A few Questions for TBM Friends and Families

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Brent
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A few Questions for TBM Friends and Families

Post by Brent » Tue Apr 09, 2019 7:39 am

Simple questions. Not arguments. Just ask and wait.

We have one Heavenly Father, is there more than one Heavenly Mother?

Is the flip side of Eternal Family Eternal Separation?

Could you get me a list of Hospitals/Clinics/Health Programs the Church runs in third world countries?

Who were the very first people sealed in this, the last dispensation?

What happens to single people in the Celestial Kingdom?

Where does the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints pre-Columbian Hebrews lived?

What does Joseph’s handwritten account of the first vision say?

Was Joseph armed when he died? Did he resist at all?

Who was Joseph’s 30th wife?

Who was Emma’s second husband?

Could you point me to “peer-reviewed” studies about pre-Columbian Hebrews in the Americas?

Can you point me to a “peer-reviewed” study explaining how Hebrew DNA “disappeared” from indigenous Americans over the generations?

Could you give me the precise citation in the BoM that it clearly explains Temple work?

Could you give me the precise citation in the BoM that clearly explains Eternal Families?

Could you give me the precise citation in the BoM that clearly explains the 3 Degrees of Glory?

Could you give me the precise citation in the BoM that clearly disproves the Trinity?

Could you give me the precise citation in the BoM that clearly rejects “Hell” and explains “Spirit Prison”?

Could you give me a precise citation from the BoM or Bible that clearly explains ‘All peoples of all generations’ had the same temple experiences I did?

How does God create “spirit children”?

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wtfluff
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Re: A few Questions for TBM Friends and Families

Post by wtfluff » Tue Apr 09, 2019 8:40 am

Brent wrote:
Tue Apr 09, 2019 7:39 am
Could you give me the precise citation in the BoM that clearly explains Eternal Families?
Another good one could be:

Can you show me when / where Joseph taught about Eternal Families?

(I read a post elsewhere that mentioned how the "Families Are Forever" meme is really an invention of the modern church. Joseph didn't really teach that sealings were about "families.")
Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus

Keep the company of those who seek the truth - run from those who have found it -Václav Havel

Brilliant.

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Corsair
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Re: A few Questions for TBM Friends and Families

Post by Corsair » Tue Apr 09, 2019 9:34 am

Brent wrote:
Tue Apr 09, 2019 7:39 am
Who was Joseph’s 30th wife?

Who was Emma’s second husband?
My in-laws arranged for a family trip to Nauvoo last year. While there are some interesting parts, visiting the Potemkin Village of Mormonism is an exercise in seeing the image of how the the LDS church truly wishes their history could have turned out. I spent a week visiting church sites along with Nauvoo and could not have answered those questions after seeing all of the official church history presented at Nauvoo, Carthage, Far West, Liberty Jail, and Independence, MO.

My devout parents-in-law were almost surprised at finding that some other upstart church owned the mansion house, the red brick store, and the Smith family graveyard. They were a bit indignant that their favorite church was not in charge of the whole area.

Let me add a question to your list:
  • What were the lies printed in the "Nauvoo Expositor" that led to Joseph Smith destroying the printing press?
I posed this to my brother-in-law during the trip and after a few reiterations of the question he finally admitted that the Nauvoo Expositor was not authorized to talk about plural marriage. That's the best he could do.

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Brent
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Re: A few Questions for TBM Friends and Families

Post by Brent » Tue Apr 09, 2019 11:04 am

Thanks for the ideas. Honestly i would not use these as "gotcha" questions but as honest questions. Another:

When and where was the Melchezadik priesthood restored?

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jfro18
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Re: A few Questions for TBM Friends and Families

Post by jfro18 » Tue Apr 09, 2019 11:09 am

Can you please explain how the Book of Abraham specifically references the facsimiles yet even the church admits those facsimiles have nothing to do with Abraham or anything in the text of the Book of Abraham?

Can you explain why Joseph Smith changed the revelation on priesthood to include the two priesthoods along with a visit from John the Baptist, while none of that was mentioned before the change in 1835?

