Election day

Chat about a topic supported by books, TED Talks, podcasts, personal experience, philosophies of mankind mingled with humor (shout out to IOT), and maybe we’ll even do a google hangout or conference call once a month.
Post Reply
User avatar
alas
Posts: 2088
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2016 2:10 pm

Election day

Post by alas » Tue Nov 08, 2022 10:08 am

Is anyone as discouraged about the election and the state of the country as I am? I vote in Idaho, where voting for a sensible candidate is really swimming up stream….rather up waterfall. There are “Trump 24” flags and “F* Biden”flags all over. There are serious threats to throw out all mail in votes, and being snowbirds, that is how we have to vote. They want to make all abortions illegal, even those to save the mother’s life because “that baby has as much right to live as the mother” and they are too stupid that if the pregnancy kills the mother 99% of the time, that unborn baby dies too. The distrust of science is huge, if the science is the least bit of an inconvenience, yet they swear that all abortions are just for the mother’s convenience. Their convenience is all important, but the woman’s life is a big nothing, well, because that isn’t them.

It is funny but on that thread about belief being stupid, I keep thinking about my neighbors and their politics. They are royally stupid about politics. Sweet people, but royally stupid about politics.

It is kind of funny, but I read articles in the news about what the stupids are up to, so I read Faux News and articles about Margery Taylor Green and stupid brain damaged football players who beat their wives, pay for abortions, and think Republicans are stupid enough to vote for them, and the antics of the doctor of Oz, even De Sanctis. So, my algorithm news feed gives me all the predictions that the Dems are gonna get smeared. I started to wonder if my keeping up with the enemy has convinced my news station algorithm that I believe and want more of that unadulterated crap. By keeping tabs on the enemy, the algorithm may be adding to my discouragement on how bad it really is.

My sister in law just bought a house in Mexico in an all American community and are planning to live among the expats. I suggested to my husband that living there might be better because at least politicians are honest enough to be embarrassed about million dollar bri…ummm, campaign contributions, because they recognize that a bribe is a bribe.

User avatar
Not Buying It
Posts: 1297
Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2016 12:29 pm

Re: Election day

Post by Not Buying It » Tue Nov 08, 2022 11:22 am

alas wrote:
Tue Nov 08, 2022 10:08 am
Is anyone as discouraged about the election and the state of the country as I am? I vote in Idaho, where voting for a sensible candidate is really swimming up stream….rather up waterfall. There are “Trump 24” flags and “F* Biden”flags all over. There are serious threats to throw out all mail in votes, and being snowbirds, that is how we have to vote.
I share your discouragement this morning. It's not that liberals/Democrats are never hypocritical or never fail to enforce expectations about ethics with their politicians (Bill Clinton was a sexual predator, and should never have been given a pass for that). There are dishonest politicians on both sides, and there always have been. But the cult of Trump is different, and everyone knows it is different. Even at his most popular no one ever flew a Ronald Reagan flag. At his most outrageous, Reagan never suggested his opponents were evil and should be locked up. And he sure as hell never sent a mob to attack the Capitol, or kept classified documents when he left office, etc. and etc.

The fact that both sides have bad actors does not mean both sides are equally dangerous or damaging. "But", say those on the right, "look at the way the Justice Department has gone after Trump." Yeah - because he broke laws. You shouldn't rev up a crowd to attack the Capitol, sit on your butt and do nothing to stop them while they sack the place for three hours, and expect no consequences. You shouldn't think you can take classified documents with you when you are voted out of office and expect no consequences. If a liberal or Democrat did these things, they should prosecuted as well.

What does the Cult of Trump have to do with the Church? Everything. The reason so many members of the Church are Trump cultists is because they have been raised on white supremacy, religious supremacy, and an exaggerated sensitivity to religious persecution. What does Trump represent to many of his cult followers? Preservation of white supremacy, preservation of Christian supremacy, and defense of "religious freedom". "Make America Great Again" is a not-so-subtle code form of "Make America White Christian Again". Many on the right don't even bother hiding that sentiment anymore. Mormons were primed to be Trump followers in many of the same ways evangelical Christians were primed to be Trump followers.

