Next biblical scholarship overview - the global flood and mormonism

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jfro18
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Next biblical scholarship overview - the global flood and mormonism

Post by jfro18 » Fri Sep 11, 2020 11:05 am

I just finished up the next overview of the global flood and Mormonism.

I have to say on this one that I am shocked that as a believer I never really connected the dots. I remember even as a kid thinking there was no way every living human and animal was killed off, but I still never connected the dots to Mormonism... and obviously I had zero idea about the Epic of Gilgamesh at the time which I just learned also mirrors the Adam and Eve story.

For anyone who might be interested it is at, http://www.ldsdiscussions.com/flood

So now Adam and Eve, Global Flood, and Tower of Babel are done. The remaining ones I have as of now:

Deutero-Isaiah
Christology is Mormonism vs actual evolution of Christology
Sermon on the Mount/Sermon at the Temple
Lost tribes of Israel
Long ending of Mark in the BoM
An overview of the problems with the reliance on the KJV

On the plus side, some of those should be much shorter than the first three, although I've gotten some really good suggestions on more topics.

If anyone reads and has any comments/questions/criticisms fire away - I need the pushback/feedback.

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Corsair
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Re: Next biblical scholarship overview - the global flood and mormonism

Post by Corsair » Sat Sep 12, 2020 8:38 am

It's a good article and I am trying to imagine an apologetic response that could rely on anything other than large amounts of faith. Thanks for creating this.

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Hagoth
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Re: Next biblical scholarship overview - the global flood and mormonism

Post by Hagoth » Sat Sep 12, 2020 9:25 am

Great article jfro.

"If there was a global flood, we would expect to see inscriptions of it in Egypt in the pyramids, but there is absolutely no reference to a global flood. This has implications for the Book of Abraham which we will cover later, but how did civilizations survive a global flood without any record of being destroyed or even interrupted?"

Better yet, how did they survive at all? They are the very civilizations that God intended to wipe out with the flood. He must be a pretty lame cosmic smiters, considering that these civilizations just went on completely interrupted and unaware that they had been deluged by a global ocean that was deep enough to cover the Himalayas.

Although the Babylonian translation is the common version of The Epic of Gilgamesh, the original story is much older and was first written in Sumerian cuneiform. Some recovered samples predate the Babylonian by centuries. It's impossible that the exiled OT authors wouldn't have been intimately acquainted with these stories, the Epic is one of the most common documents found in archaeological sites and was used in scribal schools as a standard learning and practice exercise.

The question of how the kangaroos and penguins got to Mesopotamia before the flood and then returned to their respective continents afterward was answered by an LDS Living article some time ago. They were carried by angels. So God can fly them all around the globe via magic but for some reason he needs a guy to build a wooden boat to keep them dry?
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain

Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."

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jfro18
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Re: Next biblical scholarship overview - the global flood and mormonism

Post by jfro18 » Sat Sep 12, 2020 10:40 am

Hagoth wrote:
Sat Sep 12, 2020 9:25 am
Better yet, how did they survive at all? They are the very civilizations that God intended to wipe out with the flood. He must be a pretty lame cosmic smiters, considering that these civilizations just went on completely interrupted and unaware that they had been deluged by a global ocean that was deep enough to cover the Himalayas.
That's a point I need to add in there as well - I know it's covered elsewhere, but you're right that not only was it not mentioned or inscribed anywhere, but life went on as if nothing happened.
Hagoth wrote:
Sat Sep 12, 2020 9:25 am
Although the Babylonian translation is the common version of The Epic of Gilgamesh, the original story is much older and was first written in Sumerian cuneiform. Some recovered samples predate the Babylonian by centuries. It's impossible that the exiled OT authors wouldn't have been intimately acquainted with these stories, the Epic is one of the most common documents found in archaeological sites and was used in scribal schools as a standard learning and practice exercise.
Another good point - I saw they believed the Sumerian was like 2800 BCE, so well before Genesis and even the flood timeline. I need to add a note to that.
Hagoth wrote:
Sat Sep 12, 2020 9:25 am
The question of how the kangaroos and penguins got to Mesopotamia before the flood and then returned to their respective continents afterward was answered by an LDS Living article some time ago. They were carried by angels. So God can fly them all around the globe via magic but for some reason he needs a guy to build a wooden boat to keep them dry?
I actually started typing this but I could not find the article that said the angels carried them back to their home continents/lands so I yanked it. :lol:

