My list/summary of why the church can't be true... (24/25 complete)

Discussions toward a better understanding of LDS doctrine, history, and culture. Discussion of Christianity, religion, and faith in general is welcome.
Reuben
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Re: My list/summary of why the church can't be true... (24/25 complete)

Post by Reuben » Tue Jul 17, 2018 5:42 pm

jfro18 wrote:
Tue Jul 17, 2018 4:40 pm
It's really sad though in hindsight to think I was OK with this before, and just saying "I didn't know any better" doesn't help because I should have been a critical thinker and I should have been wiling to ask questions of a church I so readily gave my time, loyalty, and money to.
You were hacked, and then programmed to believe that not believing in Mormonism would lead to a fate worse than death. Not thinking critically about Mormonism became a matter of survival.

But you did it anyway.

Yeah, it took a while. So what?
Not all those who wander are lost.

IT_Veteran
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Re: My list/summary of why the church can't be true... (24/25 complete)

Post by IT_Veteran » Thu Jul 19, 2018 6:12 am

jfro18 wrote:
Fri Jul 13, 2018 1:19 pm
In the process of working on my page to try and cover the LDS essays and other problems with the church, I wanted to compile a list of reasons (something of a summary of the entire page) as to why the church can't be true.

Originally I was thinking it would be a top ten type thing, but it ended up being 25. A bit long so i might need to find a way to format it so it's not as daunting.

Anyway - if you're bored and want to check it out, you can find it at https://ldsdiscussion.wixsite.com/mysite/summary

The 15 points made now are:
1. The Book of Abraham
2. King James Errors and Deutero-Isaiah
3. The Joseph Smith Translation of the Bible Plagiarism
4. Polygamy and Polyamory
5. Book of Mormon Translation - Church Narrative vs. Church History
6. DNA and the Changing Lamanites
7. Anachronisms
8. Significant Changes to Key Revelations
9. The Retrofitted Priesthood Restoration
10. Ban on Blacks from the Priesthood and All Temple Ordinances
11. Role of Women - Lack of Priesthood, Treatment During Polygamy, Etc
12. Treatment of the LGBT Community
13. Complete Lack of Discernment by Prophets and Church Leaders
14. The Transfiguration of Brigham Young and Other Faith Promoting Stories
15. Brigham Young
16. Lack of Proof for Joseph Smith's Prophetic Abilities or the Book of Mormon
17. The Lost 116 Pages
18. No Advancement in the Book of Mormon Culture
19. Joseph Smith and the Convenience of Revelations
20. The Everchanging LDS Apologists
21. Joseph Smith 'Mixtape' Theory (in progress)
22. Church History of Hiding/Suppressing Evidence
23. Lack of Modern Day Revelation
24. Spiritual Witnesses/Where Will You Go?
25. Joseph Smith

Anyway... if you make it through let me know - I tried to be semi-brief on the topics but looking at them all at once ends up being fairly long. I also need to format it cleaner so the start of the page allows readers to jump around to the different #s.. but it's a start!
I haven’t had the chance yet to visit the site or read them through. I saw on Reddit though that you’re still planning on having it hosted somewhere else. I have an unlimited hosting plan with name.com already, I’d be happy to host it there if you’re interested.

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FiveFingerMnemonic
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Re: My list/summary of why the church can't be true... (24/25 complete)

Post by FiveFingerMnemonic » Thu Jul 19, 2018 9:17 am

Reuben wrote:
jfro18 wrote:
Tue Jul 17, 2018 4:40 pm
It's really sad though in hindsight to think I was OK with this before, and just saying "I didn't know any better" doesn't help because I should have been a critical thinker and I should have been wiling to ask questions of a church I so readily gave my time, loyalty, and money to.
You were hacked, and then programmed to believe that not believing in Mormonism would lead to a fate worse than death. Not thinking critically about Mormonism became a matter of survival.

But you did it anyway.

Yeah, it took a while. So what?
I like this code or program analogy. From primary and earlier parents and classes encode imagery into our subconcious mind like unto the intersect in the spy show "Chuck". Whenever a match occurs, in pavlonian style, it triggers the reward centers (proven by the recent brain scan experiments to RMs). Spiritual tingly feelings occur, furthering the conditioning. Cycle repeats. Furthermore, correllation has made church history so boring whether intentionally or by accident, that we are further conditioned not to peek any further than surface info.

Somewhere in time, some of us become aware of this process or get shaken enough via social dissatisfaction or cognitive dissonance, that the programming loop falls apart and the code breaks.

This is my report

jfro18
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Re: My list/summary of why the church can't be true... (24/25 complete)

Post by jfro18 » Fri Jul 20, 2018 7:01 am

IT_Veteran wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 6:12 am

I haven’t had the chance yet to visit the site or read them through. I saw on Reddit though that you’re still planning on having it hosted somewhere else. I have an unlimited hosting plan with name.com already, I’d be happy to host it there if you’re interested.
That might work - I'll let you know if I can figure out if I can get Wix to go to a different hosting setup w/o having to reformat it all.

Plus I can't post it officially until I tell my wife and give her a chance to either read it or tell me she doesn't want to. I told her a while back I was working on something to go over church issues and organize my thoughts, but I feel like I should at least give her the chance to read it before I put it up for everyone. It's like the D&C 132 consent rule, so I think I'm covered no matter what. :lol:

IT_Veteran
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Re: My list/summary of why the church can't be true... (24/25 complete)

Post by IT_Veteran » Fri Jul 20, 2018 1:40 pm

Lol, no problem. What app is Wix using on the backend? If you can get it, I’m pretty sure name.com can import it. If you decide to move forward, I’ll see if I can get you a cPanel login for just the domain you’re using.

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EternityIsNow
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Re: My list/summary of why the church can't be true... (24/25 complete)

Post by EternityIsNow » Sun Jul 22, 2018 11:36 pm

What about the church's history of covering up the activities of sexual predators in leadership positions? Maybe discuss with item 22 but I think the current event situation goes beyond history. The church has been paying off victims and covering up crimes of local and general leadership for a long time. The act of covering up puts members at risk. Members who are being socially manipulated and groomed to be sexually exploited and controlled. The church also uses guilt about having a sex drive to control the members. The church is obsessed with sex. On the one hand using a sex drive against members, to keep them always guilty and always repenting and always needing church authority, and on the other hand protecting sexual predators who are insiders to the church leadership structure. The churches willingness to protect itself at the expense of members reveals a very dark heart.

jfro18
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Re: My list/summary of why the church can't be true... (24/25 complete)

Post by jfro18 » Mon Jul 23, 2018 12:56 pm

EternityIsNow wrote:
Sun Jul 22, 2018 11:36 pm
What about the church's history of covering up the activities of sexual predators in leadership positions? Maybe discuss with item 22 but I think the current event situation goes beyond history. The church has been paying off victims and covering up crimes of local and general leadership for a long time. The act of covering up puts members at risk. Members who are being socially manipulated and groomed to be sexually exploited and controlled. The church also uses guilt about having a sex drive to control the members. The church is obsessed with sex. On the one hand using a sex drive against members, to keep them always guilty and always repenting and always needing church authority, and on the other hand protecting sexual predators who are insiders to the church leadership structure. The churches willingness to protect itself at the expense of members reveals a very dark heart.
I had that in the discernment area. I want to push this more, but I think that being too direct about the church covering up sexual abusers might turn people off.

To be fair the only people who are going to read this are those who already have questions, so maybe they would be open for accusations like that, but I am really trying to find a way to be blunt about these subjects while also trying to avoid making claims that can't be backed up. We only have so many details to work with on the settlements, so I am nervous about turning people off by going too strongly there.

We'll see - I need to get more feedback on these pages to see if I can make it more effective with topics/issues.

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