2nd Anointing Lost and Found

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RubinHighlander
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2nd Anointing Lost and Found

Post by RubinHighlander » Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:37 pm

Saw this on Redit today:

https://ia801502.us.archive.org/19/item ... 201949.pdf
Letter of George F. Richards, 18 August 1949
In a letter to the First Presidency and Quorum of the Twelve on August 18, 1949, Pres. George F.
Richards stated his concern over the discontinuance of second anointings:
Pretty interesting read and very revealing as to how a bunch of old men who call themselves seers and prophets emotionally respond to situations, change policies, lose track of things, all at the expense of the eternal exaltation of thousands of TBMs. But just trust them because they are as transparent as they know how to be.

I wonder how many other interesting artifacts are locked in safes in temples and at the COB?
“Sir,' I said to the universe, 'I exist.' 'That,' said the universe, 'creates no sense of obligation in me whatsoever.”
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deacon blues
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Re: 2nd Anointing Lost and Found

Post by deacon blues » Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:53 pm

I wonder what happened in 1928 that caused them to almost stop giving 2nd annointings?
God is Love. God is Truth

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RubinHighlander
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Re: 2nd Anointing Lost and Found

Post by RubinHighlander » Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:40 pm

deacon blues wrote:
Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:53 pm
I wonder what happened in 1928 that caused them to almost stop giving 2nd annointings?
About 1928 an incident occurred which so incensed the First Presidency that they had
all the recommend books brought in to the President's office, and instructions were given that
no recommends of that character should be given by stake presidents thereafter.
The Twelve were authorized to make recommendations; but their recommendations
were rarely ever acted upon favorably, so that the administering Seconds almost entirely
ceased. In twelve years, from 1930 to 1942, when these facts were tabulated, but eight such
blessings were administered in the Church. Only EIGHT blessings in twelve years!
The incident above mentioned which so exasperated the First Presidency was as
follows: A brother who had received his Second Blessings, while speaking in a priesthood
meeting in one of the Idaho stakes, told the brethren that they all should have their Second
Blessings. Of course that was a serious infraction of the charge which he received when he had
his Second Anointings; but I have never learned of any serious consequences to follow, except
the action on the part of the Authorities, discontinuing the administration of those blessings in
the Church.
It appears to me that the mistake made by the good brother in Idaho was not so serious
as to justify letting those sacred ordinances come into disuse in the Church. I think now is the
time to act; with such modifications as to details as the brethren might feel to make, insuring
that these blessings be administered only to those who are worthy to receive them. ***
“Sir,' I said to the universe, 'I exist.' 'That,' said the universe, 'creates no sense of obligation in me whatsoever.”
--Douglas Adams

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzmYP3PbfXE

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RubinHighlander
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Re: 2nd Anointing Lost and Found

Post by RubinHighlander » Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:48 pm

I always wondered why there was not a Holy of Holies in all temples (Not just SLC), or wondered if there was and most members were just not privy to it.
Temples under construction now and in the future should be provided with a room for
the administration of these blessings alone, to be known as the Holy of Holies, for if we do not
move in the matter before us, some others coming after us will do so for it must be done, and
temples should be designed and constructed with that thought in mind.
“Sir,' I said to the universe, 'I exist.' 'That,' said the universe, 'creates no sense of obligation in me whatsoever.”
--Douglas Adams

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzmYP3PbfXE

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Rob4Hope
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Re: 2nd Anointing Lost and Found

Post by Rob4Hope » Wed Jan 30, 2019 2:13 pm

I read a dissertation paper from a BYU PhD candidate where he argued that the primary reason the church had to go with BY was because BY had his "second anointing blessings". Consequently, with the keys, he could pass that blessing along. So, the church could only go with the 'fullness of the PH'.

I remember hearing Truman Madsen lecture and skirt up against this issue. But the problem is, these guys haven't had the "heavens opened to them"...have they? They admit as much.

This 2nd Anointing is a way to have an inner circle of "whos who"...and keep the good-old-boys club going. I wonder if there is anything like a 'good-old-girls club" with this stuff?

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FiveFingerMnemonic
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Re: 2nd Anointing Lost and Found

Post by FiveFingerMnemonic » Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:05 pm

Rob4Hope wrote:I read a dissertation paper from a BYU PhD candidate where he argued that the primary reason the church had to go with BY was because BY had his "second anointing blessings". Consequently, with the keys, he could pass that blessing along. So, the church could only go with the 'fullness of the PH'.

I remember hearing Truman Madsen lecture and skirt up against this issue. But the problem is, these guys haven't had the "heavens opened to them"...have they? They admit as much.