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Hagoth
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Re: Next biblical scholarship overview - the global flood and mormonism

Post by Hagoth » Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:48 pm

jfro18 wrote:
Sat Sep 12, 2020 10:40 am
Hagoth wrote:
Sat Sep 12, 2020 9:25 am
The question of how the kangaroos and penguins got to Mesopotamia before the flood and then returned to their respective continents afterward was answered by an LDS Living article some time ago. They were carried by angels. So God can fly them all around the globe via magic but for some reason he needs a guy to build a wooden boat to keep them dry?
I actually started typing this but I could not find the article that said the angels carried them back to their home continents/lands so I yanked it. :lol:
My mistake. It was not LDS Living, it was Meridian magazine: https://latterdaysaintmag.com/article-1-14059/
It's a pretty entertaining article siding with Ken Hamm over Bill Nye.
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain

Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."

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Re: Next biblical scholarship overview - the global flood and mormonism

Post by fetchface » Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:12 pm

I don't have anything insightful to contribute but I thought I'd leave this here for everyone's enjoyment: https://www.theonion.com/sumerians-look ... 1819571221
Ubi Dubium Ibi Libertas
My blog: http://untanglingmybrain.blogspot.com/

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jfro18
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Re: Next biblical scholarship overview - the global flood and mormonism

Post by jfro18 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:15 pm

Hagoth wrote:
Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:48 pm
My mistake. It was not LDS Living, it was Meridian magazine: https://latterdaysaintmag.com/article-1-14059/
It's a pretty entertaining article siding with Ken Hamm over Bill Nye.
Incredible. How could someone write this without seeing how absolutely nonsensical it is?
Noah did not need to capture the animals that went into the ark. They amazingly came by themselves, two by two, or by sevens for some kinds of animals. Did the kangaroo from Australia really need to make the long journey or perhaps impossible journey on its own with its mate to be included in the ark? Or, was angelic assistance involved in collecting the animals for the ark?
fetchface wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:12 pm
I don't have anything insightful to contribute but I thought I'd leave this here for everyone's enjoyment: https://www.theonion.com/sumerians-look ... 1819571221
This is also incredible and I wish I had the guts to share this on Facebook. :lol:

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Red Ryder
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Re: Next biblical scholarship overview - the global flood and mormonism

Post by Red Ryder » Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:57 pm

fetchface wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:12 pm
I don't have anything insightful to contribute but I thought I'd leave this here for everyone's enjoyment: https://www.theonion.com/sumerians-look ... 1819571221
Holy Fetch.... a Fetch drive by!

How You doing? Stop by more often and give us an update.
Those who do not move do not notice their chains. —Rosa Luxemburg

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Hagoth
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Re: Next biblical scholarship overview - the global flood and mormonism

Post by Hagoth » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:22 pm

jfro18 wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:15 pm
Incredible. How could someone write this without seeing how absolutely nonsensical it is?
I liked this part:
So, the answer to this question about the kangaroos is that they doubtless took the same transportation back to Australia as they took to go to the ark. And I doubt if they or many of the other animals had to hop, jump or walk much at all-they just needed to catch the right “Angel-air” transport at the right time, as it were.

Once again, this seems like foolishness for those who do not believe in a God of miracles. Yet, those who disbelieve in miracles do believe in the modern day technological miracles of fleets of jet aircraft crossing the world with passengers and freight every day.[26]
If you can believe in jets how could you NOT believe that angels transport kangaroos.

G1: So they couldn't bring a kangaroo back anyway.
G2: Wait a minute! Supposing *two* angels carried it together!
G1: Nooo..... They'd have to have it on a line...
G2: Well, simple! They'd just use a strand of creeper!
G1: What, held under the dorsal guiding feathers?
G2: Well, why not?

And then he has a footnote to explain it! But if you click on the References link you get a 404 error. Dang. I wanted to find out who the academic expert is on angelic marsupial conveyance.
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain

Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."

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fetchface
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Re: Next biblical scholarship overview - the global flood and mormonism

Post by fetchface » Wed Sep 23, 2020 12:40 pm

Red Ryder wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:57 pm
Holy Fetch.... a Fetch drive by!

How You doing? Stop by more often and give us an update.
I really doing great. I've been successful at finding community outside of the church and that's really the key to moving on I think.
Ubi Dubium Ibi Libertas
My blog: http://untanglingmybrain.blogspot.com/

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