Keeping up with Trump

[Hagoth]

“I have a foreboding of an America in my children's or grandchildren's time -- when the United States is a service and information economy; when nearly all the manufacturing industries have slipped away to other countries; when awesome technological powers are in the hands of a very few, and no one representing the public interest can even grasp the issues; when the people have lost the ability to set their own agendas or knowledgeably question those in authority; when, clutching our crystals and nervously consulting our horoscopes, our critical faculties in decline, unable to distinguish between what feels good and what's true, we slide, almost without noticing, back into superstition and darkness...

The dumbing down of American is most evident in the slow decay of substantive content in the enormously influential media, the 30 second sound bites, lowest common denominator programming, credulous presentations on pseudoscience and superstition, but especially a kind of celebration of ignorance” Carl Sagan

[wtfluff]

As Mr. Trump would put it:

#YoureFired

[deacon blues]

I hope Trump doesn't shed his "Captain Moroni" image and turn traitor like Amalikiah.

[deacon blues]

There are two types of people in the world...

...those who group everyone into two types and those who don't

It's such a binary world.

Sometimes the truth is so darned funny! Thanks you two. Pun intended.

[Reuben]

...those who group everyone into two types and those who don't

It's such a binary world.

Sometimes the truth is so darned funny! Thanks you two. Pun intended.

There are 10 types of people in the world: those who know binary, and those who don't.

[moksha]

[SaidNobody]

Yeah, he's a great guy and a real straight-shooter: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/201 ... -lies.html

I read through about 40-50 of these "lies." Most of them are stupid like, "I think I hold the record for being on the cover of Time." Like he was on the cover 11x, and Nixon was 44x. He said, "I think" that I hold the record. First off, who gives a shit? But then, not being aware that a dead dude might hold the record don't make him a liar. If you notice, when Trump doesn't know but still wants to claim some fame he uses the words "I think, or I might."

The one about Iraq was interesting. Before we went into Iraq we had been sending weapon inspectors into Iraq for years. One of the former inspectors was jumping up and down and screaming that there was NO WAY that Iraq had WMDs. He went onto every show that would have him and tell his story. Iraq was starving and couldn't afford to build such weapons. Most of us that heard his message found it believable. But as time went on, he disappeared and his message was silenced. I don't remember if Trump commented on this, but I sort of remember that this guy mentioned he told him and other people that would listen. He literally was begging anyone and everyone, and he might have mentioned a few millionaires.

I believed him. His story wasn't that Iraq wasn't hateful enough, but rather just too broken. Then Collin Powell got on TV and started showing us how that if "these trucks had moved from here to over there then it couldn't be good." I didn't trust Bush, but Powell seemed like a solid guy. So I admit, I went from "this is wrong to let's kick their ass." I can totally believe that Trump had the same feelings. My agreement with the invasion lasted less than a month. I would love to say that I was always it against because I basically was, but for the very important month of the invasion, I suckered for the government's lies.

The other "lies" are weak. Like the biggest audience for a president. With online viewers, it is thought that more than 100 million people watched it live. It's not even about how much people like him, it's about the technology that allowed people around the world to watch. There are pictures that show the Washington mall as full as any other event. I mean, only so many people can fit into the mall.

Again, why is this considered a lie? This isn't like, "I didn't have sexual relations with that woman." Or "If you want to keep your healthcare you can keep it."

I reviewed several of the other "lies" and they are "we couldn't find witnesses to prove the stories" sort of lies. Just because you cannot find witnesses, doesn't mean he lied.

Give me a single lie, one that has solid lines, like "I was married only twice" and holy crap we found it was 3 times.

[Hagoth]

Have you listened to him the past few days?

And how about "We're rounding the curve." "Masks don't work." "It will just go away magically when the weather gets warm." "Science doesn't know how viruses work, I do." "Mexico will pay for it."

Almost as bad as his lying is his childish tantrums, name calling and bullying and being a horrible representative and example of this country. Humping the flag is not patriotism. Paying your f***king taxes is patriotism. And his wall? Two hundred miles of "wall" got "built," which actually turned out to be 184 miles of fence repaired or replaced and 16 miles of new fence. Oh, plus the piece of wall his buddies built via fundraiser and embezzled the money.

I will be so glad to not have his idiotic noise blasted in my face 24-7. He'll still keep doing it, but nobody will care and people will slowly back away from him and then his political allies will run from him as fast as they can. And then he will go back to being a prime-time TV personality.

[SaidNobody]

Have you listened to him the past few days?

And how about "We're rounding the curve." "Masks don't work." "It will just go away magically when the weather gets warm." "Science doesn't know how viruses work, I do." "Mexico will pay for it."