Can you explain why Joseph Smith used Deutero-Isaiah passages in the Book of Mormon that both LDS and non-LDS scholars now concede were written after Lehi would've left with hte plates?

Why would a temple ceremony that can be traced back to "the ancients" resemble the Masonic ceremony of Joseph's time that he learned just weeks prior?

Why would Joseph Smith need to marry the wives of faithful LDS members, some of whom were on missions while Joseph did this?

You could do this all day.

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wtfluff
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Re: A few Questions for TBM Friends and Families

Post by wtfluff » Tue Apr 09, 2019 11:20 am

Brent wrote:
Tue Apr 09, 2019 11:04 am
Thanks for the ideas. Honestly i would not use these as "gotcha" questions but as honest questions.
Yeah, it's hard to ever see an instance where these sorts of questions could actually be asked of a True™ Believer.

However, I would love the opportunity to sit down whith a believer, read through an "Essay" or two, and rephrase relevant questions to: "Help me understand ______________."
Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus

Keep the company of those who seek the truth - run from those who have found it -Václav Havel

Brilliant.

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Red Ryder
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Re: A few Questions for TBM Friends and Families

Post by Red Ryder » Tue Apr 09, 2019 11:54 am

Do heavenly mother(s) get a headache often?
Those who do not move do not notice their chains. —Rosa Luxemburg

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Brent
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Re: A few Questions for TBM Friends and Families

Post by Brent » Tue Apr 09, 2019 3:55 pm

Red Ryder wrote:
Tue Apr 09, 2019 11:54 am
Do heavenly mother(s) get a headache often?
Explains polygamy...

misterfake371
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Re: A few Questions for TBM Friends and Families

Post by misterfake371 » Thu Apr 11, 2019 8:01 pm

The answer to all those questions is: "It's not essential to our salvation."
Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep His commandments, for this is the whole duty of man. Ecclesiastes 12:13

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Palerider
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Re: A few Questions for TBM Friends and Families

Post by Palerider » Thu Apr 11, 2019 8:17 pm

misterfake371 wrote:
Thu Apr 11, 2019 8:01 pm
The answer to all those questions is: "It's not essential to our salvation."
Which should be the answer to:

"How important are the temple ordinances?"
"There is but one straight course, and that is to seek truth and pursue it steadily."

"Truth will ultimately prevail where there is pains to bring it to light."

George Washington

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Hagoth
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Re: A few Questions for TBM Friends and Families

Post by Hagoth » Fri Apr 12, 2019 5:42 am

Who was right about who God is, Brigham Young or James Talmage?
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain

Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."

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Corsair
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Re: A few Questions for TBM Friends and Families

Post by Corsair » Fri Apr 12, 2019 9:54 am

Hagoth wrote:
Fri Apr 12, 2019 5:42 am
Who was right about who God is, Brigham Young or James Talmage?
I'm going to select "None of the Above" on that particular controversy. The Intercessory Prayer of Jesus in John chapter 17 seems to indicate that "this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent." But several generations of prophets, seers, and revelators seem to have settled on a version of God that is blandly Protestant, but does retain individuality and a body. It's more important to know that the LDS church has the ordinances of salvation, rather than the nature of God.

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Hagoth
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Re: A few Questions for TBM Friends and Families

Post by Hagoth » Fri Apr 12, 2019 10:27 am

Corsair wrote:
Fri Apr 12, 2019 9:54 am
Hagoth wrote:
Fri Apr 12, 2019 5:42 am
Who was right about who God is, Brigham Young or James Talmage?
I'm going to select "None of the Above" on that particular controversy.
I agree, which is why this is a good question for believers to try to noodle out. Maybe I should have added, "or the scriptures."
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain

Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."

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moksha
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Re: A few Questions for TBM Friends and Families

Post by moksha » Fri Apr 12, 2019 11:56 am

If this is just between some close TBM friends who do not feel guarded in their answers:

"So do we get our own planet or what?"

"How many wives in the Celestial Kingdom do you think you might qualify for?"

"What qualities would you tell your DH to look for in a Sister-Wife?"
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

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