BYU-I Prof fired for post on Face Book

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moksha
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BYU-I Prof fired for post on Face Book

Post by moksha » Wed Jul 19, 2017 5:07 am

Okay, here is the short of it: A BYU-I professor was fired for a post she made to friends (not the general public) on Facebook supporting LGBT rights.

http://www.sltrib.com/home/5524063-155/ ... -over-lgbt

However, that is in contradiction to Elder Todd Christiansen's remarks in a PR move earlier this year:
In an interview Friday with KUTV in Salt Lake City, Elder D. Todd Christofferson said that individuals in the 15 million-member Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints would be in trouble only for "supporting organizations that promote opposition or positions in opposition to the church's."

Backing marriage equality on social media sites, including on Facebook or Twitter, "is not an organized effort to attack our effort," Christofferson said in the interview, "or our functioning as a church."
http://www.sltrib.com/blogs/2301174-155 ... y-marriage
The old story of one's conscience struggling against one's religion! Next time take some chloroform to that conscience. BYU is no place to exercise independent thought. The Mantle has ballistic weaponry at its disposal compared to the unarmed innocence of the Intellect.

Any reactions?
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

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blazerb
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Re: BYU-I Prof fired for post on Face Book

Post by blazerb » Wed Jul 19, 2017 6:07 am

I'm not surprised. I hope the prof finds a better job. The church has never been willing to allow people to make up their own minds about LGBT issues. They may say that members can support LGBT rights, but they don't say members can support them without consequences. Mostly, Brother Christofferson said that to placate outsiders, in my opinion.

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document
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Re: BYU-I Prof fired for post on Face Book

Post by document » Wed Jul 19, 2017 6:47 am

I learned from a few of my friends that there is a stark difference between BYU and BYU-I in the culture and staff. There are professors at BYU-I and administrators who consider BYU an apostate liberal university in need of serious reform. Considering the stories that I have heard coming out of BYU-I (not from the student perspective), this story didn't surprise me at all.

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oliver_denom
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Re: BYU-I Prof fired for post on Face Book

Post by oliver_denom » Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:42 am

Members of the LDS church are perfectly free to voice their public support for gay marriage and equal rights. They'll just lose their jobs, membership, housing, college enrollment, friendships, and family relationships...but still perfectly free.
“You want to know something? We are still in the Dark Ages. The Dark Ages--they haven't ended yet.” - Vonnegut

L'enfer, c'est les autres - JP

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Culper Jr.
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Re: BYU-I Prof fired for post on Face Book

Post by Culper Jr. » Wed Jul 19, 2017 9:24 am

This just shows the hypocrisy of the church. They are always going on (and on) about religious freedom. I remember watching a staged Q&A with the youth that Bednar did, and he was answering a staged softball question about religious freedom. He went on about it and when you follow the logic of his answer, he was in a roundabout way saying that in order to preserve our rights we have to deny others (LGBT people) theirs. He went around a bit but that is what I got from what he was saying. What is so odious is that the church does exactly what it accuses others of doing; it cries persecution as it persecutes others.

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Not Buying It
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Re: BYU-I Prof fired for post on Face Book

Post by Not Buying It » Wed Jul 19, 2017 9:26 am

That's horrible. What kind of an institution of higher learning fires somebody for expressing support for LGBT rights?

I'll answer my own question - one that isn't really an institution of higher learning.
Culper Jr. wrote:
Wed Jul 19, 2017 9:24 am
This just shows the hypocrisy of the church. They are always going on (and on) about religious freedom. I remember watching a staged Q&A with the youth that Bednar did, and he was answering a staged softball question about religious freedom. He went on about it and when you follow the logic of his answer, he was in a roundabout way saying that in order to preserve our rights we have to deny others (LGBT people) theirs. He went around a bit but that is what I got from what he was saying. What is so odious is that the church does exactly what it accuses others of doing; it cries persecution as it persecutes others.
This is so true.