If I have offended any Trump supporters - good. Your dude's a traitor, and you need to re-think your life choices.
Last edited by Not Buying It on Tue Nov 08, 2022 11:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
"The truth is elegantly simple. The lie needs complex apologia. 4 simple words: Joe made it up. It answers everything with the perfect simplicity of Occam's Razor. Every convoluted excuse withers." - Some guy on Reddit called disposazelph

User avatar
Hagoth
Posts: 6419
Joined: Fri Oct 14, 2016 1:13 pm

Re: Election day

Post by Hagoth » Tue Nov 08, 2022 11:26 am

Alas, I hope you don't mind that I moved this topic to The Coffee Shop. Probably too political for the Support forum.
alas wrote:
Tue Nov 08, 2022 10:08 am
Is anyone as discouraged about the election and the state of the country as I am?
It's pretty disturbing. I'm shocked at how easily the people who talk so much about the constitution and Christianity are so eager to abandon the basic concepts of both. This is exactly the kind of stupidity that applies to the other thread you mentioned.
alas wrote:
Tue Nov 08, 2022 10:08 am
...brain damaged football players who beat their wives, pay for abortions, and think Republicans are stupid enough to vote for them,
What do you mean, think? They are voting for him. Imagine what a magnificent contribution he will be to congress if he wins. With enough gerrymandering and election denial maybe we can manage to get an entire government made up of Herschel Walkers and Marjorie Taylor Greens.
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain

Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."

hmb
Posts: 402
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2017 6:43 am

Re: Election day

Post by hmb » Wed Nov 09, 2022 6:57 am

Discouraged yes, and pleased by the amount of people that actually voted. My fingers are crossed so hard for Boebert and Walker to lose. I can't believe that Walker is so close. I really thought he would lose. I did think that Boebert would take it, so I'm happy there's still a chance for her to be ousted. I am looking forward to the election dust settling and what the DOJ has in store for the pants on fire cheese puff.

User avatar
moksha
Posts: 4540
Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2016 4:22 am

Re: Election day

Post by moksha » Wed Nov 09, 2022 7:17 am

Some legislators are safe due to the ecology of their district. There is way too much lead in the water of Marjorie Taylor Greene's district, ensuring her reelection. Utah Mormons upon entering the voting booth are possessed by the fire and brimstone spirit of Ezra Taft Benson, ensuring they always vote R.
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

User avatar
Linked
Posts: 1433
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2016 4:04 pm

Re: Election day

Post by Linked » Wed Nov 09, 2022 12:36 pm

Definitely discouraged. I was visiting with my elderly parents yesterday. My dad is an enthusiastic Trump, and Lee, supporter and my mom holds her nose and votes for Trump and his ilk even though she doesn't like Trump's style. To them the libs and lib-adjacent are the ones causing all the issues, not them. They even invoked the second coming saying that there is nothing they can do to avoid the terrible things to come anyway. When I pushed them on that as a defeatist view they pointed out that they weren't going to hurt anyone, but they can't stop the evil people in the world from doing what they will do. Ugh.
alas wrote:
Tue Nov 08, 2022 10:08 am
It is kind of funny, but I read articles in the news about what the stupids are up to, so I read Faux News and articles about Margery Taylor Green and stupid brain damaged football players who beat their wives, pay for abortions, and think Republicans are stupid enough to vote for them, and the antics of the doctor of Oz, even De Sanctis. So, my algorithm news feed gives me all the predictions that the Dems are gonna get smeared. I started to wonder if my keeping up with the enemy has convinced my news station algorithm that I believe and want more of that unadulterated crap. By keeping tabs on the enemy, the algorithm may be adding to my discouragement on how bad it really is.
I really like FiveThirtyEight. It's a data-driven website that does a good job sticking to what the numbers tell them. I've heard people on both sides of the aisle say they keep track of the FiveThirtyEight predictions. (Everyone has bias, but they are clearly trying not to forecast based on it). It was interesting to watch the numbers start with a red wave, then move in favor of the dems after the Obergefell decision, then slowly go back red as people moved on from that moment. They had the House as 85% likely to go red and the Senate close to 50/50. The results are looking slightly bluer than predicted, though the House will still probably go red.
"I would write about life. Every person would be exactly as important as any other. All facts would also be given equal weightiness. Nothing would be left out. Let others bring order to chaos. I would bring chaos to order" - Kurt Vonnegut

