Trump & Church

[Dirty Bird]

I was impressed with Rusty Bowers until he said that if Trump were running against Biden again, he would vote for Trump. Even after Trump thoroughly bullied him and threatened him, Bowers will still vote for Trump again. Until Bowers said that, I thought he was very honorable. -- Wndr.

This did not surprise me. My parents do NOT like Trump. Not at all. But they will vote republican regardless. To them, the lesser of the two evils is Trump before a democrat. As evil as Trump is, and they know he's evil, they believe democrats are worse. I would have been more surprised if Rusty said he would not vote for Trump.

Growing up Mormon my entire life was based on doing good so I don't fall susceptible to the influence of Satan and his fallen Angels. I was obsessed with not sinning because I knew if I sinned I would fall under the spell of my evil spirit brother, Satan! The brethren successfully wired my brain in such a way that my fear of Satan was so great, it was at the forefront of just about every decision I made up to about when I turned 45.

Once I finally figured out that I was being totally manipulated into believing that I have an evil Spirit brother that is trying to influence me by using mental warfare to manipulate my actions, I was dumbfounded at how much power I relinquished to the brethren because they had me convinced that if I allow them to guide me through this life they could get me in to VIP heaven.

So when I read post like yours, I'm sometimes gobsmacked at how people who grew up believing in a Satan can't see that the democrat party has successfully turned Donald Trump into a Satan so they can use him as a tool to scare you into voting for them! Is there anyone on this board that understands how the democrats use Trump and MAGA to scare you into voting for them? Both the Mormon church and the Democrats have a Satan. Both say that their Satan have an army of fallen soldiers, Mormons have Lucifer and the fallen angels that we have to contend with mentally, and the Democrats have Trump as their Satan and his soldiers are all the MAGA supporters. Both the Mormons and Democrats say that your life is in danger if their evil Satan convinces you that he's the one you should follow.

The democrats have taken an orange man that is extremely cocky, but loves this country, doesn't have a criminal record, doesn't do drugs, doesn't smoke, doesn't drink, doesn't have any tattoos, has a relationship with all his children and ex wives, and has turned the man into a living breathing Satan because they know their voters rather vote their emotions, not with logic. It's a play right out of the communist handbook and we're all watching the circus act play out in live time. Grab some popcorn! This socialist transformation is going to be fun to watch.

[Hagoth]

... doesn't do drugs, doesn't smoke, doesn't drink, doesn't have any tattoos...

So you still think just like a Mormon. Seems to me you are doing exactly the same thing. Demonizing Democrats and "Leftists" and pretending not to see the crimes of your prophet.

ETA: Sincere question: do you believe Democrats harvest adrenochrome from the brains of babies?

[Mayan_Elephant]

I was impressed with Rusty Bowers until he said that if Trump were running against Biden again, he would vote for Trump. Even after Trump thoroughly bullied him and threatened him, Bowers will still vote for Trump again. Until Bowers said that, I thought he was very honorable. -- Wndr.

This did not surprise me. My parents do NOT like Trump. Not at all. But they will vote republican regardless. To them, the lesser of the two evils is Trump before a democrat. As evil as Trump is, and they know he's evil, they believe democrats are worse. I would have been more surprised if Rusty said he would not vote for Trump.

Growing up Mormon my entire life was based on doing good so I don't fall susceptible to the influence of Satan and his fallen Angels. I was obsessed with not sinning because I knew if I sinned I would fall under the spell of my evil spirit brother, Satan! The brethren successfully wired my brain in such a way that my fear of Satan was so great, it was at the forefront of just about every decision I made up to about when I turned 45.

Once I finally figured out that I was being totally manipulated into believing that I have an evil Spirit brother that is trying to influence me by using mental warfare to manipulate my actions, I was dumbfounded at how much power I relinquished to the brethren because they had me convinced that if I allow them to guide me through this life they could get me in to VIP heaven.

So when I read post like yours, I'm sometimes gobsmacked at how people who grew up believing in a Satan can't see that the democrat party has successfully turned Donald Trump into a Satan so they can use him as a tool to scare you into voting for them! Is there anyone on this board that understands how the democrats use Trump and MAGA to scare you into voting for them? Both the Mormon church and the Democrats have a Satan. Both say that their Satan have an army of fallen soldiers, Mormons have Lucifer and the fallen angels that we have to contend with mentally, and the Democrats have Trump as their Satan and his soldiers are all the MAGA supporters. Both the Mormons and Democrats say that your life is in danger if their evil Satan convinces you that he's the one you should follow.

