NOM Testimony meeting

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ulmite
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NOM Testimony meeting

Post by ulmite » Sat Dec 31, 2016 9:03 pm

I thought it would be uplifting to share our new/developing 'testimonies' for lack of a better term. This special meeting is whenever you feel like it, not necessarily Sunday at 9 am after a night of celebration, eating and drinking are acceptable, you can say whatever's on your mind without spooking our ward members.

I'd like to start off by sharing my thoughts. Though I have seriously considered atheism as a landing place, and consider it to be a logically and scientifically sound position, I choose to have faith in God, bolstered by a few very powerful spiritual experiences in my own life. I trust God to continue to inspire the decisions I make about my life's course as I believe he has already done a few times. I suppose the best way to put this is that I 'choose to know' that God lives, that he loves me strongly, and so it makes sense that it is the same for everyone. I choose to know that I may return to his presence. Amen.

I'd like to, at some point in the future, make a thread here where we can share much longer and detailed accounts of our own spirituality. I've seen many posts here ending with "I'd like to post a more complete version sometime" and this would maybe break the ice, if I ever get around to doing it. :?
Also, something important for me is to sort out what to make of personal revelation. I know that we tend to keep strong experiences very private, though we all want to hear other people telling them! I would envision creating an entirely anonymous space for sharing those special experiences if others feel that it would also be useful to them, or would contribute.
Thanks for reading a rather long post-testimony (get the pun?)

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No Tof
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Re: NOM Testimony meeting

Post by No Tof » Sun Jan 01, 2017 11:22 am

I am so happy to say that most of my superstitious thinking is ebbing away from me. I no longer expect an answer to prayer, no longer expect magical things to happen when someone puts hands on my head, (like I'd let that happen.....) and no longer look forward to winning the super lotto when I die.

Sometimes I long for those blissful, magical times when I did but have found greater happiness in helping others in stead of going to some building each seventh day, and look at others who do believe in magical thinking with genuine curiosity and try to be supportive in their journey. I tell my SP I believe in god but don't tell him he wouldn't recognize her, and can visit with my atheist friends on equal ground.

My testimony is just that we are here, can choose to be happy with our own choices in life and should do so.

I know I don't know anything with certainty and am ok with it all.
Out beyond ideas of wrongdoing and right doing, there is a field. I'll meet you there.
Rumi

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Newme
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Re: NOM Testimony meeting

Post by Newme » Sat Mar 11, 2017 9:07 am

ulmite wrote:
Sat Dec 31, 2016 9:03 pm
I'd like to start off by sharing my thoughts. Though I have seriously considered atheism as a landing place, and consider it to be a logically and scientifically sound position, I choose to have faith in God, bolstered by a few very powerful spiritual experiences in my own life. I trust God to continue to inspire the decisions I make about my life's course as I believe he has already done a few times. I suppose the best way to put this is that I 'choose to know' that God lives, that he loves me strongly, and so it makes sense that it is the same for everyone. I choose to know that I may return to his presence. Amen.
Good idea!
Where to start?
Well, you mentioned Atheism which I considered for a bit - it seemed the only logical conclusion once I realized that everything's illusion (based on subjective perspective). But then I realized that Atheism is illogical - not without countless books on Atheism, and it doesn't state which of all of the interpretations of many definitions of God that it denies - but just denies with the blind faith that is so hated in Theism. And some definitions of God like "God is love" or "God is truth" it would be ridiculous to deny.

Anyway, like you, I still believe in God - but how I define or consider God is changing daily. Not that God changes, but my perspective changes and my personal experience of God "within" is based on my unique conscious... I AM THAT I AM. I also believe that consciousness continues after death and may have actually created the brain (like the Quantum mind theory) unlike the reverse as is commonly believed. Consciousness is energy and energy doesn't zap out of existence, but changes form. Another reason to not get too caught up on appearances and our bodies - though that's all we know. And it is imperative to take care of our bodies (temples of the spirit). Metaphysics is real - as evidenced by the placebo effect. I'm learning to not only acknowledge how it affects me, but also to consciously guide it's influence.

I believe that there is no dividing line between psychology (study of the soul) and spirituality - they are one and the same - and ignoring one or the other is hurting oneself, or denying a significant part of oneself. It's not always fun to study one's own soul - one's own thought patterns, feelings and behaviors. It can be very painful to realize our imperfections. But the only way we can reach our full potential is to accept ourselves while striving to be better - and that's also the only way we can genuinely love others - warts and all.

There's so much more, but I think for it to all get out, would require spending a week together hiking somewhere natural or something where thoughts can more easily flow.

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LSOF
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Re: NOM Testimony meeting

Post by LSOF » Sat Mar 11, 2017 8:05 pm

NON CREDO

I do not believe in gods, demons, spirits, chakras, magic, psychics, necromancers, or any other such things. These are fabrications of the ignorant, or those that wish to exploit the ignorant. Churches were invented to perpetuate belief in such things and thereby "monopolize power and profit".

