Word of Wisdom

[Rob4Hope]

I never understood the WoW. I remember as a child going to ward dinners and seeing lots of meat, pastries and other things on the table that didn't look all that healthy to me. It was always the same through all of the dinners, and I also remember seeing people hobble in who were morbidly obese, broken down for one reason or another--and I knew it was all attributable to their dietary practices. It made no sense to me.

I also knew that these people held callings and were Temple Recommend holders--meaning they subscribed to living the WoW.

And they did. The "didn't use coffee, tea or tobacco--so they were living the law." But being 150lbs over weight is NOT wrong?

This was a crack in my shelf all those years ago. I was told: "Well, that is between them and God." Which was another crack, because does that mean I can disobey what I want "in the spirit of the law" and have it be "between me and God"?

[Red Ryder]

The disgruntlement directed at eating meat sparingly annoys me somewhat. It made sense back then before refrigerators, just in time inventory supply chains, and church owned hunting preserves and cattle ranches.

Perhaps it was a mild form of wild life management as the crowds of new mormon members grew significantly and moved into new towns and territories.

I think the church needs to update and refresh the word of wisdom to fit modern day times. I'm not sure why a church that hangs it's hat on modern day revelation and a living prophet can't seem to make simple but necessary changes.

[Palerider]

The church isn't really interested in our health even though they proclaim the WOW to be the Lord's law of health for it's members. If you want to see a prime example of institutionalized cafeteria gospel living, the church is it. There's no doubt they are picking and choosing which parts of the WOW they want to live and make members responsible for. But that's o.k. because they are leadership and the rest of us are nincompoops.

Gluttony is discouraged in the Bible every bit as much as drunkenness. Yet the church totally ignores this malady because it is considered socially unacceptable to comment on another persons weight. Thus they bend to societal mores instead of standing up on their hind legs and telling it like it is. Cowards....

I remember when I came back from my mission there was that front row of heavy set, high priest guys in priesthood opening exercises. They always sat together shoulder to shoulder, hip to hip. A formidable wall of excessive eating. I may have mentioned this here before but that's when I made up my mind that I was never going to be a fat-backed high priest. And that's what they became in my mind from that point forward....fat-backed high priests.

[deacon blues]

I never understood the WoW. I remember as a child going to ward dinners and seeing lots of meat, pastries and other things on the table that didn't look all that healthy to me. It was always the same through all of the dinners, and I also remember seeing people hobble in who were morbidly obese, broken down for one reason or another--and I knew it was all attributable to their dietary practices. It made no sense to me.

I also knew that these people held callings and were Temple Recommend holders--meaning they subscribed to living the WoW.

And they did. The "didn't use coffee, tea or tobacco--so they were living the law." But being 150lbs over weight is NOT wrong?

This was a crack in my shelf all those years ago. I was told: "Well, that is between them and God." Which was another crack, because does that mean I can disobey what I want "in the spirit of the law" and have it be "between me and God"?

The phrase "between me and God" is the key. For some people, God is the church.

[Thoughtful]

The disgruntlement directed at eating meat sparingly annoys me somewhat. It made sense back then before refrigerators, just in time inventory supply chains, and church owned hunting preserves and cattle ranches.

Perhaps it was a mild form of wild life management as the crowds of new mormon members grew significantly and moved into new towns and territories.

I think the church needs to update and refresh the word of wisdom to fit modern day times. I'm not sure why a church that hangs it's hat on modern day revelation and a living prophet can't seem to make simple but necessary changes.

It takes something like 8 calories of grain to produce of calorie of animal protein. It's a way of feeding the world that is impractical and stressful on the environment.

[Rob4Hope]

Gluttony is discouraged in the Bible every bit as much as drunkenness. Yet the church totally ignores this malady because it is considered socially unacceptable to comment on another persons weight. Thus they bend to societal mores instead of standing up on their hind legs and telling it like it is. Cowards....

