Silver fox is coming!
- FiveFingerMnemonic
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Silver fox is coming!
Looks like the Silver fox is joining us for stake conference next weekend. Guess I will have to try and attend that one to see what all the excitement is about listening to a former airline pilot and corporate executive board member who still can't heal people.
- FiveFingerMnemonic
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Re: Silver fox is coming!
Incidentally if he is also coming to your stake next week we should try and meet each other. Pretty sure I'm the only NOM here though.
Re: Silver fox is coming!
Don't know whether you could attend the leadership meeting I'm sure they will have on Saturday night but if Uchtdorf does like Henry B. Eyring and opens it up for questions, I would LOVE to have a do over on that!
They'd run me out of the chapel...
"Elder Uchtdorf, do you think as historian Richard Bushman stated, 'The church needs to closely align it's foundational stories with the truth?'"
They'd run me out of the chapel...
"Elder Uchtdorf, do you think as historian Richard Bushman stated, 'The church needs to closely align it's foundational stories with the truth?'"
"There is but one straight course, and that is to seek truth and pursue it steadily."
"Truth will ultimately prevail where there is pains to bring it to light."
George Washington
"Truth will ultimately prevail where there is pains to bring it to light."
George Washington
- Not Buying It
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Re: Silver fox is coming!
I’ve said it many times - President Uchtdorf is just as bad as the rest of them, he just has more charisma than all of the rest of them combined. In a way he’s worse than the rest - it’s fairly easy to see President Oaks is a jerk, he doesn’t even try to hide it, but the Silver Fox is more cunning and subtle. He knows how to put up a warm fuzzy front all the while supporting the demeaning policies of heartless, soulless organization. And “doubt your doubts” should have told us all everything we need to know about how supportive he is of us NOM types. Don’t kid yourself - he’s as Church broke as the rest of them.FiveFingerMnemonic wrote: ↑Sun Aug 18, 2019 11:24 amLooks like the Silver fox is joining us for stake conference next weekend. Guess I will have to try and attend that one to see what all the excitement is about listening to a former airline pilot and corporate executive board member who still can't heal people.
I really don’t get the love for the guy among the disaffected. Some of the most dangerous people out there are the ones who can charm your socks off while robbing you blind.
And as you so rightly suggest, he claims to be something he is not. Until he heals people like the apostles of the New Testament, he has no right to claim to be just like them.
"The truth is elegantly simple. The lie needs complex apologia. 4 simple words: Joe made it up. It answers everything with the perfect simplicity of Occam's Razor. Every convoluted excuse withers." - Some guy on Reddit called disposazelph
Re: Silver fox is coming!
Yep.Not Buying It wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 5:40 amDon’t kid yourself - he’s as Church broke as the rest of them.
After being raised to adore the Q15 and then actually becoming one, the huge ego trip and prestige are probably impossible for Uchtdorf to overcome. Regardless of what he might suspect in his heart of hearts is true.
Plus the 1st. Pres. has him emotionally locked in with the extra special, superduper, razmataz, abracadabra, 2nd anointing. How could he turn his back on that!?!?
He is just so WAY, WAY special now.
"There is but one straight course, and that is to seek truth and pursue it steadily."
"Truth will ultimately prevail where there is pains to bring it to light."
George Washington
"Truth will ultimately prevail where there is pains to bring it to light."
George Washington
Re: Silver fox is coming!
We have stake conference next week, but no GA is coming. I wouldn't mind hearing the Silver Fox "off the record".FiveFingerMnemonic wrote: ↑Sun Aug 18, 2019 11:26 amIncidentally if he is also coming to your stake next week we should try and meet each other. Pretty sure I'm the only NOM here though.
- RubinHighlander
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Re: Silver fox is coming!