Almost as bad as his lying is his childish tantrums, name calling and bullying and being a horrible representative and example of this country. Humping the flag is not patriotism. Paying your f***king taxes is patriotism. And his wall? Two hundred miles of "wall" got "built," which actually turned out to be 184 miles of fence repaired or replaced and 16 miles of new fence. Oh, plus the piece of the wall his buddies built via fundraiser and embezzled the money.

I will be so glad to not have his idiotic noise blasted in my face 24-7. He'll still keep doing it, but nobody will care and people will slowly back away from him and then his political allies will run from him as fast as they can. And then he will go back to being a prime-time TV personality.

He won the election. He probably isn't going away for another 4 years. Masks don't work. 85% of people that caught the virus wore masks basically "all the time." The germ spreads mostly from touching infected hands to nose, mouth, and eyes. Paying taxes is government robbery, there was a time and place we didn't need to do income taxes. Almost 400 miles is completed, I think 385 was the last reported number. I know the media searches obscure the number. Took me hours to get what I considered the real answer. The New Fence isn't even important, as places without ANY FENCE were probably not a problem. Replacing the old fence with a functional fence is an important thing. Mexico is paying for the fence in different ways. But most importantly, Mexico has put troops on the wall which is probably one of the most effective parts of the wall. Catching people "before" they get across the border about 99% more effective than waiting for them to get here. If people started a fund for the wall, it was probably well-intended. But none of that money went to Trump or the Wall.

[deacon blues]

As I study Mormon history I'm continually amazed at how similar Trump's and Joseph Smith's personalities are. Joseph had a strange charisma and relied on it to win people over. But when people saw through Joseph his charm disappeared. (See William Law among many others.) Joseph valued loyalty over everything else. (interactions with Heber Kimball, Brigham Young, etc.) Joseph had an irrational belief in the power of positive thinking- to the point of denying reality. (See Ezra Booth's account of Joseph's dispute with Edward Partridge in Missouri.) Joseph would joke about serious things at times. (See Joseph Knight Sr.'s account of retrieving the Gold plates.) And do I even need to go into how Joseph Smith treated women? Out of the two, Joseph was a more brazen liar. (Seven wives when I can only find one?)

[Reuben]

As I study Mormon history I'm continually amazed at how similar Trump's and Joseph Smith's personalities are. Joseph had a strange charisma and relied on it to win people over. But when people saw through Joseph his charm disappeared. (See William Law among many others.) Joseph valued loyalty over everything else. (interactions with Heber Kimball, Brigham Young, etc.) Joseph had an irrational belief in the power of positive thinking- to the point of denying reality. (See Ezra Booth's account of Joseph's dispute with Edward Partridge in Missouri.) Joseph would joke about serious things at times. (See Joseph Knight Sr.'s account of retrieving the Gold plates.) And do I even need to go into how Joseph Smith treated women? Out of the two, Joseph was a more brazen liar. (Seven wives when I can only find one?)

I've noticed the same thing.

I wish we would use the correct word.for what both of them did/do so frequently. It's bullshitting - speaking to persuade without regard to the truth - and yes, it's a well-defined, technical term in philosophy.

[wtfluff]

As I study Mormon history I'm continually amazed at how similar Trump's and Joseph Smith's personalities are. Joseph had a strange charisma and relied on it to win people over. But when people saw through Joseph his charm disappeared. (See William Law among many others.) Joseph valued loyalty over everything else. (interactions with Heber Kimball, Brigham Young, etc.) Joseph had an irrational belief in the power of positive thinking- to the point of denying reality. (See Ezra Booth's account of Joseph's dispute with Edward Partridge in Missouri.) Joseph would joke about serious things at times. (See Joseph Knight Sr.'s account of retrieving the Gold plates.) And do I even need to go into how Joseph Smith treated women? Out of the two, Joseph was a more brazen liar. (Seven wives when I can only find one?)

I've noticed the same thing.

I wish we would use the correct word.for what both of them did/do so frequently. It's bullshitting - speaking to persuade without regard to the truth - and yes, it's a well-defined, technical term in philosophy.

Isn't the correct COTPOTCOJCOL-d$ term "Carefully Worded Denials?"(™)

[Hagoth]

He won the election.

One of the most hilarious moments in recent history was his supporters yelling, "Stop the count!" while he was ahead and then switching to, "Count the vote!" when he dropped behind. You can't buy that kind of entertainment.

p.s. he lost.

[SaidNobody]

A question remains unanswered.

How will you react when Trump wins?

What you are laughing at is real fraud and will result in a Trump win when taken to court.. Because stable geniuses don't give up.