This is succinct and articulates EXACTLY how I feel about it. It really is a flagrant example of picking and choosing--even a cafeteria type of approach to the gospel teachings.

Its also an example of how the Bible really is ignored aLOT.

I remember hearing a story of two LDS missionaries in Central America. Two teens came up to them and said: "You say you know Jesus Christ...right?" Their response was: "Yes, of course we know Him. We are representatives of His church on the earth in the Latter Days." Well, the teens had set their trap and they sprang it: "Well, since you know him so well, can you please tell us who the first three people were he called to follow him?"

The missionaries were dead stumped. And yet, would you not think that if you really knew Jesus Christ, you would know the stories that surrounded him,...and maybe even who some of the people were?

Oh, these missionaries new the WoW, and the BoM stories...but not the NT. Oh no...cuz we don't listen to the bible-we only listen to our leaders.

Sad,..but true.

[didyoumythme]

The Word of Wisdom (as with other scripture) has always been secondary to the true modern book of scripture - the church handbook of instructions! It doesn't matter that the word of wisdom has all sorts of advice that goes ignored, because Mormons aren't taught to rely on scriptures. They are taught that leaders' interpretations of scripture always wins. I remember learning that D&C89:17 explicitly says, "barley for all useful animals, and for mild drinks, as also other grain"...which means beer is ok. I went to lds.org to see how this is interpreted, and instead they just pass over that part as seen in the link below. They cherry pick the advice that matters and ignore the rest.

https://www.lds.org/topics/word-of-wisdom?lang=eng

Also, following the WoW really has become just a badge of obedience/loyalty. It shows that you are "in the tribe" if you follow it (despite plenty of modern health advice). In the 1830s it was very much in line with health advice of the day, but today it is considered very out-dated health advice. The dialogue article below is very interesting and shows a strong connection between early 19th century health advice and the WoW.

https://www.dialoguejournal.com/wp-cont ... N03_48.pdf

[redjay]

The word of wisdom was alright as it was originally intended - a word of wisdom. The church needs to take the stick out of its arse and remove it as a commandment. It's culturally stoopid in most of the world.

[Brent]

Words of Wisdom stories that my mother told to me
are about the dangers of living like you're free
Long ago caffeine was found to make you quite horny
So we must leave it alone e-tern-ally.

Coca-Cola, Pepsi and Sunkist orange pop
Trick the little children whenever it is hot.
They're the gateway drugs we always must avoid
To be clean white and pure easily.

Someone grab the mic....

[Rob4Hope]

I was rather blown away when I read in Rough Stone Rolling that JS drank wine clear up until his death, and in another source how Brigham Young ran the liquor stores.

"do as I say, not as I do.".....very big deal in LDS leadership....

[blazerb]

The word of wisdom was alright as it was originally intended - a word of wisdom. The church needs to take the stick out of its arse and remove it as a commandment. It's culturally stoopid in most of the world.

I agree, but the leadership cannot do this. Just like they cannot admit that home teaching doesn't work and giving a few men authority over people's lives is a bad idea. They know things need change. But, if they tried to reform and make the structure and teachings more functional, people would question their right to lead. They would face a revolt. A lot of the active members would probably follow Snuffer. A few more would come here. The rest would confusedly keep following the current leadership without as much enthusiasm.

[Rob4Hope]

The word of wisdom was alright as it was originally intended - a word of wisdom. The church needs to take the stick out of its arse and remove it as a commandment. It's culturally stoopid in most of the world.

I agree, but the leadership cannot do this. Just like they cannot admit that home teaching doesn't work and giving a few men authority over people's lives is a bad idea. They know things need change. But, if they tried to reform and make the structure and teachings more functional, people would question their right to lead. They would face a revolt. A lot of the active members would probably follow Snuffer. A few more would come here. The rest would confusedly keep following the current leadership without as much enthusiasm.

Isn't it amazing that the best way to lead is not to? The best way to say "we receive revelation all the time" is to just say it, but never produce any doctrinal revelations?