I agree that Dieter is as church broke as the rest of them, perhaps, even with a little more knowledge into the issues and one that really knows the truth. But after he had the Faith Crisis Report in his hands and did his famous Doubt Your Doubts/Past Leader Mistakes talk, it seemed like that talk was his struggle with the real reasons people were leaving and his effort to start the inoculation campaign with the essays. Then they kicked him down the ladder. Will be interesting to see if his attitude is changed; I'm guessing they kicked him down and he's playing nicer now, not stirring the pot anymore.
“Sir,' I said to the universe, 'I exist.' 'That,' said the universe, 'creates no sense of obligation in me whatsoever.”
--Douglas Adams
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzmYP3PbfXE
--Douglas Adams
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzmYP3PbfXE
- FiveFingerMnemonic
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Re: Silver fox is coming!
I have this fantasy that for stake visits my house gets chosen and he shows up so I can grill him over the fire with questions and ask him to heal my paralyzed neighbor. I'm guessing apostles don't stoop that low though.
Re: Silver fox is coming!
I'm not certain he's AS church broke in his beliefs as some of them but he is as inextricably entwined in the institution, so the result is the same.
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain
Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."
Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."
- RubinHighlander
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Re: Silver fox is coming!
My fantasy is to meet Bednar and ask him to strike me down and show me his awesome power, like Korihor in the BOM. Go ahead fetcher! Strike me dead or dumb! If everyone in the room should standup when you enter, then make an example out of me! I'm the wicked generation that's asking for a sign! He'd refuse, at which point I'd tell him he is one of the most abhorrent and dishonest men in this world, making a living off the backs of innocent people by making them believe he has some power from God when the truth is he does not.FiveFingerMnemonic wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 2:49 pmI have this fantasy that for stake visits my house gets chosen and he shows up so I can grill him over the fire with questions and ask him to heal my paralyzed neighbor. I'm guessing apostles don't stoop that low though.
“Sir,' I said to the universe, 'I exist.' 'That,' said the universe, 'creates no sense of obligation in me whatsoever.”
--Douglas Adams
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzmYP3PbfXE
--Douglas Adams
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzmYP3PbfXE
Re: Silver fox is coming!
Let us know if anything actually profound gets stated. Like others have said, he's entirely entwined in the top quorum which is a bubble inside a larger bubble. But, I think Dieter harbors some empathy for doubters. Let us know if anything interesting gets presented.FiveFingerMnemonic wrote: ↑Sun Aug 18, 2019 11:24 amLooks like the Silver fox is joining us for stake conference next weekend. Guess I will have to try and attend that one to see what all the excitement is about listening to a former airline pilot and corporate executive board member who still can't heal people.
Re: Silver fox is coming!
Korihor's curse was instrumental in the salvation of the Nephites. I'd take a curse in order to help my family and neighbors live more righteously. Funny how a god that is the same yesterday, today, and forever changes his tactics so much.RubinHighlander wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 4:10 pmMy fantasy is to meet Bednar and ask him to strike me down and show me his awesome power, like Korihor in the BOM. Go ahead fetcher! Strike me dead or dumb! If everyone in the room should standup when you enter, then make an example out of me! I'm the wicked generation that's asking for a sign! He'd refuse, at which point I'd tell him he is one of the most abhorrent and dishonest men in this world, making a living off the backs of innocent people by making them believe he has some power from God when the truth is he does not.FiveFingerMnemonic wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 2:49 pmI have this fantasy that for stake visits my house gets chosen and he shows up so I can grill him over the fire with questions and ask him to heal my paralyzed neighbor. I'm guessing apostles don't stoop that low though.
We actually had a ZL on my mission who counseled missionaries to show investigators the story of Korihor when someone asked for a sign.We were to promise that they would get a sign to their condemnation. I am unaware of anyone who had an ill effect from a missionary curse.
Re: Silver fox is coming!
Get an audio recorder app for you phone and record the meeting. It isn't too hard but make sure to test things out before the actual meeting. You never know when one of these guys will say something interesting, and it is always nice to have a recording of it. We are a record keeping people after all...