[Hagoth]

How will you react when Trump wins?

That depends, will I have internet access from the gulag?

What you are laughing at is real fraud and will result in a Trump win when taken to court.

Unsubstantiated tweeting and unfounded rumor doesn't count as evidence in a court of law, even if a lot of people fall for it.
https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/list/

[SaidNobody]

How will you react when Trump wins?

That depends, will I have internet access from the gulag?

What you are laughing at is real fraud and will result in a Trump win when taken to court.

Unsubstantiated tweeting and unfounded rumor doesn't count as evidence in a court of law, even if a lot of people fall for it.
https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/list/

What you call rumor and unfounded has tens of thousands of witnesses and many thousand pages of affidavits. there are witnesses in witness protection over this. There are videos. There are bags of torn up ballots.

The government has always dealt with these rumors and evidence because they are trying to keep trust in the system. But this has always been a problem. I mean like going back to some of the first votes. So to deny it seems uneducated to me.

It seems like you are not emotionally prepared for Trump to continue to be president.

[Hagoth]

What you call rumor and unfounded has tens of thousands of witnesses and many thousand pages of affidavits. there are witnesses in witness protection over this. There are videos. There are bags of torn up ballots.

The government has always dealt with these rumors and evidence because they are trying to keep trust in the system. But this has always been a problem. I mean like going back to some of the first votes. So to deny it seems uneducated to me.

It seems like you are not emotionally prepared for Trump to continue to be president.

From what I have seen there are plenty of rumors about those things. I look forward to seeing how much merit they will have in court. Roger Pilger, Barr's voter fraud prosecutor stepped down rather than being forced to join the circus. Many of Trump's suits have already been thrown out due to lack of evidence. The video that's getting gleefully passed around comes from Russia.

You may recall that Trump made the same claims during the 2016 primaries but stopped talking about it when he realized he was winning. Same for the 2016 presidential election. The whole system was all a corrupt fraud... until it worked in his favor. So is it a fraud or not? Can it be switched on and off corrupt/not corrupt? It seems that the only metric of whether the system is corrupt is Trump's success.

Here's what the heart of the problem boils down to, in my opinion:



The Democratic Party looks like America. The Republican Party looks like the Antebellum south, and they will cling to that until their fingers turn black and fall off.

[deacon blues]

What will I do if Trump wins? I will keep on truckin'. I'm too old to join an army, but I will speak truth to authority, especially false authority. I will "do unto others as I would have them do unto me."- Jesus. I would try to be guided by these words of Kipling and Emerson.

If—
Rudyard Kipling - 1865-1936
If you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you;
If you can trust yourself when all men doubt you,
But make allowance for their doubting too;
If you can wait and not be tired by waiting,
Or, being lied about, don’t deal in lies,
Or, being hated, don’t give way to hating,
And yet don’t look too good, nor talk too wise;

If you can dream—and not make dreams your master;
If you can think—and not make thoughts your aim;
If you can meet with triumph and disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same;
If you can bear to hear the truth you’ve spoken
Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools,
Or watch the things you gave your life to broken,
And stoop and build ’em up with wornout tools;

If you can make one heap of all your winnings
And risk it on one turn of pitch-and-toss,
And lose, and start again at your beginnings
And never breathe a word about your loss;
If you can force your heart and nerve and sinew
To serve your turn long after they are gone,
And so hold on when there is nothing in you
Except the Will which says to them: “Hold on”;

If you can talk with crowds and keep your virtue,
Or walk with kings—nor lose the common touch;
If neither foes nor loving friends can hurt you;
If all men count with you, but none too much;
If you can fill the unforgiving minute
With sixty seconds’ worth of distance run—
Yours is the Earth and everything that’s in it,
And—which is more—you’ll be a Man, my son!

To be yourself in a world that is constantly trying to make you something else is the greatest accomplishment.-- Ralph Waldo Emerson
A man must consider what a rich realm he abdicates when he becomes a conformist.-- Ralph Waldo Emerson

Can anybody remember when the times were not hard and money not scarce?--Ralph Waldo Emerson
No matter how you seem to fatten on a crime, there can never be good for the bee that which is bad for the hive.-- Emerson

[deacon blues]

Your pie charts are very revealing, Hagoth. Thanks

[moksha]

Your pie charts are very revealing, Hagoth. Thanks

My favorite was the comparison between Key Lime and Boston Creme.


I wonder if 200 years from now, Trump worshipers will have incorporated into a thriving Faith Corporation with a huge Mar-a-Lago investment fund and a world-traveling board of 15 Directors, Overseers, and Election Predictors.