The democrats have taken an orange man that is extremely cocky, but loves this country, doesn't have a criminal record, doesn't do drugs, doesn't smoke, doesn't drink, doesn't have any tattoos, has a relationship with all his children and ex wives, and has turned the man into a living breathing Satan because they know their voters rather vote their emotions, not with logic. It's a play right out of the communist handbook and we're all watching the circus act play out in live time. Grab some popcorn! This socialist transformation is going to be fun to watch.

Taking this analogy further, Obama showed up and was very much like a so-called prophet after 8 years of war and lies. The media, the exmormons, the democrats, and many groups embraced him as the "Lord's Anointed" and covenanted to not speak evil - even when evil shit was going on. This carried over to his successor prophets.

When Trump is viewed as the symptom of polarization and ideological group-think - and not the cause - this all makes a hell of a lot more sense.

"Hope is not blind optimism. It's not ignoring the enormity of the task ahead or the roadblocks that stand in our path. It's not sitting on the sidelines or shirking from a fight. Hope is that thing inside us that insists, despite all evidence to the contrary, that something better awaits us if we have the courage to reach for it, and to work for it, and to fight for it."

In the name of Jesus Christ, Amen.

[Hagoth]

Taking this analogy further, Obama showed up and was very much like a so-called prophet after 8 years of war and lies. The media, the exmormons, the democrats, and many groups embraced him as the "Lord's Anointed" and covenanted to not speak evil - even when evil shit was going on. This carried over to his successor prophets.

I couldn't possibly count the number of times I have heard people on the Religious Right say that Trump was called by God. While evil shit was going on. Our beloved senator Lee called him Captain Moroni. Everybody does exactly the same thing on one side as they see people doing on the other side. And it's all distorted and exaggerated. The decent people of America just want and deserve a decent president. There is no evil half of America that wants and evil president! Unfortunately no one has been put forward as a reasonable offer. Decent people are the first to be thrown off the island. Our representatives in Washington do not represent us; they just feed the fire. I for one am sick and tired of it. People on the Right need to stop pretending that Trump has not let them down. Same for the left. But, c'mon, Trump is just a victim of a witch hunt and bears no responsibility for the consequences of his actions? That's wearing kind of thin. (not aimed at you ME, just at the weird world we live in).

I am also sick and tired of people pretending that Donald Trump is an honest, law abiding hero who has never lied or cheated, and is just a victim of political prejudice. And ranting about Hunter's laptop as a diversion doesn't change any of that. Same goes for Biden and the rest of them. Kick them out or put them all in prison, and keep kicking them out and putting them in prison until somebody can pass the muster.

And while we're at it, let's excommunicate religious leaders who can't obey their own expectations for their followers. Let's stop treating political and religious leaders on "our side" as untouchable extensions of ourselves and excusing their sins and crimes because we need them to be what we imagine they should be, even though they just keep letting us down.

ETA some more lunatic ranting. Sorry.

[Mayan_Elephant]

Taking this analogy further, Obama showed up and was very much like a so-called prophet after 8 years of war and lies. The media, the exmormons, the democrats, and many groups embraced him as the "Lord's Anointed" and covenanted to not speak evil - even when evil shit was going on. This carried over to his successor prophets.

I couldn't possibly count the number of times I have heard people on the Religious Right say that Trump was called by God. While evil shit was going on. Our beloved senator Lee called him Captain Moroni. Everybody does exactly the same thing on one side as they see people doing on the other side. And it's all distorted and exaggerated. The good people of America just want and deserve a decent president. No one has been put forward as a reasonable offer. Honest, good people are the first to be thrown off the island. Our representatives in Washington do not represent us; they just feed the fire. I for one am sick and tired of it.

Amen!

I would add that most representatives in Washington represent themselves, their lobbying clients, and the uni-party.

I really liked voting for Tulsi. That felt awesome. But, she got torpedoed.

[Dirty Bird]

Taking this analogy further, Obama showed up and was very much like a so-called prophet after 8 years of war and lies. The media, the exmormons, the democrats, and many groups embraced him as the "Lord's Anointed" and covenanted to not speak evil - even when evil shit was going on. This carried over to his successor prophets.

I couldn't possibly count the number of times I have heard people on the Religious Right say that Trump was called by God. While evil shit was going on. Our beloved senator Lee called him Captain Moroni. Everybody does exactly the same thing on one side as they see people doing on the other side. And it's all distorted and exaggerated. The decent people of America just want and deserve a decent president. There is no evil half of America that wants and evil president! Unfortunately no one has been put forward as a reasonable offer. Decent people are the first to be thrown off the island. Our representatives in Washington do not represent us; they just feed the fire. I for one am sick and tired of it. People on the Right need to stop pretending that Trump has not let them down. Same for the left. But, c'mon, Trump is just a victim of a witch hunt and bears no responsibility for the consequences of his actions? That's wearing kind of thin. (not aimed at you ME, just at the weird world we live in).

