Scientists have established a link between brain damage and religious fundamentalism

[alas]

What I found most interesting was that fundamentalist religions may harm the ability of the prefrontal cortex to function. True the study didn't prove this, only suggested it as a possibility. But having studied brain function, this is more than a remote possibility. When animals are raised with an environment with out some normal element in their environment, say cats with no horizontal surfaces(I don't remember how they accomplished such an environment, maybe no horizontal surfaces except a floor, or perhaps it was a see through floor, don't remember) but when put into a normal environment, the cats could not even develope the concept of horizontal surfaces. So, it being unethical to raise humans in weird environments, we can't test humans this way, but have to assume that the same rules of mammal brain development and plasticity works on humans too.

So, according to this ethically untestable theory, if humans are raised in an environment with little use of a particular brain function, say language, even as adults they can never develope this brain function. But it holds true for the few kids who do grow up with extreme neglect, or autism. If they have no language by five years old, they never do develope language. So, it would hold that children raised in very fundamentalist environments who get punished for thinking critically about religion, would fail to develope a healthy prefrontal cortex. Which would explain why so few people manage to examine their beliefs and leave.

I want to put some religious fundamentalists on brain imaging and see if their prefrontal cortex s supper weak.

My nephew Jake is studying neuroscience, and I've been helping him understand the data analysis aspect of it lately, and what you said reminds me of some of the brain scans he showed me of abuse victims (this was tangential to what we were doing but it was too fascinating not to sidetrack me). Some of the patterns of dystrophy in the brain of early childhood physical abuse is remarkable consistent, and hypothetically results from disproportionate levels of cortisol as a result of the threat response. It makes me wonder if the same can happen to some degree as a result of fundamentalist religious teachings at a young age (so tangentially similar to what you're saying, I suppose). In addition to hellfire and brimstone style doctrines, I think there can also be a lot of stress on a child to conform to something that isn't natural which may also manifest the same way. I'm not sure to what degree this can happen though. Are you familiar with what I've described? The first time I really thought about it was when Jake showed me the imagery. Really tragic TBH.

Yes, I am aware of the permanent changes in the brains of children who are abused. It isn't just physical abuse, but severe neglect and sexual abuse cause it also.

PTSD causes these changes in combat veterans also, with the younger the soldier the more the damage. This is why that study really really needed to control for soldiers who were injured but not brain injuries as well as healthy soldiers, and some who came out of their combat experience with PTSD as their major injury.

And, I bet the football layers with the kind of brain injuries they get are not turning to fundamentalist religion, even though they can show lesions in the PFL. Why? Because they are not in the kind of life and death situation of combat vets.

[Mad Jax]

I have seen a couple of studies which suggest abuse victims suffer higher volumes of PTSD than combat veterans, which makes sense given how small a percentage of the population does military service, and I believe it based on experience. I probably mentioned that I used to bounce at a strip club, and quite a few of the girls that worked the poles seemed to have the same switches that my pals who came back from the middle east have. Different impetus but same response. Same goes for a lot of the guys who worked at some of the other clubs I door sat during college. The hair triggers on some of these guys... it's a window into a mind that developed an expertise in violence but at the expense of other development (like impulse control). I tended not to stay at jobs that needed those kinds of guys for security.

Anyway I know I drifted around a bit in that last paragraph but I found a vid that covers a lot of what's been covered on the thread. I suspect quite a few here have a lot of disagreements with Molyneux, but he does have a good track record with fact checking and research, and his strong advocacy of gentle parenting is something I can definitely get on board with him about.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbiq2-ukfhM

[1smartdodog]

I can't help but wonder if there here is also the possibility that some people have a genetic/cerebrophysiological (I think I just invented that word) propensity for religiosity. I guess that's what scrupulosity is. If there is a genetic component, it seems likely that people who are attracted to fundamentalism will meet, marry, and produce offspring with a propensity for fundamentalist thinking. There are studies that suggest that that there is a physiological difference between the brains of conservative thinkers vs. liberal thinkers. Cause or effect? I can imagine that if there is a genetic component to this you might see geographic regions where more conservative-leaning people are being born and others that spawn more liberal-minded people. Or maybe not, but it's a fun mental exercise.

I have sometimes thought that the early members had a propensity to believe outrageous things. Then they married each other and had kids with the same genetic code. Explains why you have so many families with ties back to the beginning.

But I don't buy the brain damage thing. Being wired a certain way does not mean you are stupid. It is more about genetics than brain damage I think.

[Spicy McHaggis]

[/quote]
Interesting. The prefrontal cortex is where we deal with complexity, the thinking part of the brain. It could make sense I think, that if a fundamentalist religious culture limits development of the prefrontal cortex, that person's speech patterns might be altered. Due to the alteration in cognitive processes. But whether that alteration would include a sermon cadence that is both simplistic and emotion charged, I think that is hard to say. But the cadence might reflect the cultural programming.
[/quote]

This got me thinking. Have any of you seen the movie 'Live of Pi'? It is an OBVIOUS fiction about a kid who is shipwrecked and ends up on a life raft with a tiger for several months. He experiences things that are obviously based in fiction, like a random floating island that releases something at night which kills anything on the surface of the island. The kid isn't eaten by the tiger, etc..... those sorts of fictional stories.

Anyway, my extremist TBM sister-in-law watches the movie and asks if it was a true story. When you believe there are three 2,000 year old men walking the earth performing miracles for mormons, then I suppose the Life of Pi might as well be true. She's a smart woman but her ability to think rationally has never existed because when fictional stories in the BoM are absolute truth, then anything can be true I suppose.

[moksha]

Do you think there is a relationship between brain damage and the speaking cadence of Evangelical sermons and General Conference talks?

Very interesting. Are you suggesting we use a white noise generator to help cancel out any deleterious effects arising from the slow monotone cadence of General Conference talks as a way of protecting our brains?

BTW, do you feel that some protection is accorded by the loud munching of popcorn during these talks?