What are the odds?

Discussions about negotiating relationships between faithful LDS believers and the apostates who love them. This applies in particular to mixed-faith marriages, but relations with children, parents, siblings, friends, and ward members is very welcome.
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deacon blues
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Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2016 7:37 am

What are the odds?

Post by deacon blues »

I have had success discussing my critical views of the LDS church using this perspective- I could be wrong.
I explain that I honestly believe that there is a possibility that the Church could be true. Yes, I honestly believe, with my understanding of the limitations of the human mind that that is a possibility. To be more precise: the possibility is between 1% and 5-10%, depending on my mood, but it is honest. ;)
I'm reminded of this C.S. Lewis quote: "Now that I am a Christian I do have moods in which the whole thing looks very improbable: But when I was an atheist I had moods in which Christianity looked terribly probable." Mere Christianity p. 140. :o
As Voltaire said: Uncertainty is uncomfortable, but certainty is ridiculous."
There are likely exceptions. :lol:
God is Love. God is Truth. The greatest problem with organized religion is that the organization becomes god, rather than a means of serving God.
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Hagoth
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Re: What are the odds?

Post by Hagoth »

Do you ever have moments when you think there is a possibility that Hinduism, or Buddhism, or Daoism is true? I probably have those at least as often, and to a similar degree, as I do that the LDS faith might be true.

That is also a tack I like to take with LDS people (on the rare occasion that they actually want to have a discussion) Why are our convictions and spiritual experiences demonstrably superior to those of people from any other faith tradition? Either they have as much certainty and are moved as deeply as we are, or everybody else is lying and only we are telling the truth. I asked this to a friend who is now a General Authority. The best he could come up with was, "well, maybe we have spiritual experiences more frequently than they do."

Or maybe not?
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain

Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."
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Ghost
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Re: What are the odds?

Post by Ghost »

I find myself kind of wishing at times that I could "give place" for at least some pieces of what I once believed.

While there are definitely big mysteries when it comes to the universe and it's easy enough to just assume we as humans understand very little, this doesn't translate in my mind to making any of the tenets of Mormonism/Christianity or any other belief system I know of more likely to be accurate.
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nibbler
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Re: What are the odds?

Post by nibbler »

Hagoth wrote: Mon Nov 03, 2025 7:14 am "well, maybe we have spiritual experiences more frequently than they do."
Now the real question, does that make someone more superior or less superior? :D

I grew up in a surrounding culture that was very Evangelical. Trust me when I say this, Mormons are never going to out-spiritual experience Evangelicals.

Sunrise. Thank you Jesus! Not raining. Thank you Jesus! Raining. Thank you Jesus! Fall colors on trees. Thank you Jesus! My cup of coffee is extra oomph today. Thank you Jesus! Look a rainbow. Thank you Jesus! But not that kind of rainbow. Thank you Jesus!

Not to throw shade on any group's spiritual experiences. Just sayin' that if we're going for quantity over quality... even bringing the three hour block back isn't going to make us contenders.

The LDS truth claims really come down to the church having exclusive access to divine authority. It might make members of the church uncomfortable to tell that to people of other faiths but that's all we're really saying.

Using authority as a basis for being "true" is an interesting basket to place all of one's eggs into. It presupposes that there's a god and that authority even matters to said god, but pointing at ordinances and covenants is an easier pill to swallow than saying, "we're spiritual authoritarians."
We don’t see things as they are, we see them as we are.
– Anais Nin
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