I am also sick and tired of people pretending that Donald Trump is an honest, law abiding hero who has never lied or cheated, and is just a victim of political prejudice. And ranting about Hunter's laptop as a diversion doesn't change any of that. Same goes for Biden and the rest of them. Kick them out or put them all in prison, and keep kicking them out and putting them in prison until somebody can pass the muster.

And while we're at it, let's excommunicate religious leaders who can't obey their own expectations for their followers. Let's stop treating political and religious leaders on "our side" as untouchable extensions of ourselves and excusing their sins and crimes because we need them to be what we imagine they should be, even though they just keep letting us down.

ETA some more lunatic ranting. Sorry.

The socialist could have chosen the far right wackos or they could have chosen the far left wackos to start a revolution inside every institution within our government and religious institutions. They chose the far left, and I think it was because the left is more cunning and are more susceptible to blatant deceit. Believe me when I say that if they had picked the extreme right to start their evil plan, I would be talking shit about the Republicans with just as much fervor as I do about the Democrats, but that did not occur. The moderate Democrats are at a loss as to how to put an end to the socialists' dominance of the Democratic Party, which they enabled by welcoming them into the party in the first place. They have given the socialists permission to indoctrinate three generations' worth of our youth and young adults, and now we will pay the price in the not too distant future. There is absolutely nothing that can be done about it. There is only one choice, and that is to employ physical force, whether in the form of a civil war or something a little less bloody; however, this is not going to occur because it is all a game of numbers, and now that the democratic socialists have brainwashed three generations of our citizens, it is too late, and even the Republicans understand this.

The mentality of a socialist functions in exactly the same way as that of a good cult member, who is happy to live in squalor so long as their leader and doctrine are not called into question; in other words, the exact same way. They are willing to deal with homeless people living on the streets, interest rates being 15%, gas being $6 dollars a gallon, and even a President who says black people aren't actually black unless they vote democrat, none of that matters, because once someone is indoctrinated into socialism, they are willing to endure any amount of pain as long as the Satan of republicanism does not become their country's leader. If in the year 2024, interest rates reach 25%, Democrats voters won't bat an eye since they'd rather pay through the nose to avoid having orange Satan in the White House.

No matter what the Republicans say, there is no going back, and there is no way to erase the damage that we have enabled socialists to cause to our younger generation.

[Hagoth]

DB, please answer my question.

ETA: Sincere question: do you believe Democrats harvest adrenochrome from the brains of babies?

[Hagoth]

The socialist could have chosen the far right wackos or they could have chosen the far left wackos to start a revolution inside every institution within our government and religious institutions. They chose the far left, and I think it was because the left is more cunning and are more susceptible to blatant deceit. Believe me when I say that if they had picked the extreme right to start their evil plan, I would be talking shit about the Republicans with just as much fervor as I do about the Democrats, but that did not occur. The moderate Democrats are at a loss as to how to put an end to the socialists' dominance of the Democratic Party, which they enabled by welcoming them into the party in the first place. They have given the socialists permission to indoctrinate three generations' worth of our youth and young adults, and now we will pay the price in the not too distant future. There is absolutely nothing that can be done about it. There is only one choice, and that is to employ physical force, whether in the form of a civil war or something a little less bloody; however, this is not going to occur because it is all a game of numbers, and now that the democratic socialists have brainwashed three generations of our citizens, it is too late, and even the Republicans understand this.

The mentality of a socialist functions in exactly the same way as that of a good cult member, who is happy to live in squalor so long as their leader and doctrine are not called into question; in other words, the exact same way. They are willing to deal with homeless people living on the streets, interest rates being 15%, gas being $6 dollars a gallon, and even a President who says black people aren't actually black unless they vote democrat, none of that matters, because once someone is indoctrinated into socialism, they are willing to endure any amount of pain as long as the Satan of republicanism does not become their country's leader. If in the year 2024, interest rates reach 25%, Democrats voters won't bat an eye since they'd rather pay through the nose to avoid having orange Satan in the White House.

No matter what the Republicans say, there is no going back, and there is no way to erase the damage that we have enabled socialists to cause to our younger generation.

