What neuroscience tells us about Mormonism
What neuroscience tells us about Mormonism
Andrew Newberg is a neuroscientist who uses fMRI scans to visualize spiritual states in the human brain. He has demonstrated that when people from all corners of religious practice (monks, nuns, meditators, mystics...) enter a state that we would call "feeling the spirit" their brains assume an identical blood distribution pattern and light up in the same way. In other words, everyone from all faiths experience "the spirit" in exactly the same way and to the same degree.
Dr. Michael Ferguson is a neuroscientist who has done a similar study with devout Mormons and determined that the Mormon version of "feeling the spirit" also manifests in the same way on brain scans. Ferguson, however, reported some inconsistency with his Mormon subjects. He attributed this to "influences of social desirability." In other words, some of the Mormon participants were overreporting the amount of "the spirit" they were feeling. They were pretending to have a more profound experience than they really were because of the expectations of others.
Is that Mormonism in a nutshell?
Dr. Michael Ferguson is a neuroscientist who has done a similar study with devout Mormons and determined that the Mormon version of "feeling the spirit" also manifests in the same way on brain scans. Ferguson, however, reported some inconsistency with his Mormon subjects. He attributed this to "influences of social desirability." In other words, some of the Mormon participants were overreporting the amount of "the spirit" they were feeling. They were pretending to have a more profound experience than they really were because of the expectations of others.
Is that Mormonism in a nutshell?
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain
Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."
Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."
Re: What neuroscience tells us about Mormonism
Can you imagine having to lay down in the claustrophobic tunnel of an MRI machine listening to Fast and testimony meeting, general conference, or a Sherri Dew talk?
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“Those who do not move do not notice their chains.” ~Rosa Luxemburg
- deacon blues
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Re: What neuroscience tells us about Mormonism
Thanks Hagoth, can you post a reference to the articles?
God is Love. God is Truth. The greatest problem with organized religion is that the organization becomes god, rather than a means of serving God.
Re: What neuroscience tells us about Mormonism
In a nutshell? Pretty much methinks.
That's where all the "too sacred to talk about" BS comes from.
I do like to say that one of the most important parts of MORmONism is out-MORmONing your MORmON neighbors.
Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus
IDKSAF -RubinHighlander
You can surrender without a prayer...
IDKSAF -RubinHighlander
You can surrender without a prayer...
Re: What neuroscience tells us about Mormonism
In that case, the lights would indicate a numbing sensation. Wonder how Mormon brains would light up with an inspirational talk from Marianne Williamson?
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha
-- Moksha
Re: What neuroscience tells us about Mormonism
I always wondered how many people going through their first temple experience, were as disappointed as me. Regardless of my disappointment, I put on my smiley face and feigned enthusiasm for the wonderful experience. I'm so embarrassed by that lie now.Hagoth wrote: ↑Thu Nov 04, 2021 7:37 am
Dr. Michael Ferguson is a neuroscientist who has done a similar study with devout Mormons and determined that the Mormon version of "feeling the spirit" also manifests in the same way on brain scans. Ferguson, however, reported some inconsistency with his Mormon subjects. He attributed this to "influences of social desirability." In other words, some of the Mormon participants were overreporting the amount of "the spirit" they were feeling. They were pretending to have a more profound experience than they really were because of the expectations of others.
Is that Mormonism in a nutshell?
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Re: What neuroscience tells us about Mormonism
That's really interesting! So the additional mental gymnastics that mormons do to keep their indoctrinated state of mind intact...they are not even acknowledged in the brain. I think this is the manifestation as to how much self-dishonesty and justification goes on in most mormon brains to try and keep their heads above water in the tribal soup. Maybe this makes a mormon faith crisis more intense than most other faiths, compounded by the potentially serious tribal social costs (at least behind the zion curtain).
“Sir,' I said to the universe, 'I exist.' 'That,' said the universe, 'creates no sense of obligation in me whatsoever.”
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzmYP3PbfXE
--Douglas Adams
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzmYP3PbfXE
Re: What neuroscience tells us about Mormonism
It can't be much worse than trying to have a spiritual experience while listening to the high councilman while Brother Rogers is coughing on the back of your neck and the Wheeler twins keep spilling Cheerios all over your shoes.
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain
Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."
Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."
Re: What neuroscience tells us about Mormonism
Me too! I was so physically ill after my endowment that I asked my parents to take me home afterward. While they were out celebrating my initiation into the upper crust of Mormonism I was home lying in the dark trying to suppress my nausea and pounding headache. But somehow, before I knew it, the temple had become the greatest experience of my life.
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain
Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."
Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."
Re: What neuroscience tells us about Mormonism
I don't need to tell you that these brain scan studies also show that psychedelics produce the same brain activity patterns and enduring psychological transformations as traditional mystical practices.RubinHighlander wrote: ↑Fri Nov 05, 2021 8:12 amThat's really interesting! So the additional mental gymnastics that mormons do to keep their indoctrinated state of mind intact...they are not even acknowledged in the brain. I think this is the manifestation as to how much self-dishonesty and justification goes on in most mormon brains to try and keep their heads above water in the tribal soup. Maybe this makes a mormon faith crisis more intense than most other faiths, compounded by the potentially serious tribal social costs (at least behind the zion curtain).