This 2nd Anointing is a way to have an inner circle of "whos who"...and keep the good-old-boys club going. I wonder if there is anything like a 'good-old-girls club" with this stuff?
The Good old girls club is to wash the mans feet and give him a blessing during the ceremony.

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Rob4Hope
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Re: 2nd Anointing Lost and Found

Post by Rob4Hope » Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:34 pm

FiveFingerMnemonic wrote:
Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:05 pm
Rob4Hope wrote:I read a dissertation paper from a BYU PhD candidate where he argued that the primary reason the church had to go with BY was because BY had his "second anointing blessings". Consequently, with the keys, he could pass that blessing along. So, the church could only go with the 'fullness of the PH'.

I remember hearing Truman Madsen lecture and skirt up against this issue. But the problem is, these guys haven't had the "heavens opened to them"...have they? They admit as much.

This 2nd Anointing is a way to have an inner circle of "whos who"...and keep the good-old-boys club going. I wonder if there is anything like a 'good-old-girls club" with this stuff?
The Good old girls club is to wash the mans feet and give him a blessing during the ceremony.
I read about that from Tom Phillips material. It was build in misogynistic. I found the whole ceremony offensive.

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RubinHighlander
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Re: 2nd Anointing Lost and Found

Post by RubinHighlander » Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:42 pm

FiveFingerMnemonic wrote:
Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:05 pm
The Good old girls club is to wash the mans feet and give him a blessing during the ceremony.
With RSM in charge he'll have that changed so they wash each other's feet simultaneously. DW and I already do that in our jetted tub at home. But even if RSM put day spas and jetted tubs in the temples...still not enough to make me pay 10% to get the pass again. Might help with current attendance though!
“Sir,' I said to the universe, 'I exist.' 'That,' said the universe, 'creates no sense of obligation in me whatsoever.”
--Douglas Adams

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzmYP3PbfXE

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Palerider
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Re: 2nd Anointing Lost and Found

Post by Palerider » Wed Jan 30, 2019 5:29 pm

FiveFingerMnemonic wrote:
Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:05 pm
The Good old girls club is to wash the mans feet and give him a blessing during the ceremony.
I've actually seen this happen. The circumstances were such that I shouldn't relate everything but I can tell you it made me really uncomfortable with the position of the woman in the process of the 2nd anointing.

Degrading in the sense of subservience. Something very wrong on a visceral level.

I related the occurrence to Sis. Palerider and she became pretty upset with the prospect that this was an ordinance considered by church leadership to be sanctioned by Heavenly Father.

The 2nd Anointing is evil.....Just. plain. evil.
"There is but one straight course, and that is to seek truth and pursue it steadily."

"Truth will ultimately prevail where there is pains to bring it to light."

George Washington

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deacon blues
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Re: 2nd Anointing Lost and Found

Post by deacon blues » Mon Feb 04, 2019 3:17 pm

RubinHighlander wrote:
Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:40 pm
deacon blues wrote:
Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:53 pm
I wonder what happened in 1928 that caused them to almost stop giving 2nd annointings?
About 1928 an incident occurred which so incensed the First Presidency that they had
all the recommend books brought in to the President's office, and instructions were given that
no recommends of that character should be given by stake presidents thereafter.
The Twelve were authorized to make recommendations; but their recommendations
were rarely ever acted upon favorably, so that the administering Seconds almost entirely
ceased. In twelve years, from 1930 to 1942, when these facts were tabulated, but eight such
blessings were administered in the Church. Only EIGHT blessings in twelve years!
The incident above mentioned which so exasperated the First Presidency was as
follows: A brother who had received his Second Blessings, while speaking in a priesthood
meeting in one of the Idaho stakes, told the brethren that they all should have their Second
Blessings. Of course that was a serious infraction of the charge which he received when he had
his Second Anointings; but I have never learned of any serious consequences to follow, except
the action on the part of the Authorities, discontinuing the administration of those blessings in
the Church.
It appears to me that the mistake made by the good brother in Idaho was not so serious
as to justify letting those sacred ordinances come into disuse in the Church. I think now is the
time to act; with such modifications as to details as the brethren might feel to make, insuring
that these blessings be administered only to those who are worthy to receive them. ***
Sometimes I need to read slower. :o :?
God is Love. God is Truth


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RubinHighlander
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Re: 2nd Anointing Lost and Found

Post by RubinHighlander » Tue Feb 05, 2019 11:23 am

Good old BYU studies. I think a beautiful ceremony for the temple for new couples would be to wash each other's feet. At least that would be more akin to Jesus instead of all that other Masonry BS. Instead it had to relegated to a special good old boys club only at the upper echelons.
“Sir,' I said to the universe, 'I exist.' 'That,' said the universe, 'creates no sense of obligation in me whatsoever.”
--Douglas Adams

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzmYP3PbfXE

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Red Ryder
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Re: 2nd Anointing Lost and Found

Post by Red Ryder » Tue Feb 05, 2019 11:37 am

Palerider wrote:
Wed Jan 30, 2019 5:29 pm
FiveFingerMnemonic wrote:
Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:05 pm
The Good old girls club is to wash the mans feet and give him a blessing during the ceremony.
I've actually seen this happen. The circumstances were such that I shouldn't relate everything but I can tell you it made me really uncomfortable with the position of the woman in the process of the 2nd anointing.