This may offend some, but I'm gunna say it. The general LDS population is "easy prey".

[Emower]

I think the church needs to update and refresh the word of wisdom to fit modern day times. I'm not sure why a church that hangs it's hat on modern day revelation and a living prophet can't seem to make simple but necessary changes.

Totally. But prophets coming out and saying what they think is part of the problem the church is dealing with right now. They can't update because they know that we don't really hang our hats on modern revelation. I think they really do know that.

[moksha]

Whiskey with a bit of Mormon history has returned to Utah.

On Saturday, the High West Distillery in Park City introduced its new Valley Tan, an aged whiskey made from Utah oats and named in honor of the spirit made by the Mormon pioneers.

"Valley Tan is a kind of whisky, or first cousin to it; is of Mormon invention and manufactured only in Utah," Mark Twain wrote. It was served to him by the owner of the distillery, Brigham Young.

http://archive.sltrib.com/story.php?ref ... h.html.csp

[moksha]

† Sir Richard Burton, one
of the greatest explorers of the 19th century and expert on religious places,
wrote “The whisky of Utah Territory unlike the Monongahela or rye of
Pennsylvania and the Bourbon…of Kentucky is distilled from wheat…”‡
Thus, we made our Valley Tan from wheat and aged it in new and used
barrels for a minimum of 1 year, creating a “pretty” sipping whiskey.
On front is Porter Rockwell, one of Utah Territory’s earliest lawmen and
reputed Mormon “Destroying Angel” [Twain explains: “Destroying Angels
as I understand it, are Latter-Day Saints who are set apart by the church
to conduct permanent disappearances of obnoxious citizens.”].† Upon
meeting Old Port, Sir Burton wrote: “Rockwell...pulled out a dollar and
sent to the neighboring distillery for a bottle of Valley Tan... We were asked
to join him in a ‘squar’ drink, which means spirits without water. Of these,
we had at least four, which, however, did not shake Mr. Rockwell’s nerve,
and then he sent out for more, meanwhile telling us of his last adventure.”‡
https://www.highwest.com/products/valley-tan.php

[Rob4Hope]

Whiskey with a bit of Mormon history has returned to Utah.

On Saturday, the High West Distillery in Park City introduced its new Valley Tan, an aged whiskey made from Utah oats and named in honor of the spirit made by the Mormon pioneers.

"Valley Tan is a kind of whisky, or first cousin to it; is of Mormon invention and manufactured only in Utah," Mark Twain wrote. It was served to him by the owner of the distillery, Brigham Young.

http://archive.sltrib.com/story.php?ref ... h.html.csp

What a joke. "Follow the Prophet,...he knows the way!" Except the olden guys who were prophets. What was I thinking?

Oh wait...is this one of those "...mistakes have been made..." Uchdorf talks about?

Lets just cherry pick it. We follow prophets when its convenient to do, or if what they taught fits into the current agenda,...but otherwise, we just ignore it. But lets not disavow anything...oh no...there is no precedence for the church to be honest and ever issue an apology (says Oaks).

Was the rescinding of the Black Priesthood Ban an apology? .... of course not. After all, it was revelation (before 1978),..and after it was?...I'm not sure. This is kindof unclear....a policy?

[Corsair]

Also, following the WoW really has become just a badge of obedience/loyalty. It shows that you are "in the tribe" if you follow it (despite plenty of modern health advice). In the 1830s it was very much in line with health advice of the day, but today it is considered very out-dated health advice. The dialogue article below is very interesting and shows a strong connection between early 19th century health advice and the WoW.

Yes, it's all about obedience at this point. Any talk about tannins or other acids and their effect on your body is straining at the tiniest details in a church that serves soda pop and ice cream at social events. Reintroducing tea and coffee into the culture would make some sense, but I think leadership likes the cultural marker and how it acts as a virtue signalling act of obedience.

[Rob4Hope]

Coffee is healthier than drinking energy drinks, since the Brethren are on record saying caffeine is the reason we are to avoid hot drinks...