 pm
That last statement from LD$-Inc. though:

"The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints"]It is unreasonable to believe that the Church could have foreseen what child psychology experts and the state's legal system did not.
The difference is that the LDS Church had knowledge of past abuse in Arizona and yet placed this young man in a direct situation where further abuse was likely. Too bad they could not have recommended the troubled young man for the position of a grocery clerk rather than a baby sitter.

Why does the Church always feel compelled to lie and then cover things up with even more lies?
It's a problem with organizations. No one wants to admit that there are problems, that the image they project is wrong or less than. Also, when an organization admits fault, there is a possibility that the flood gates will be opened and the believing population will turn away. In the case of the church, how many will deny that the church is at fault as long as there is plausible deniability? I have a TBM friend and we were discussing the Bishop case recently. She at first denied that Bishop could have done the things he was alleged to have done. Then after listening to the police interview and the interview Denson did with Bishop, only then did she waiver a little bit, admitting that it was possible that Bishop did some things wrong, not rape but maybe some things that were questionable. However, she then retrenched to the church could not have known about this and how can the church stop bad acts .... free agency .....

Now, if the church comes out and admits that it knew all along about Bishop but continually thought he was on the road to repentance, etc., what could she say to that? How could she continue the defense? Perhaps she would start down the road to questioning more and more and the church would lose yet another member. So, from the church's standpoint, it is better to never admit anything and keep up the illusion so the believing member can continue to defend the church and continue to misinterpret the possible deniability memes the church pushes.

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Just This Guy
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Re: Martinsburg Abuse Coverup Case

Post by Just This Guy » Sat Jul 06, 2019 6:45 am

When you lie too much, it becomes habit and you lie when you don't need to or when you know it would be detrimental to you. Sounds like the church has a case of pathological lying.

Couple that with the fact that their first loyalty is to themselves and the leadership in the church. The compulsion to lie is compounded.

In the Martinburg case, the church lawyers told the bishops to hide the abuse instead of going to law enforcement as required was/is required by law. They give low level leadership bad info to protect higher level leadership.

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"The story so far: In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move." -- Douglas Adams

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Just This Guy
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Re: Martinsburg Abuse Coverup Case

Post by Just This Guy » Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:38 am

An update on this.

https://www.journal-news.net/journal-ne ... a4f6e.html

The perpetrator got his first parole date moved up by 20 years. He would be first eligible for parole in 2027.

I have mixed thoughts on this one. Someone who has a long history of child abuse and molestation needs to be away from society. However, this ruling was done to bring his sentencing into line with state law regarding sentencing of minors. I see both sides here.

The most troubling thing is the lawyer who won that appeal was an employee of K&M. So somehow the church is still involved here and trying to affect the case. I don't know if it is sour grapes about their loss, or something else.

The perp. is serving 35-75 years for multiple child molestation. Also ordered to register as a sex offender for life and must serve 50 years supervised release if/when he does get out.

There have been several protests in Martinsburg, WV against the prosecutor's office over this.
"The story so far: In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move." -- Douglas Adams

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2bizE
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Re: Martinsburg Abuse Coverup Case

Post by 2bizE » Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:45 am

Just This Guy wrote:
Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:38 am
An update on this.

https://www.journal-news.net/journal-ne ... a4f6e.html

The perpetrator got his first parole date moved up by 20 years. He would be first eligible for parole in 2027.

I have mixed thoughts on this one. Someone who has a long history of child abuse and molestation needs to be away from society. However, this ruling was done to bring his sentencing into line with state law regarding sentencing of minors. I see both sides here.

The most troubling thing is the lawyer who won that appeal was an employee of K&M. So somehow the church is still involved here and trying to affect the case. I don't know if it is sour grapes about their loss, or something else.

The perp. is serving 35-75 years for multiple child molestation. Also ordered to register as a sex offender for life and must serve 50 years supervised release if/when he does get out.

There have been several protests in Martinsburg, WV against the prosecutor's office over this.
It feels good that the folks in W.V. are staying alert to this case, as it really affected entire communities. One thing with sex offenders, is justice often seems to prevail often in odd ways.
~2bizE

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Yobispo
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Re: Martinsburg Abuse Coverup Case

Post by Yobispo » Tue Sep 10, 2019 8:23 am

2bizE wrote:
Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:45 am
Just This Guy wrote:
Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:38 am
An update on this.

https://www.journal-news.net/journal-ne ... a4f6e.html

The perpetrator got his first parole date moved up by 20 years. He would be first eligible for parole in 2027.

I have mixed thoughts on this one. Someone who has a long history of child abuse and molestation needs to be away from society. However, this ruling was done to bring his sentencing into line with state law regarding sentencing of minors. I see both sides here.

The most troubling thing is the lawyer who won that appeal was an employee of K&M. So somehow the church is still involved here and trying to affect the case. I don't know if it is sour grapes about their loss, or something else.

The perp. is serving 35-75 years for multiple child molestation. Also ordered to register as a sex offender for life and must serve 50 years supervised release if/when he does get out.

There have been several protests in Martinsburg, WV against the prosecutor's office over this.
It feels good that the folks in W.V. are staying alert to this case, as it really affected entire communities. One thing with sex offenders, is justice often seems to prevail often in odd ways.
I hope you're right about justice finding a way. I get a little ragey when I think about the church protecting itself before innocents. Isn't there a scripture about offending the "little ones"?

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Just This Guy
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Re: Martinsburg Abuse Coverup Case

Post by Just This Guy » Tue Sep 10, 2019 8:40 am

Yobispo wrote:
Tue Sep 10, 2019 8:23 am
I hope you're right about justice finding a way. I get a little ragey when I think about the church protecting itself before innocents. Isn't there a scripture about offending the "little ones"?

Well, the PoX pretty conclusively showed they completely ignore that part of Jesus's teachings/warning.
"The story so far: In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move." -- Douglas Adams

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moksha
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Re: Martinsburg Abuse Coverup Case

Post by moksha » Tue Sep 10, 2019 11:37 pm

Inquisitive Bird wrote:
Sun Jun 30, 2019 11:41 pm
Why does the Church always feel compelled to lie and then cover things up with even more lies?
Your question makes the Church sound a lot like Name of Politician Removed due to Political Hard Feelings. Just consider it "fake news".
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

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