Yeah, you could pretty much invert that entire screed (e.g. replace references to right wing ideologists with references to left wing ideologists and vice versa), and it would work just as well for a left-leaning extremist.

I like what Mitt said, "some people go to Washington to make laws and others go to make noise." These days the noise is deafening.

[dogbite]

doesn't have a criminal record,

That is becoming less and less true. He's been convicted of sexual abuse, civilly. He's guilty of fraud in the NYC case, but again, civilly.

Our law differentiates between criminal and civil things but those two cases above look pretty criminal in behavior to me. Both of them rely on issues about the statute of limitations. The principles behind the statute of limitations are based in the flaws of human memory and human testimony over time.

Human testimony is of ever dwindling value in a world with deep paper and deeper digital records. Not to mention video, genetic and other forensic evidence.

And the actual criminal court cases for Trump loom larger every day.

[Mayan_Elephant]

Taking this analogy further, Obama showed up and was very much like a so-called prophet after 8 years of war and lies. The media, the exmormons, the democrats, and many groups embraced him as the "Lord's Anointed" and covenanted to not speak evil - even when evil shit was going on. This carried over to his successor prophets.

I couldn't possibly count the number of times I have heard people on the Religious Right say that Trump was called by God. While evil shit was going on. Our beloved senator Lee called him Captain Moroni. Everybody does exactly the same thing on one side as they see people doing on the other side. And it's all distorted and exaggerated. The decent people of America just want and deserve a decent president. There is no evil half of America that wants and evil president! Unfortunately no one has been put forward as a reasonable offer. Decent people are the first to be thrown off the island. Our representatives in Washington do not represent us; they just feed the fire. I for one am sick and tired of it. People on the Right need to stop pretending that Trump has not let them down. Same for the left. But, c'mon, Trump is just a victim of a witch hunt and bears no responsibility for the consequences of his actions? That's wearing kind of thin. (not aimed at you ME, just at the weird world we live in).

I am also sick and tired of people pretending that Donald Trump is an honest, law abiding hero who has never lied or cheated, and is just a victim of political prejudice. And ranting about Hunter's laptop as a diversion doesn't change any of that. Same goes for Biden and the rest of them. Kick them out or put them all in prison, and keep kicking them out and putting them in prison until somebody can pass the muster.

And while we're at it, let's excommunicate religious leaders who can't obey their own expectations for their followers. Let's stop treating political and religious leaders on "our side" as untouchable extensions of ourselves and excusing their sins and crimes because we need them to be what we imagine they should be, even though they just keep letting us down.

ETA some more lunatic ranting. Sorry.

You know I like this, right? I agree with you. If you do not know that, well we need to get to the saloon and work this out.

I want to address the section I bolded, which came with the ETA.

There are HUGE differences between being the victim of a witch hunt, there being a witch hunt, being an actual victim or pretend victim, and real and earned consequences. All have merit and all can be farcical too.

If we pause for a minute and look at the process without getting sidetracked by the drama, it can change perspectives. I have not seen Trump's declaration for a loan and neither have you. The only goddamn thing I am taking at face value is that the loan existed and that Trump paid it back. The end. Now, off we get on this trial shit. Nobody can be goddamn serious about this, really. Nobody. Not the judge, not the prosecutor, and not the media. The whole damn thing smacks of nonsense. Did Trump piss someone off and get in this pickle? Yep, so F him. Did I piss someone off related to this? No. I did not. So please forgive me for not taking this case seriously because it appeals to someone's need to break one off in Trump like he Gaddafi. It is a joke because the banks have a duty to do their own due diligence. If they issued a loan with favorable terms to get the business, and got paid, then so be it.

I notice that nobody really wants to discuss the process. Nobody really wants to address the fact that an investment bank took Theranos public - not a teenage dropout. Nobody wants to address the fiduciary negligence of the BOD of Theranos or the fact that Walgreens employees and shareholders were fine and whatever, they were just testing blood and lying, but meh.

When the DA of NYC and a judge from Willy Wonka decide to shit all over the justice system and the process, because Trump hurt their feelings, yeah - I can mock them and laugh out loud. Not because I like Trump, but because I may need the justice system someday and when these clowns leave their vandalism and used needles in the joint, I am bothered.

And by the way - Hunter's laptop was real. The contents were real. It was the process of censorship, lying, and generally jacking up an election and reporting process for the better good that is the issue. Nobody gives two pieces of damnit about Hunter, it was the election and media process that is the issue. I won't have any use for Hunter in my lifetime. If they ever stop mass mailing out of ballots, I may vote again.