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain
Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."
Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."
- RubinHighlander
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Re: What neuroscience tells us about Mormonism
Indeed! I guess the POV of the individual still determines the category of these interactions: mystical, metaphysical or just bio chemistry. But, the science side of it, at least for me, is hard evidence that Smith incorporated does not own or have any special patent on a spiritual experience. In fact, their spin on it masks and heavily contaminates the personal experience. TSCC is deceiving and stealing from people what should be their own individual experience, using it to manipulate and control them.Hagoth wrote: ↑Fri Nov 05, 2021 2:53 pmI don't need to tell you that these brain scan studies also show that psychedelics produce the same brain activity patterns and enduring psychological transformations as traditional mystical practices.RubinHighlander wrote: ↑Fri Nov 05, 2021 8:12 amThat's really interesting! So the additional mental gymnastics that mormons do to keep their indoctrinated state of mind intact...they are not even acknowledged in the brain. I think this is the manifestation as to how much self-dishonesty and justification goes on in most mormon brains to try and keep their heads above water in the tribal soup. Maybe this makes a mormon faith crisis more intense than most other faiths, compounded by the potentially serious tribal social costs (at least behind the zion curtain).
“Sir,' I said to the universe, 'I exist.' 'That,' said the universe, 'creates no sense of obligation in me whatsoever.”
--Douglas Adams
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzmYP3PbfXE
--Douglas Adams
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzmYP3PbfXE
- stealthbishop
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Re: What neuroscience tells us about Mormonism
That's fascinating research.Hagoth wrote: ↑Thu Nov 04, 2021 7:37 amAndrew Newberg is a neuroscientist who uses fMRI scans to visualize spiritual states in the human brain. He has demonstrated that when people from all corners of religious practice (monks, nuns, meditators, mystics...) enter a state that we would call "feeling the spirit" their brains assume an identical blood distribution pattern and light up in the same way. In other words, everyone from all faiths experience "the spirit" in exactly the same way and to the same degree.
Dr. Michael Ferguson is a neuroscientist who has done a similar study with devout Mormons and determined that the Mormon version of "feeling the spirit" also manifests in the same way on brain scans. Ferguson, however, reported some inconsistency with his Mormon subjects. He attributed this to "influences of social desirability." In other words, some of the Mormon participants were overreporting the amount of "the spirit" they were feeling. They were pretending to have a more profound experience than they really were because of the expectations of others.
Is that Mormonism in a nutshell?
This is what started to help me pull away from orthodoxy, is learning (in a different way) that it was not uncommon for human beings to have powerful spiritual experiences and naturally they would see that those experiences lead them in the direction that they think is right for themselves rather than one straight and narrow path. I began to see the arrogance of believing that their spiritual experiences were somehow inferior or misguided compared to mine even though that is probably not atypical.
The part that I didn't know is the social desirability component. That's interesting and could account for why so many LDS people, even orthodox, are bored to tears but often keep it hidden. It can be very superficial.
Thanks for sharing this!
"Take second best
Put me to the test
Things on your chest
You need to confess"
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Put me to the test
Things on your chest
You need to confess"
-Depeche Mode
Re: What neuroscience tells us about Mormonism
Hello NOM. I'm still alive out here......occasionally checking in and seeing what the latest is.
The "feeling the spirit" events in my life are very interesting. VERY interesting. What blew the lid on it being subjective for me was when watching Star Wars. When Luke has his force moments, and the John Williams french horn music kicks in (which is just gorgeous music!) I get chills up and down my spine like crazy. And a burning in my heart,...etc. Its an "OH YEH BABY....HERE WE GO!!!!" moment.
From that, "I can say, with every fiber of my being, that I KNOW the Force is TRUE!"
I'm only being a little flippant. There is a serious side of this -- I lost 40 years of my life being part of a cult which manipulated spiritual events to control me. Who would have though that "The Force" would wake me up?
I must be a padawan in the making....
The "feeling the spirit" events in my life are very interesting. VERY interesting. What blew the lid on it being subjective for me was when watching Star Wars. When Luke has his force moments, and the John Williams french horn music kicks in (which is just gorgeous music!) I get chills up and down my spine like crazy. And a burning in my heart,...etc. Its an "OH YEH BABY....HERE WE GO!!!!" moment.
From that, "I can say, with every fiber of my being, that I KNOW the Force is TRUE!"
I'm only being a little flippant. There is a serious side of this -- I lost 40 years of my life being part of a cult which manipulated spiritual events to control me. Who would have though that "The Force" would wake me up?
I must be a padawan in the making....
Re: What neuroscience tells us about Mormonism
Hi Rob! Good to hear from you.
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain
Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."
Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."
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