Stake President Wants to Talk with Me

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Linked
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Re: Stake President Wants to Talk with Me

Post by Linked » Fri Sep 15, 2017 9:37 am

Thanks for the write up Consiglieri!!

Sounds like a nice meeting all around, way to dodge the mine of leading people out of the church.
"I would write about life. Every person would be exactly as important as any other. All facts would also be given equal weightiness. Nothing would be left out. Let others bring order to chaos. I would bring chaos to order" - Kurt Vonnegut

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Palerider
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Re: Stake President Wants to Talk with Me

Post by Palerider » Fri Sep 15, 2017 9:48 am

Hmmmm.....

Really interesting play by play here Consiglieri.

Kind of like Mooseman said, I don't think they're done with you yet. This was probably just a friendly exploratory surgery to make a diagnostic determination.

I'm sure the SP is going to go back and do some serious research on you at this point. Everything depends on whether he perceives you as a threat or just a small benign tumor that needs to be watched from time to time.

If you are perceived as a threat you can bet that "I'm a protector of the faith!" notion will kick in in the more primitive parts of the SP's brain and everything will be down hill from there.

I'm curious, what would be your preferred outcome here? Not in a perfect world but dealing with things as they are?
"There is but one straight course, and that is to seek truth and pursue it steadily."

"Truth will ultimately prevail where there is pains to bring it to light."

George Washington

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mooseman
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Re: Stake President Wants to Talk with Me

Post by mooseman » Fri Sep 15, 2017 11:03 am

Yup. Your in trouble.

This sounds like a lot of "first encounters" you find online from people who get disciplined. In his mind, you weren't driving the bus, you were gathering the rope he'll hang you with.
"You might not understand this, but im your priesthood leader" hes implying he can see where you got off track. You gave him encouragement he can save you, your not an agnosit and believe the BOM, so he sees hope. Just has to remind you. Hes not familiar with what youve wrote, cant say who you lead away until you mention a topic/name and thats it, no matter how loosely associated.

He thinks he can save you, and is going to make this very uncomfortable for you til he gives up and drops the axe.
It's frustrating to see the last resort in a discussion of facts be: I disregard those facts because of my faith. Why even talk about facts if the last resort is to put faith above all facts that are contrary to your faith?

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FiveFingerMnemonic
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Re: Stake President Wants to Talk with Me

Post by FiveFingerMnemonic » Fri Sep 15, 2017 1:27 pm

This process is fascinating. We are witnesses to the standard procedures of an apostasy investigation.

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Red Ryder
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Re: Stake President Wants to Talk with Me

Post by Red Ryder » Fri Sep 15, 2017 1:35 pm

Do they realize they don't hold any authority over you other than to officially kick you out of the treehouse club?

He's church broke and probably went home after your meeting and stayed up late typing up his report or calling his area authority above him to report up. Middle management ordered an inquisition straight out of SLC and he was obligated to participate in the due diligence.

Something tells me he'll be back like Peter, James, and John and reveal his true identity and purpose. Then he'll try to cast out satan and queue up the melodramatic music while imploring you to repent and return to the fold or face church discipline.

I say stay behind enemy lines and continue broadcasting!
“It always devolves to Pantaloons. Always.” ~ Fluffy

“I switched baristas” ~ Lady Gaga

“Those who do not move do not notice their chains.” ~Rosa Luxemburg

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deacon blues
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Re: Stake President Wants to Talk with Me

Post by deacon blues » Fri Sep 15, 2017 6:45 pm

The "I'm your leader" line seems to be a set up for a future discussion along the lines of "I have read your stuff, and I council you to stop or face church discipline."
God is Love. God is Truth. The greatest problem with organized religion is that the organization becomes god, rather than a means of serving God.

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moksha
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Re: Stake President Wants to Talk with Me

Post by moksha » Fri Sep 15, 2017 7:20 pm

Congratulations on having navigated that minefield. Not sure if they will require any additional Herculean labors of you, but it sounds like you are equal to the task.