BUT - the fact that she is currently working as a bartender will be enough to make most TBMs write her off.
"The truth is elegantly simple. The lie needs complex apologia. 4 simple words: Joe made it up. It answers everything with the perfect simplicity of Occam's Razor. Every convoluted excuse withers." - Some guy on Reddit called disposazelph

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Palerider
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Re: BYU-I Prof fired for post on Face Book

Post by Palerider » Wed Jul 19, 2017 9:41 am

document wrote:
Wed Jul 19, 2017 6:47 am
I learned from a few of my friends that there is a stark difference between BYU and BYU-I in the culture and staff. There are professors at BYU-I and administrators who consider BYU an apostate liberal university in need of serious reform. Considering the stories that I have heard coming out of BYU-I (not from the student perspective), this story didn't surprise me at all.
Having attended both institutions and lived in both communities, I can tell you it would gag me to live in Provo but I would slit my wrists if I had to live in Rexburg.

Yes, there are good people there but it's a fishbowl of self-righteousness and ultra-strict mormonism. Most of them are so uptight they could pull bricks out of a wall if you get my drift.
"There is but one straight course, and that is to seek truth and pursue it steadily."

"Truth will ultimately prevail where there is pains to bring it to light."

George Washington

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deacon blues
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Re: BYU-I Prof fired for post on Face Book

Post by deacon blues » Wed Jul 19, 2017 3:42 pm

My sense of duty compels me to rush to the defense of my hometown and my alma mater. I grew up in Rexburg and attended (then) Ricks College some 40 years ago. There were some Skousenites and Bensonites in town but there were also some people who resisted the church board of education when they tried to move the college to Idaho Falls. It is a rare thing when a group of commoners can get the high and mighty of the church to change their minds but some determined Rexburgers did just that. I heard the comment once that the Teton Flood might have been God's payback to the people of Rexburg for resisting such inspired church leaders as Ernest Wilkinson and other higher ups. However you look at it, it's a fascinating, and little known part of church history that could provide some valuable insights to NOM's and other living things.
God is Love. God is Truth. The greatest problem with organized religion is that the organization becomes god, rather than a means of serving God.

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2bizE
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Re: BYU-I Prof fired for post on Face Book

Post by 2bizE » Wed Jul 19, 2017 11:11 pm

Left wing, feminist, non-tenured, 22 year old professor working at a right wing, ultra conservative private school in a right to work state = low probability of employment longevity.
~2bizE

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Palerider
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Re: BYU-I Prof fired for post on Face Book

Post by Palerider » Wed Jul 19, 2017 11:15 pm

deacon blues wrote:
Wed Jul 19, 2017 3:42 pm
My sense of duty compels me to rush to the defense of my hometown and my alma mater. I grew up in Rexburg and attended (then) Ricks College some 40 years ago. There were some Skousenites and Bensonites in town but there were also some people who resisted the church board of education when they tried to move the college to Idaho Falls. It is a rare thing when a group of commoners can get the high and mighty of the church to change their minds but some determined Rexburgers did just that. I heard the comment once that the Teton Flood might have been God's payback to the people of Rexburg for resisting such inspired church leaders as Ernest Wilkinson and other higher ups. However you look at it, it's a fascinating, and little known part of church history that could provide some valuable insights to NOM's and other living things.
Deacon, you and I must have crossed paths at some time. I heard that Rexburg lobbied hard to keep Ricks there but because Idaho Falls members kind of yawned and said, "Whatever", church leadership decided to leave it in Rexburg. I think it was critical to the Rexburg economy. Otherwise they would have ended up like Rigby.

I always felt like Idaho Falls made a big mistake in being so nonchalant.
I was in I.F. for the flood.....the only thing that was payback for was for someone doing some very poor engineering.....and possibly filling the dam too fast. Rexburg just happened to be in the way. But some folks have to see a diety cause and effect in everything. They can't bear the thought of it being plain old stupidity and chance.
"There is but one straight course, and that is to seek truth and pursue it steadily."