Cnsl1
Posts: 396
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2018 1:27 pm

Re: Election day

Post by Cnsl1 » Thu Nov 10, 2022 7:00 am

Did everyone forget that Herschel Walker claims or claimed to have Dissociative Identity Disorder? I don't want to stigmatize the mentally ill, but there are some disorders that maybe shouldn't be elected to high level offices.

Personally, I'm not convinced he has DID but that his problems might be better described by head injuries. Still... senator?

User avatar
stealthbishop
Posts: 392
Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2018 9:25 am

Re: Election day

Post by stealthbishop » Mon Nov 14, 2022 1:18 pm

I get really discouraged about the state of our country but there are some bright spots. Overall, the red wave failed and that actually is historic in a midterm where the President's party usually does quite badly. Certainly in deep red states like Idaho and Utah it is going to be much more difficult and in those specific places I don't see much hope. However, overall this midterm was a bad day for election deniers and people who want to outlaw abortion. Those issues seemed to stop the red wave momentum. And that gives me a little bit of hope.
"Take second best
Put me to the test
Things on your chest
You need to confess"

-Depeche Mode

User avatar
RubinHighlander
Posts: 1774
Joined: Tue Nov 08, 2016 7:20 am
Location: Behind the Zion Curtain

Re: Election day

Post by RubinHighlander » Mon Nov 14, 2022 3:37 pm

It was particularly depressing this round for me for some reason. If my family and kids were not here in UT, we'd definitely move out. I think it was all the crap on Mike Lee's BS with Trump and election distrust, all the mud slinging he did at his opponent and the fact that he still stayed in place with no issues. I voted, but it sucks when you know it does not make a difference. The are more modern and better alternatives to our current election system, but the one we have keeps the clowns in power and the rest of us pretty powerless; on it goes. It also sucks having no party that represents my views.

This election and veteran's day triggered my PTSD from being a cold war kid. I went back and watched a documentary on the bombs we dropped on Japan and all the nukes there are in this world. Then I thought of the American blood and trillions of our tax dollars, just dumped and waisted in the middle east by our military and contractors. I had retired before the deployment to Iraq came to my unit a few months later, but it impacted two of my brothers and it was a stressful year. All those lives that were lost and all that money just waisted, as we sit here watching our home infrastructure get weaker every day. Then we see non-profit orgs like TSCC suck billions of dollars out of the economy and put very little back in. Meanwhile the shrinking middle class continues to break under the burden of paying the feds and states (and for TBMs, their membership dues to TSCC on top of their taxes).

In spite of their recent efforts in their war on women and minorities, I really hope the religious right extremists are actually loosing power. Hopefully it won't last. Otherwise we seem to be headed to a Handmaid's Tale scenario. There are days when I tempt the cosmo and tell it to bring on the solar flare, the asteroid or just have the monkeys push all the red buttons and bring on the next mass extinction. In spite of the crazy state of ape sh!t we are in, it's still a relatively decent time of peace and prosperity in history for most sapiens; I am grateful overall for my circumstances.
“Sir,' I said to the universe, 'I exist.' 'That,' said the universe, 'creates no sense of obligation in me whatsoever.”
--Douglas Adams

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzmYP3PbfXE

User avatar
Linked
Posts: 1433
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2016 4:04 pm

Re: Election day

Post by Linked » Mon Nov 14, 2022 5:18 pm

stealthbishop wrote:
Mon Nov 14, 2022 1:18 pm
I get really discouraged about the state of our country but there are some bright spots. Overall, the red wave failed and that actually is historic in a midterm where the President's party usually does quite badly. Certainly in deep red states like Idaho and Utah it is going to be much more difficult and in those specific places I don't see much hope. However, overall this midterm was a bad day for election deniers and people who want to outlaw abortion. Those issues seemed to stop the red wave momentum. And that gives me a little bit of hope.
Considering the state of inflation it's really amazing that there wasn't a red wave.