I reject faith as an epistemology, because it leads to contradictory conclusions. Anyone that appeals to faith is unworthy of credibility.

I worship nothing, for anyone that is worthy of worship will not want to be worshipped, and anyone that wants to be worshipped is not worthy of worship.

Since I do not believe in gods, and sin is anything God disapproves of, I reject the notion of sin.

Since I do not believe in gods, demons, spirits, or any other such things, I reject prayer as no more effectual than talking to myself.

CREDO

I believe that morality can be found independent of gods, by determining what minimizes suffering.

I believe that religions and churches are parasites, and that when they die out, the world will be a much better place.

I believe that the most truth can be found by always appealing to facts and evidence.

I believe that there are evil deeds, but these are not "sin", because I do not believe that there are gods to displease.

EDIT: Proofreading
Last edited by LSOF on Wed Jun 21, 2017 5:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"I appreciate your flesh needs to martyr me." Parture

"There is no contradiction between faith and science --- true science." Dr Zaius

Pastor, Lunar Society of Friends; CEO, Faithful Origins and Ontology League

Galileo
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Re: NOM Testimony meeting

Post by Galileo » Wed Jun 21, 2017 11:57 am

LSOF wrote:
Sat Mar 11, 2017 8:05 pm
NON CREDO

I do not believe in gods, demons, spirits, chakras, magic, psychics, necromancers, or any other such things. These are fabrications of the ignorant, or those that wish to exploit the ignorant. Churches were invented to perpetuate belief in such things and thereby "monopolize power and profit".

I reject faith as an epistemology, because it leads to contradictory conclusions. Anyone that appeals to faith is unworthy of credibility.

I worship nothing, for anyone that is worthy of worship will not want to be worshipped, and anyone that wants to be worshipped is not worthy of worship.

Since I do not believe in gods, and sin is anything God disapproves of, I reject the notion of sin.

Since I do not believe in gods, demons, spirits, or any other such things, I reject prayer as no more effectual than talking to myself.

CREDO

I believe that morality can be found independent of gods, by determining what minimizes suffering.

I believe that religions and churches are parasites, and that when they die out, the world will be a much better place.

I believe that the most truth can be found by always appealing to facts and evidence.

I believe that there are evil deeds, but these are not "sin", because I do not believe that there are gods to disprove.
Wow LSOF... can I just "copy and paste" your testimony and count it as my own?

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LSOF
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Re: NOM Testimony meeting

Post by LSOF » Wed Jun 21, 2017 5:31 pm

Galileo wrote:
Wed Jun 21, 2017 11:57 am
Wow LSOF... can I just "copy and paste" your testimony and count it as my own?
Yes! Absolutely! Just note the proofread I made in my original post. (I changed the last "disprove" to "displease".)

I wrote it in my BYU Devotional notebook while enduring Sunday School at the University of the Bearded Polygamist.
"I appreciate your flesh needs to martyr me." Parture

"There is no contradiction between faith and science --- true science." Dr Zaius

Pastor, Lunar Society of Friends; CEO, Faithful Origins and Ontology League

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Corsair
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Re: NOM Testimony meeting

Post by Corsair » Thu Jun 22, 2017 11:48 am

LSOF wrote:
Sat Mar 11, 2017 8:05 pm
NON CREDO

I do not believe in gods, demons, spirits, chakras, magic, psychics, necromancers, or any other such things. These are fabrications of the ignorant, or those that wish to exploit the ignorant. Churches were invented to perpetuate belief in such things and thereby "monopolize power and profit".
That's a great testimony. I recommend having someone film you if you ever present this testimony in an F&T meeting. You might get the whole "turn off the microphone" experience that Savannah got.

Korihor
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Re: NOM Testimony meeting

Post by Korihor » Fri Jul 21, 2017 11:49 pm

I believe in the unconquerable human spirit. The fire within each of us to experience life. To love, hate, laugh, cry, inspire and destroy.

My knee bends for no god, no king, no magistrate, no earthly nor celestial supposed authority. For as god is no respecter of persons, I am no respecter of deities.
My knee will bend for my lover. My head will lower to embrace my children. My arms will raise above my head to lift another. My hand will extend in friendship to all.
Reading can severely damage your ignorance.

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SeeNoEvil
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Re: NOM Testimony meeting

Post by SeeNoEvil » Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:17 pm

I have been uplifted by all your testimonies. LSOF ,Korihor, my journey out of the cult has led me to where you seem to be today. This has been an interesting ride .... journey out of the Mormon church. I did not go looking for it, the journey found me. I will not sugar coat it. It was a rough one and for me necessary in breaking the bond of abuse and control that have plagued me my entire life. Now I am finally free and living as authentic as possible. Here is a small bit of what I have learned:

I have long since departed from my imaginary friend on high and look solely to the wisdom within myself to guide and direct me.
I will never again allow myself to be duped into believing that I must bow to a higher power in order to be of worth.
I will no longer be blinded into thinking there is only one way to live my life.
I will no longer allow any person, power, religion or mythical being define the value of my life.
I will no longer make excuses for the actions of others or submit to be controlled.
I believe in a non religious sense that we are a miracle of life itself, that against all odds we have survived.
I believe that all in the universe is connected and see the reverence for life this knowledge invokes.
I believe I choose and create my own purpose.
I do not believe I am part of a plan.
There is endless knowledge yet to be discovered by me so I will always be searching, learning and growing.
I will never arrive at a point where I feel I have all the answers and cease to learn.
"Every event that has taken place in this universe has led you to this moment.
... The real question is, what will you do with this moment?" - Unknown

"Never arrive @ a point where you know everything - Korihor57

Rebel
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Re: NOM Testimony meeting

Post by Rebel » Tue Jan 23, 2018 5:39 am

Just wanted to chime in on this one as it has been a long time since I have posted. I believe in Jesus Christ as our savior and redeemed , Believe in the bible and bom as divinely inspired. All you need to make it to heaven is belief in Christ try to do good in this life and be kind to others ! That's it .

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deacon blues
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Re: NOM Testimony meeting

Post by deacon blues » Wed Mar 14, 2018 8:47 am

I've enjoy the variety of testimonies expressed here. I choose believe in a God of Truth and Love. I admit to knowing little more about this God, but I believe Jesus Christ had a special connection with this God that I think is significant, although I approach this belief with a dose of healthy skepticism. I have empathy for those who doubt. Although I hope we all have a limited access to God, I am skeptical of those who claim special, super-natural, or exceptional power or knowledge, although such claims sometimes pique my curiosity; hence my fascination with Joseph Smith, Emmanuel Swedenborg, Muhammad, and religion and philosophy in general. I tend to trust science (empirical evidence) over feelings, emotion, and authority. I look for opportunities to to discuss these things, which explains my reduced participation in the L.D.S. Church meetings, although I am fascinated by the Mormon culture.I feel a special affinity for those who are from the Mormon culture, but who don't quite fit in. I continue to enjoy friendships with L.D.S. and non-L.D.S. people in this culture I have been born and raised in. I appreciate a wife and family, who have patience with my peculiarities. I feel gratitude to Providence for the opportunity to live, and the wonderful experiences it has afforded me. I think NOM is inspired. :D
God is Love. God is Truth

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wtfluff
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Re: NOM Testimony meeting

Post by wtfluff » Wed Mar 14, 2018 9:53 am

Here we go:


I believe in gravity.

I believe in logic and reason, along with skepticism. (Question everything.)

I believe in science, and the scientific method.

I believe in Occam's Razor.

I believe that feelings and emotions are truly awful tools for gaining knowledge of anything that could be considered "truth".

I believe in love.


If you want to see "God", simply look in the mirror.



And I also echo a very large DITTO to everything LSOF posted further up-thread.
LSOF wrote:
Sat Mar 11, 2017 8:05 pm
(Just a tag for LSOF, and a link to his "testimony")
Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus

Keep the company of those who seek the truth - run from those who have found it -Václav Havel

Who taught you how to hate?

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RubinHighlander
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Re: NOM Testimony meeting

Post by RubinHighlander » Wed Mar 14, 2018 9:56 am

LSOF wrote:
Sat Mar 11, 2017 8:05 pm
NON CREDO
+1 for this

I believe in Pi
Image

Happy Pi day by the way and I raise a glass of coffee, beer and wine to Mr. Hawking! I won't say "rest in peace" because nether he nor I believe in that trite religious phrase anymore. Just send my atoms back to the universe asap via cremation. The only crappy part of Pi day is its reminder that the USA insists on putting month before day and will likely never adopt the metric system.

I'm not 100% atheist, but pretty close, so I'll have to fall into agnostic I guess. I just don't know for sure if there is or isn't some type of god/power out there, but I'll lean on not. I'm happy being on a path discovery with some but not all answers. I think it could be possible we are in a simulation, that some intelligent power could have kicked off the big bang, but I just don't know and I don't worry about it anymore. My view of the world PostMo is much more happy, appreciated, enjoyed and not taken for granted!

I see the patterns of religions, governments and other institutions across the globe that seek to control via fear, guilt and other like methods and that pisses me off sometimes. I sometimes worry that the human race won't make it because we have nukes, bad planetary resource management and the idiotic behaviors I observe on social media (and on the daily commute in traffic).

My metaphysical and emotional (formerly known as spiritual) experiences have actually increased, as I've increased my effort to get out into nature and feel much more connected to the Earth and the Universe. Sometimes this is enhanced with the use of natural herbs. I try to experience 2 or more Zen moments per week to balance out being plugged into the capitalistic money matrix.

I thank the universe for a pretty Fing amazing life, even though I know it's probably not listening! I'd like to thank all the NOMites here for sharing your thoughts, inspiration and wisdom.

Instead of Amen I'll use the phrase Ahhh Yeah!
“Sir,' I said to the universe, 'I exist.' 'That,' said the universe, 'creates no sense of obligation in me whatsoever.”
--Douglas Adams

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzmYP3PbfXE

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