"Truth will ultimately prevail where there is pains to bring it to light."

George Washington

Korihor
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Re: BYU-I Prof fired for post on Face Book

Post by Korihor » Thu Jul 20, 2017 9:39 am

oliver_denom wrote:
Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:42 am
Members of the LDS church are perfectly free to voice their public support for gay marriage and equal rights. They'll just lose their jobs, membership, housing, college enrollment, friendships, and family relationships...but still perfectly free.
You're free to make your decisions but not the consequences. Choose wisely.

Such terrible advice, ashamed I followed it for so long.
Reading can severely damage your ignorance.

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moksha
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Re: BYU-I Prof fired for post on Face Book

Post by moksha » Thu Jul 20, 2017 10:30 am

Something seems terribly wrong to me that this lady could share her opinion with some friends - not the general public - and then via a betrayal have that information used against her in a harmful way. This institution bills itself as a university, not an indoctrination center, and yet a police state mentality is at the root of this action. This is too great of an ethical break, from abusing a personal communication to depriving an employee of her freedom of speech outside the workplace, not to question the entire educational experience at BYU-I.
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

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Enough
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Re: BYU-I Prof fired for post on Face Book

Post by Enough » Thu Jul 20, 2017 10:56 am

BYU-I's actions here are wrong, on so many levels. This story, unfortunately, does not surprise me one bit. I worked as a professor (adjunct) at BYU-I for several years. I ended up resigning because it just took too much energy to constantly censor what came out of my mouth -- none of which was actually problematic or offensive to most of the natural world. But, I also had to worry about stuff like having students write letters to the prophet because I was showing pornography in class. (True story-- I showed a tastefully done birth video --in a Child Development Class). :shock:

BYU-I takes Righteous Indignation (and Honored Arrogance & Moral Superiority) to a whole new level. Crazy Town.

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deacon blues
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Re: BYU-I Prof fired for post on Face Book

Post by deacon blues » Thu Jul 20, 2017 11:02 am

Well, at least they gave her a chance to repent. Besides, well all know the unique mission of church schools. Establishing a setting for marketplace of ideas isn't it. Heck, for all we know, a future apostle or bishop might have had his purity sallied by exposure to her ideas. 🙄
God is Love. God is Truth. The greatest problem with organized religion is that the organization becomes god, rather than a means of serving God.

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Emower
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Re: BYU-I Prof fired for post on Face Book

Post by Emower » Fri Jul 21, 2017 9:08 am

This makes me mad in light of what Christofferson said. I hope this gains some publicity. Apparently support of LGBT is a litmus test and will generate reprisal, at least for all church employees. Which, I suppose, is no surprise.

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2bizE
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Re: BYU-I Prof fired for post on Face Book

Post by 2bizE » Fri Jul 21, 2017 7:39 pm

Other than this storytelling being picked up by major newspapers, I don't think we have heard the last of this lady.
~2bizE

Korihor
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Re: BYU-I Prof fired for post on Face Book

Post by Korihor » Fri Jul 21, 2017 11:26 pm

Emower wrote:
Fri Jul 21, 2017 9:08 am
This makes me mad in light of what Christofferson said. I hope this gains some publicity. Apparently support of LGBT is a litmus test and will generate reprisal, at least for all church employees. Which, I suppose, is no surprise.
Her termination doesn't violate anything Christofferson said. Church members who support LGBT can remain in good standing.
Christofferson said nothing regarding employees.
Reading can severely damage your ignorance.

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deacon blues
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Re: BYU-I Prof fired for post on Face Book

Post by deacon blues » Sun Jul 23, 2017 10:43 am

I once aspired to teach at a church school. I'm SOOOOoooooo glad my plans didn't work out. :D
God is Love. God is Truth. The greatest problem with organized religion is that the organization becomes god, rather than a means of serving God.

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