Stands next to Kolob, called by the Egyptians Oliblish, which is the next grand governing creation near to the celestial or the place where God resides; holding the key of power also, pertaining to other planets; as revealed from God to Abraham
- FiveFingerMnemonic
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Re: Silver fox is coming!
Recorded the talk but nothing really groundbreaking was said.
The impression I get is that these conferences are tedious for them. Dieter looked like he had a cold and is getting older and tired.
Mostly it was a sermon on the for the strength of youth pamphlet and getting a temple recommend.
He used the word "mormon" once and also told the story/joke of Steve Young in the locker room where the other NFL players were asking where they could get a pair of garments and Steve replied that they "are too expensive".
Talked about how LDS can be too insular and unwelcoming, even here in Utah or especially here in Utah. Theme was to be "open" and welcoming.
That's about it. The only bonus was it was only 1.5 hrs long instead of the typical 2 hours.
The impression I get is that these conferences are tedious for them. Dieter looked like he had a cold and is getting older and tired.
Mostly it was a sermon on the for the strength of youth pamphlet and getting a temple recommend.
He used the word "mormon" once and also told the story/joke of Steve Young in the locker room where the other NFL players were asking where they could get a pair of garments and Steve replied that they "are too expensive".
Talked about how LDS can be too insular and unwelcoming, even here in Utah or especially here in Utah. Theme was to be "open" and welcoming.
That's about it. The only bonus was it was only 1.5 hrs long instead of the typical 2 hours.
Re: Silver fox is coming!
FiveFingerMnemonic wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2019 11:03 amRecorded the talk but nothing really groundbreaking was said.
The impression I get is that these conferences are tedious for them. Dieter looked like he had a cold and is getting older and tired.
Mostly it was a sermon on the for the strength of youth pamphlet and getting a temple recommend.
He used the word "mormon" once and also told the story/joke of Steve Young in the locker room where the other NFL players were asking where they could get a pair of garments and Steve replied that they "are too expensive".
Talked about how LDS can be too insular and unwelcoming, even here in Utah or especially here in Utah. Theme was to be "open" and welcoming.
That's about it. The only bonus was it was only 1.5 hrs long instead of the typical 2 hours.
The old "rinse and repeat", eh? That must get so tiresome for those guys. But hey, anything for the true church.....
"There is but one straight course, and that is to seek truth and pursue it steadily."
"Truth will ultimately prevail where there is pains to bring it to light."
George Washington
"Truth will ultimately prevail where there is pains to bring it to light."
George Washington
Re: Silver fox is coming!
Sounds like a good message for your stake. That is, after all, a real problem.
The Church made a PR blunder by not retaining Elder Uchtdoft in the First Presidency.
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha
-- Moksha
- Just This Guy
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Re: Silver fox is coming!
Yup, the church will let the ego of one person put them into a publicly embarrassing position that they are now stuck with for years to come. The sad part is just how often this is the case and primary driving factor of LDSinc. How many of the PR blunders of the last half century are driven by the ego of one or two people?
* Blacks & the priesthood? Several members of the Q15 were pushing for this as early as the late 50's, but a few holdovers delayed it for decades. They eventually pushed OD2 though when they were out on assignment and unable to vote.
* The name "Mormon" being evil? A pet peeve of MRN.
* POX? A few pushed it through and then they had to backtrack.
* It sounds like a number of the high profile excommunications were due to them offending someone in the Q15.
"The story so far: In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move." -- Douglas Adams
- RubinHighlander
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Re: Silver fox is coming!
Anything to keep your investments and extended family's quality of life in tact. Integrity be damned!
“Sir,' I said to the universe, 'I exist.' 'That,' said the universe, 'creates no sense of obligation in me whatsoever.”
--Douglas Adams
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzmYP3PbfXE
--Douglas Adams
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzmYP3PbfXE
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