Degrading in the sense of subservience. Something very wrong on a visceral level.

I related the occurrence to Sis. Palerider and she became pretty upset with the prospect that this was an ordinance considered by church leadership to be sanctioned by Heavenly Father.

The 2nd Anointing is evil.....Just. plain. evil.
Now you have to kiss and tell!
Those who do not move do not notice their chains. —Rosa Luxemburg

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Palerider
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Re: 2nd Anointing Lost and Found

Post by Palerider » Tue Feb 05, 2019 12:25 pm

Red Ryder wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 11:37 am
Palerider wrote:
Wed Jan 30, 2019 5:29 pm
FiveFingerMnemonic wrote:
Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:05 pm
The Good old girls club is to wash the mans feet and give him a blessing during the ceremony.
I've actually seen this happen. The circumstances were such that I shouldn't relate everything but I can tell you it made me really uncomfortable with the position of the woman in the process of the 2nd anointing.

Degrading in the sense of subservience. Something very wrong on a visceral level.

I related the occurrence to Sis. Palerider and she became pretty upset with the prospect that this was an ordinance considered by church leadership to be sanctioned by Heavenly Father.

The 2nd Anointing is evil.....Just. plain. evil.
Now you have to kiss and tell!
For the sake of not thoroughly embarrassing the wife (were she ever to get wind of this. Not likely I know but still....) I'll keep this under my hat.
"There is but one straight course, and that is to seek truth and pursue it steadily."

"Truth will ultimately prevail where there is pains to bring it to light."

George Washington

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redjay
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Re: 2nd Anointing Lost and Found

Post by redjay » Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:56 pm

2nd anointing is another major shelf breaker.

Chances are that you will get you second anointing of you are a SP/GA

Seems most of those are white collar upper middle class

What about the janitors, blue collar workers?

Elitist boys club nonsense.
At the halfway home. I'm a full-grown man. But I'm not afraid to cry.

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moksha
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Re: 2nd Anointing Lost and Found

Post by moksha » Tue Feb 05, 2019 11:37 pm

The incident above mentioned which so exasperated the First Presidency was as
follows: A brother who had received his Second Blessings, while speaking in a priesthood
meeting in one of the Idaho stakes, told the brethren that they all should have their Second
Blessings.
The first rule of the Second Anointing Club is that there is no Second Anointing Club. When it becomes common knowledge then everyone will want to join this church with the Church.
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

Charlotte
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Re: 2nd Anointing Lost and Found

Post by Charlotte » Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:27 pm

redjay wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:56 pm
2nd anointing is another major shelf breaker.

Chances are that you will get you second anointing of you are a SP/GA

Seems most of those are white collar upper middle class

What about the janitors, blue collar workers?

Elitist boys club nonsense.
For me, too. I was possibly going to come to peace with my first shelf-breaker, polygamy, but the second anointing was so demeaning and exclusive. It called all temple ceremonies into question. Disappointment with a capital D. Nothing was the same after that.

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MerrieMiss
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Re: 2nd Anointing Lost and Found

Post by MerrieMiss » Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:25 pm

Charlotte wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:27 pm
redjay wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:56 pm
2nd anointing is another major shelf breaker.

Chances are that you will get you second anointing of you are a SP/GA

Seems most of those are white collar upper middle class

What about the janitors, blue collar workers?

Elitist boys club nonsense.
For me, too. I was possibly going to come to peace with my first shelf-breaker, polygamy, but the second anointing was so demeaning and exclusive. It called all temple ceremonies into question. Disappointment with a capital D. Nothing was the same after that.
So interesting. I too, was willing to make peace with a lot of crap in the church. Even when I came to the conclusion it wasn't true, I was willing to try out a middle way, but the 2A really did me in. It made me angry every time I thought about it for years. And the indoctrination runs so deep that even after knowing the church isn't true, I still couldn't click on Tom Phillip's interview until a couple of years later.
The true opposite of order is not disorder but freedom. Most profoundly, the true opposite of control is not chaos but self-control. -Jay Griffiths

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