[Mayan_Elephant]

doesn't have a criminal record,

That is becoming less and less true. He's been convicted of sexual abuse, civilly. He's guilty of fraud in the NYC case, but again, civilly.

Meh. Fraud for paying back a loan?

Fraud, even if it is real, is not a disqualifier at all. Hell, in 2009, the Obama administration co-signed $535 million loans to Solyndra. The company filed for bankruptcy on September 1, 2011. Obama was re-elected in 2012.

This is not about actual fraud, this is about actual feelings.

[Dirty Bird]

DB, please answer my question.

ETA: Sincere question: do you believe Democrats harvest adrenochrome from the brains of babies?

Only on the 6 of the month between 6 am and 6 pm. At least that's what my brother Satan told me.

[dogbite]

Meh. Fraud for paying back a loan?

That is not the charge and you should know that. If you want to misrepresent facts that's your choice. It remains that Trump has been found guilty of fraud.

You also neglected to talk about his conviction for sexual abuse.

And you tried a fallacious distraction on Obama which is not the topic. If you want to start a topic about Obama go ahead I'm not going to defend him.

[Mayan_Elephant]

Meh. Fraud for paying back a loan?

That is not the charge and you should know that. If you want to misrepresent facts that's your choice. It remains that Trump has been found guilty of fraud.

You also neglected to talk about his conviction for sexual abuse.

And you tried a fallacious distraction on Obama which is not the topic. If you want to start a topic about Obama go ahead I'm not going to defend him.

You tell me exactly what the fraud was. Tell me. Because if the loan was paid in full, then how was there a fraud? Show me. I was exactly on topic by referencing Obama. Lending and applying for loans based on fraudulent information clearly is not a disqualifier, based on precedent. The question was whether someone who committed fraud can serve. The answer, based on the fraud at that solar company, shows that committing fraud is fine for one's resume for the highest office.

Tell me about a "conviction" in civil court. It is not neglect to ignore such a comment. It is polite to ignore it. But since you brought it up again, explain this so-called conviction.

Remember, please, my feelings are not hurt if Trump's feelings are hurt, and neither are my feelings hurt if your feelings are hurt because of Trump's feelings. I don't care. That is not dismissive, just sayin where the ball lies. I care more about how things happen that what happens. And a yammer on about a civil "conviction" in a court of clowns is just funny to me, but not as interesting as people yammering about a loan that was paid in full.

[dogbite]

You can read the details
https://www.msnbc.com/deadline-white-ho ... rcna117499

The core is that false or misleading financial statements violates New York Law. Summary judgement for the plaintiff. Trump is guilty.

As to the sex abuse, a jury found Trump guilty under New York law. Is that hard to understand?

Obama has not been found guilty by jury or summary judgement. Therefore as far as the law is concerned he's not guilty.

[Mayan_Elephant]

You can read the details
https://www.msnbc.com/deadline-white-ho ... rcna117499

The core is that false or misleading financial statements violates New York Law. Summary judgement for the plaintiff. Trump is guilty.

As to the sex abuse, a jury found Trump guilty under New York law. Is that hard to understand?

Obama has not been found guilty by jury or summary judgement. Therefore as far as the law is concerned he's not guilty.

Was that a criminal trial?

Sure, false or misleading financials are a problem. Sure. The solar company went bankrupt, it was an actual scam that hurt people, including me. Like a give a shit if Trump borrowed money and paid it back. The solar scam hurt you too, but ya know, team player maybe?

[dogbite]

And yet the investigations into solindra found no wrongdoing.

I've already answered was it a criminal trial.

Why is the distinction important here? Is it less fraud? Is it less sexual abuse?

Would you let a civilly convicted child abuser babysit your kids?

[Mayan_Elephant]

And yet the investigations into solindra found no wrongdoing.

I've already answered was it a criminal trial.

Why is the distinction important here? Is it less fraud? Is it less sexual abuse?

Would you let a civilly convicted child abuser babysit your kids?

Thanks. A clear scam was not a “fraud” but the taxpayer got robbed. A bank made a loan, got paid in full, and this is a fraud. Mmmkay.

Imagine millions of eyes rolling.

There are no convictions in civil trials. And in the trump case, no damages.

No. And I doubt you hold the Bidens to the same standard.

[Hagoth]

DB, please answer my question.

ETA: Sincere question: do you believe Democrats harvest adrenochrome from the brains of babies?

Only on the 6 of the month between 6 am and 6 pm. At least that's what my brother Satan told me.

So yes or no?

[dogbite]

No. And I doubt you hold the Bidens to the same standard.

Have to see the evidence won't we.