I saw the vote split for the House vote in Utah and it was depressing to see how perfectly gerrymandered my state is. Gotta give the legislature's map drawing team credit. Both sides gerrymander, but this is my state...

Image
"I would write about life. Every person would be exactly as important as any other. All facts would also be given equal weightiness. Nothing would be left out. Let others bring order to chaos. I would bring chaos to order" - Kurt Vonnegut

User avatar
deacon blues
Posts: 1725
Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2016 7:37 am

Re: Election day

Post by deacon blues » Mon Nov 14, 2022 7:19 pm

I agree with Utah Gerrymandering being problematic. If you want to see an election being stolen, consider how Utah's republican senators and representatives split the Salt Lake County vote. :(
God is Love. God is Truth. The greatest problem with organized religion is that the organization becomes god, rather than a means of serving God.

Cnsl1
Posts: 396
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2018 1:27 pm

Re: Election day

Post by Cnsl1 » Mon Nov 14, 2022 11:05 pm

I was happy to see that my swing state of AZ stayed in the blue for most of the major races.

I gotta say, I'm an Independent, but as soon as I see that a candidate is "Trump endorsed" I stop listening to anything else they say and vote against them. It's generally a terrible thing to dismiss a candidate to so readily, and typically I will look at each candidate on their own merits and vote for the one whom I think is best for the time. But Trump has polarized the country even more than it already was, and it is very irksome that idiots persist with the Trump rhetoric, ESPECIALLY when maybe they're not really suckered in by his false claims and BS but they just want his people. Because.. just like I stop listening to anything after "Trump endorsed", that's all a lot of people need and they don't bother to get any deeper into investigating who is the best candidate.

Politicians need to appeal to the majority.. the roughly 68% of folks a standard deviation on either side of the intellectual mean. The smart people are not going to be sheep, and the stupid people are going to vote like their friends, if they vote at all. so get the most of the middle and you're gonna win.

Now, I realize IQ doesn't necessarily correlate positively with common sense, or political savvy, and that personality and heredity are also big factors in how people vote, but appealing to average will still get you a long ways.

I'm old enough to remember that my very conservative maternal grandparents were strictly Democrat and would vote the party line almost exclusively until one day my mom convinced her mother that Ronald Regan indeed represented her views and beliefs much more than Walter Mondale. Years ago, Baptists and Democrats went together like biscuits and gravy, but somewhere along the line things got flipped around.

Then there was that time we elected that chauvinistic xenophobic racist narcissistic piece of orange dung who single handily destroyed the Republican party to make it his own.

User avatar
cwald
Posts: 29
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2016 9:29 pm

Re: Election day

Post by cwald » Mon Nov 21, 2022 10:57 pm

Election day (month) has always made me grateful I moved to Oregon and out of the Morcor. This year was no exception.

And I love that "mail in voting." Oregon does it right. There really is no "election day" in Oregon. You get your ballot two two weeks before the deadline, watch the game and sit by the wood stove and study the voters pamphlet, fill out the ballot, and drop it in the mail. Hell, "no postage necessary." :)
"Jesus gave us the gospel, but Satan invented church. It takes serious evil to formalize faith into something tedious and then pile guilt on anyone who doesn’t participate enthusiastically." - Robert Kirby

User avatar
Linked
Posts: 1433
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2016 4:04 pm

Re: Election day

Post by Linked » Tue Nov 22, 2022 11:34 am

I really liked this graphic from a FiveThirtyEight article. It shows how each House district voted relative to the FiveThirtyEight model expectations. Florida was redder than expected, especially southern Florida. New York City too. Maryland, Pennsylvania, Michigan, Georgia, Colorado, and Arizona were all bluer than expected.

Image
"I would write about life. Every person would be exactly as important as any other. All facts would also be given equal weightiness. Nothing would be left out. Let others bring order to chaos. I would bring chaos to order" - Kurt Vonnegut

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest