NOM

For those interested in such things, I just wanted to let you know I have drafted and mailed to the BYUPD a public disclosure request for any and all communications, including emails, relating to the decisions made by BYUPD to redact the police reports in the Joseph Bishop investigation; as well as the decisions made by BYUPD to refuse disclosure of the audio taped interview of Joseph Bishop.

And I specifically noted that the request covers all such communications including those with persons outside of the BYUPD.

Now that BYUPD can't hide behind the "we're not subject to GRAMA" argument anymore, this may prove to be interesting.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

Make sure you include a copy of the applicable rulings with your request, just so there is no question that you mean business.

I'm interested to see how this goes... and of course even more interested to see how much info they end up turning over. Keep up the good fight!

Help me understand this news story:

BYU will appeal judge’s ruling that its police department should be subject to Utah’s open-records laws

It looks like BYU really does not want to comply with GRAMA and this could be a delay at the very least. It also makes me wonder what other crazy things are being covered up.

Corsair wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 18, 2018 8:12 am

It looks like BYU really does not want to comply with GRAMA and this could be a delay at the very least. It also makes me wonder what other crazy things are being covered up.

That is probably the key here. My gut feeling is that the case of Miss Denson is small potatoes in the grand scheme of things. It just happened at the right time as the 2016 Honor code office case came to a close. The real meat is the other stuff that has not hit the light of day yet.

Oh what a tangled web we weave...

Corsair wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 18, 2018 8:12 am

BYU will appeal judge’s ruling that its police department should be subject to Utah’s open-records laws

It looks like BYU really does not want to comply with GRAMA and this could be a delay at the very least.

The easiest means to keep BYU police records sacred and secret would be to decertify its policing powers and turn such matters over to the Provo Police Department. The Church's chain of command to the police could be maintained via the employee's Church membership, but they would still be required to obey the law.

moksha wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 23, 2018 2:34 am

Corsair wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 18, 2018 8:12 am

BYU will appeal judge’s ruling that its police department should be subject to Utah’s open-records laws

It looks like BYU really does not want to comply with GRAMA and this could be a delay at the very least.

The easiest means to keep BYU police records sacred and secret would be to decertify its policing powers and turn such matters over to the Provo Police Department. The Church's chain of command to the police could be maintained via the employee's Church membership, but they would still be required to obey the law.

I think that one would have a LOT more ramifications to BYU than dragging their feet on releasing documents.

I'm no expert here, so feel free to correct me if you understand more than I do, but here are some of the things that could happen if BYU were to have ther certification pulled:

* All current criminal cases involving BYUPD would be thrown out because the law enforcement people on the case are not valid any more.
* Anyone who experienced force during an arrest could sue or even push for criminal charges against the officers involved.
* Anyone stoped by BYUPD could sue for unlawful imprisonment, search and seizure, etc.
* BYUPD would be unable to collect fines. People could likely sue to get fines returned to them as well.
* If the certification is revoked for failure to comply with GRAMA Laws. I could see plenty of lawyers suing BYU for imprisonment going back to when GRAMA was passed as they were operating under non complaint conditions.

Not knowing what they have hidden, likely the impact of being forced to reveal whatever they are hiding is much less damaging to BYU's wallet than loosing the BYUPD certification.

Hats off to you Consiglieri for the good work that you are doing! People's lives will be better in the future because of it.

I never understood how or why the BYU PD was given the full power of a real police department. BYU cops in my day drove around in Crown Vics with Cop motors and 12 gauge shotguns racked in the dash. I always wondered why they needed so much cop gear when they were only used for traffic enforcement. Wouldn't one of those 3 wheeled parking officer golf carts and a chalk clip be adequate?

Just This Guy wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 23, 2018 3:45 pm

here are some of the things that could happen if BYU were to have their certification pulled:

* All current criminal cases involving BYUPD would be thrown out because the law enforcement people on the case are not valid any more.
* Anyone who experienced force during an arrest could sue or even push for criminal charges against the officers involved.
* Anyone stoped by BYUPD could sue for unlawful imprisonment, search and seizure, etc.
* BYUPD would be unable to collect fines. People could likely sue to get fines returned to them as well.
* If the certification is revoked for failure to comply with GRAMA Laws. I could see plenty of lawyers suing BYU for imprisonment going back to when GRAMA was passed as they were operating under non complaint conditions.

Not knowing what they have hidden, likely the impact of being forced to reveal whatever they are hiding is much less damaging to BYU's wallet than loosing the BYUPD certification.

Just to add to that list:

• The Provo Police Department might refuse to check the BYU certified apartments of male students to see if they had girls on the premises and file a complete report with the BYU Wrath of the Elders Committee.

• The Provo Police Department might report wrongdoing by Church employees.

Which does not explain why the church needs a law enforcement group on the BYU campus. Separation of church and state anyone?

Private police forces at colleges and universities are pretty common across the US, so BYU is far from unique having their own cops that are certified as a full police force. Many universities, both public and private have their own police.

For a list of colleges in the US and Canada with their own police forces:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Campus_police
This list is defiantly incomplete. I could add several more to what they have here.

When I went to West Virginia University, they would tell people in orientation that while they may drive minivans, they can still arrest you.

Very interesting. I'm curious if private Christians universities like Liberty University in Virginia typically have police forces? The lists seem confined to public universities.

deacon blues wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 24, 2018 2:41 pm

Very interesting. I'm curious if private Christians universities like Liberty University in Virginia typically have police forces? The lists seem confined to public universities.

I recently attended my graduation at Liberty. I was an online student, so this was the first time I'd ever been on campus. I can confirm that they have their own police department.

A lot of the junior colleges in California have them as well.

Yup, Liberty University has their own police force. I remember that their cruisers are pretty bland in design. When I was in town last year, I almost missed that they were cop cars.

A few other private schools I know of with their own police and security departments.

Christain School
Notre Dame
West Virginia Weslyan
Villanova
Duke
Baylor

General Private Universities
Yale*
Harvard*
MIT
Stanford
Columbia

*I'm not sure of these count as Christian schools or not. They do have Divinity programs.

Looks like the Salt Lake Tribune and KUTV have filed new GRAMA requests for Joseph Bishop and Honor Code Office records as today the new law went into effect.
Let’s see how BYU juggles these requests in light of their expected decertification from the Police force in September 2019.

I have just popped some Orville Reddenbacher popcorn with garlic salt, grabbed a can of Coke Zero and am settling down in my comfy recliner to watch how this show plays out. I wonder if RFM is going to re-request the Joseph Bishop audio tapes, etc?

https://www.sltrib.com/news/2019/05/15/with-byu-police/

The lights of Provo dimmed tonight due to a sudden and mysterious wattage load in the vicinity of the shredding room of the BYUPD.

Aaaaah, I love the smell of freshly ground paper on the morning of the first insurrection. The Millennials are ushering in the millennium.

I'm posting here to keep this from dropping off the list.

I've not heard/seen anything new on this. Does anyone have info on the appeal going on? Any tidbits of gossip floating around?