Remembering what our faith meant

Discussions about holding onto your faith and beliefs, whether by staying LDS or by exploring and participating in other churches or faiths. The belief in any higher power (including God, Christ, Buddha, or Jedi) is true in this forum. Be kind to others.
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moksha
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Remembering what our faith meant

Post by moksha » Fri Jan 27, 2017 2:09 pm

Remembering what our faith meant or John Dehlin and the Fire of September

I loved that song Try to Remember. The character from The Fantasticks who sang that song was named El Gallo. El Gallo was setting the stage for a bittersweet story of tenderness and tragedy. We as participants of the 21st Century may be aghast at the reasoning and actions of El Gallo in having his own daughter raped, but that is what happened in The Fantasticks and so that was the story which unfolded on stage. It was not sugar coated and it still had its thorns. This story remains poignant for we are all the spiritual descendants of El Gallo’s action.

I have admired John Dehlin for some time and I admit his old PowerPoint presentation of staying a Mormon has helped reinforce my own beliefs and membership.

Here was a man who knew of the deeds of El Gallo and yet saw the wisdom of trying to remember the kind of September when the grass was green and the grain so yellow. He knew the history but also the dream so tender it was kept beside our pillow. He knew of the young and callow fellows and yet kept faith with them through honesty. You’ve got to admire something as wholesomely decent as that.

That dream grew darker when the storm clouds of his own excommunication loomed. The storm happened and life moved on, but something precious was lost in the happening. Our faith still comforts us in our December and it behooves us not to forget. Remember for one brief shining moment there stood Camelot even if it turned out to be a 7/11.
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

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Newme
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Re: Remembering what our faith meant

Post by Newme » Fri Jan 27, 2017 3:50 pm

moksha wrote:
Fri Jan 27, 2017 2:09 pm
Here was a man who knew of the deeds of El Gallo and yet saw the wisdom of trying to remember the kind of September when the grass was green and the grain so yellow. He knew the history but also the dream so tender it was kept beside our pillow. He knew of the young and callow fellows and yet kept faith with them through honesty. You’ve got to admire something as wholesomely decent as that.

That dream grew darker when the storm clouds of his own excommunication loomed. The storm happened and life moved on, but something precious was lost in the happening. Our faith still comforts us in our December and it behooves us not to forget. Remember for one brief shining moment there stood Camelot even if it turned out to be a 7/11.
Poetically beautiful!
There are some aspects - some memories that still make me smile - even though so much associated with it I don't believe anymore.
SPG used to say, "Functional illusions are priceless."
Beauty and hope is all subjective - and therefore can be found almost anywhere - in any circumstance.

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No Tof
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Re: Remembering what our faith meant

Post by No Tof » Sat Jan 28, 2017 9:23 am

As always the pen in penguin proves wise.

If I have grasped your point, I agree that despite the obvious flaws in the narrative, the essence of our faith or at least our desire to seek god and do well in our life is a valuable pursuit.

Where ever our life's journey takes us that pure desire to "choose the right" is our best policy.

In the midst of my heresy I still wear my ring.
Out beyond ideas of wrongdoing and right doing, there is a field. I'll meet you there.
Rumi

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moksha
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Re: Remembering what our faith meant

Post by moksha » Sat Mar 11, 2017 12:06 am

Faith changes over time, but regardless of those changes, it can still be an aid in fighting against despair.
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

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Ghost
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Re: Remembering what our faith meant

Post by Ghost » Sat Mar 11, 2017 9:10 am

I can absolutely see the value in the type of faith I had previously. Which is one reason why I don't make any effort to push people into questioning.

Through the process of challenging my fundamental assumptions about existence, I've found that life has gained depth in one way while losing it in another. I'm not sure whether that's a good thing or a bad thing, as I'm not sure what it would even mean to call such things good or bad.

I still value my LDS background and community, even if I'm still figuring out what it means to keep that connection alive.

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Newme
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Re: Remembering what our faith meant

Post by Newme » Sun Mar 12, 2017 12:41 pm

moksha wrote:
Sat Mar 11, 2017 12:06 am
Faith changes over time, but regardless of those changes, it can still be an aid in fighting against despair.
So true! I know some consider faith as religious, but I see it as belief in good things like goals, oneself, others.

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No Tof
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Re: Remembering what our faith meant

Post by No Tof » Sat Mar 18, 2017 1:42 pm

moksha wrote:
Sat Mar 11, 2017 12:06 am
Faith changes over time, but regardless of those changes, it can still be an aid in fighting against despair.
So true. Faith changes and the reasons for despair seem to change as well. When I knew the answers to life's big questions despair seemed to hinge on the inability to be perfect even as Jesus is perfect.

Now that I am gaining confidence in the state of not knowing, there are moments of concern about the possible future consequences of my choices.

At the "tally line" on the ledger however, I'd say despair is a smaller number. Faith in the future perhaps has become the new tool to ward off those moments when despair creeps in.
Out beyond ideas of wrongdoing and right doing, there is a field. I'll meet you there.
Rumi

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