Too bad there wasn't an Annie Hall moment where the Stake President paused and said, "I just happen to have Daniel Peterson here behind this ficus plant and he has a detailed list of reasons why any men being named Alma in Joseph Smith's time wasn't worth mentioning. He would share them but he is late to his meeting with the Albanian Ambassador."
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

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Give It Time
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Re: Stake President Wants to Talk with Me

Post by Give It Time » Fri Sep 15, 2017 10:11 pm

Well played meeting, Cons.

Watch your back.
At 70 years-old, my older self would tell my younger self to use the words, "f*ck off" much more frequently. --Helen Mirren

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2bizE
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Re: Stake President Wants to Talk with Me

Post by 2bizE » Fri Sep 15, 2017 10:32 pm

My bet is on the strengthening members committee sent information to the SP and asked him to follow up...
~2bizE

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Palerider
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Re: Stake President Wants to Talk with Me

Post by Palerider » Sat Sep 16, 2017 7:04 pm

Hey Consiglieri, I've been thinking about this statement recently:

"He said that he didn’t know if I understood this, but he is my priesthood leader, and bore his testimony about how the priesthood is in the LDS Church and the ordinances are there and it is the only way to salvation."

I find it ironic that he is more than happy to remind you of his authority and what his views are which also carry the implication that your membership is in his hands and yet he is utterly powerless to answer or address any of your questions or concerns with any authority whatsoever.

He cannot speak to your concerns on behalf of the Lord or the church. He has no authority to do so and the men who do claim to have such authority wouldn't be caught dead having to explain or answer your questions. To them you/we (and all others like you/us) are a can of worms. They really don't want to go there...think Steve Benson. When he rejected their pitiful explanations it made them feel powerless. They don't like that....it ruins the bubble.

So all they can do is happily point you towards sycophantic apologists whose words carry zero weight, zero authority and are illogical to boot.

And yet, this person, your SP, has portions of your life in his hands while you are totally powerless to directly effect his or the lives of those whose bidding he does.

What's wrong with this picture???
"There is but one straight course, and that is to seek truth and pursue it steadily."

"Truth will ultimately prevail where there is pains to bring it to light."

George Washington

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Hermey
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Re: Stake President Wants to Talk with Me

Post by Hermey » Sat Sep 16, 2017 9:18 pm

Very interesting indeed. Waiting for the next chapter!

Anon70
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Re: Stake President Wants to Talk with Me

Post by Anon70 » Sat Sep 16, 2017 11:26 pm

Thanks for sharing! You handled it so well! Along with previous posters I found the reminder of his authority-albeit uneducated authority-off putting.

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Mormorrisey
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Re: Stake President Wants to Talk with Me

Post by Mormorrisey » Sun Sep 17, 2017 3:41 pm

Anon70 wrote:
Sat Sep 16, 2017 11:26 pm
Thanks for sharing! You handled it so well! Along with previous posters I found the reminder of his authority-albeit uneducated authority-off putting.
Ditto.

We'll be looking forward to more posts about this - btw, loved your articles on Rational Faiths, and starting to listen to your RFM podcasts. My first was the apostolic coup d'etat series. Wonderful!
"And I don't need you...or, your homespun philosophies."
"And when you try to break my spirit, it won't work, because there's nothing left to break."

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blazerb
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Re: Stake President Wants to Talk with Me

Post by blazerb » Sun Sep 17, 2017 5:04 pm

This was very interesting. Thanks for writing this up. I agree with the others that "I'm your leader," sounds ominous, especially since he didn't think you knew what that meant. Good luck.

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The Beast
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Re: Stake President Wants to Talk with Me

Post by The Beast » Mon Sep 18, 2017 12:37 pm


I had already told him previously that I had increasingly felt marginalized in the church and even ostracized, though I said that ostracized was probably too big a word, but there was an element of that in there; that the members were happy to see me in church because it made them feel better about themselves but they weren’t interested in hearing anything I had to say.
Well done sir. You are like a Wiley cat toying with naive mice. The above is exactly why I decided to be done with attendance. You stated it so well.
Are you on the square? Are you on the level?

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