Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

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consiglieri
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Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

Post by consiglieri » Tue Aug 07, 2018 9:58 am

On 9/9/18, Elder Cook will host a worldwide devotional dealing with the subject of answering questions about church history.

https://www.lds.org/broadcasts/face-to- ... k?lang=eng

The church is soliciting from the general membership questions for the event, many of which are actually being displayed on the church's website.

Here are a few recent examples of questions being asked on lds.org.
Does the Church have in its possession any written record of Joseph Smith receiving a revelation on plural marriage with Native Americans in 1831 in Jackson County, Missouri?
Why aren't the Church History Gospel Topics Essays referenced with some frequency in General Conference talks, in Ensign articles, and on the front pages of LDS .org? Some of my family members and local leaders believe that the Gospel Topics Essays are anti-Mormon material--which has resulted in conflict and contention for me.
Prophets in the past have made doctrinal statements in venues like general conference that the church now disavows. (teachings against interracial marriage, the curse of cain, etc.) Knowing that many prophetic statements of the past are not true what is a faith-based way to trust prophetic statements today.
The Prophet Joseph Smith ordained black males with the priesthood. When did that stop and become church policy? Was it immediately after President Smith's martyrdom or did it take some time?
What was Joseph Smith's justification for marrying other men's wives? Why doesn't the Joseph Smith biography movie at the temple visitor center show him translating the Book of Mormon out of a hat? Why doesn't the church talk about Joseph Smith's felony?
Looks like Elder Cook has his work cut out for him.

Does he even know what he is getting into?

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Palerider
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Re: Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

Post by Palerider » Tue Aug 07, 2018 10:17 am

It would be great if he could deal with this stuff honestly but I fear we will only see an arrogant attempt at being a spin master. Protect Joseph and the church at all costs.

Furthermore, this tells me the church is really beginning to suffer and that leadership are living in fear and are clueless about how to stop the bleeding.

The church would need about 8 of these sessions at 3 hours a piece to even begin to address all the problems. Do they really think one session is going to get it?
"There is but one straight course, and that is to seek truth and pursue it steadily."

"Truth will ultimately prevail where there is pains to bring it to light."

George Washington

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slavereeno
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Re: Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

Post by slavereeno » Tue Aug 07, 2018 10:40 am

The short answer to everything is "All the prophets before us were fallible men.", pretty much every response gets distilled to this.

consiglieri
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Re: Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

Post by consiglieri » Tue Aug 07, 2018 10:42 am

Exactly, Palerider!

They are going to do what they did at the Swedish Rescue.

They are going to set a limited amount of time to cover a lot of questions, only a couple of which will be substantive.

They will give a little answer that doesn't really address the issue, leaves untouched contradictory information, refuse to have any follow up questions, and claim they have dealt with the questions.

But it is extremely revealing that the church is now put in the position where they feel they have to have these types of Q&A devotionals.

This NEVER would have happened at any other point in the history of the church!

At least, I have never seen anything like this being attempted.

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Palerider
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Re: Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

Post by Palerider » Tue Aug 07, 2018 12:12 pm

consiglieri wrote:
Tue Aug 07, 2018 10:42 am
Exactly, Palerider!

They are going to do what they did at the Swedish Rescue.

They are going to set a limited amount of time to cover a lot of questions, only a couple of which will be substantive.

They will give a little answer that doesn't really address the issue, leaves untouched contradictory information, refuse to have any follow up questions, and claim they have dealt with the questions.

But it is extremely revealing that the church is now put in the position where they feel they have to have these types of Q&A devotionals.

This NEVER would have happened at any other point in the history of the church!

At least, I have never seen anything like this being attempted.
If they were even partially courageous, they would devote an entire general conference to the problems. And even then they wouldn't have to face questions from the congregation.

This is a can of worms they are dealing with because they are forced to deal with it. They truly have no desire to be in the business of disseminating truth or they would happily engage until all questions are answered honestly.
"There is but one straight course, and that is to seek truth and pursue it steadily."

"Truth will ultimately prevail where there is pains to bring it to light."

George Washington

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GoodBoy
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Re: Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

Post by GoodBoy » Tue Aug 07, 2018 2:12 pm

My questions that I can't add because I resigned, but would still love to see answered:
"Why were the golden plates necessary if they weren't use in the translation of the majority of the Book of Mormon?"

"Did Joseph Smith make a mistake when he practiced polyandry in his efforts to keep God's commandment to implement polygamy?"

"Are there plans to modify the prophet Joseph Smith's captions and explanations of the facsimiles in the Book of Abraham?"

Oh, how I wish the brethren had the courage... no the faith, to publicly answer unscripted questions. If they are scared, I recommend that they try putting on the whole armor of God.
Always been the good kid, but I wanted to know more, and to find and test truth.

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wtfluff
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Re: Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

Post by wtfluff » Tue Aug 07, 2018 2:17 pm

They're expert level at gaslighting and thought-terminating-cliché answers, so it would be easy to be Elder Crook, and answer all the questions easily:

"We've always known about this!"

"You just have to have faith."

"You'll know all the answers when you're dead."


Easy-Peasy!
Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus

Keep the company of those who seek the truth - run from those who have found it -Václav Havel

Who taught you how to hate?

Vito
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Re: Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

Post by Vito » Tue Aug 07, 2018 3:11 pm

...
Last edited by Vito on Mon Sep 24, 2018 1:12 am, edited 1 time in total.

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hiding in plain sight
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Re: Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

Post by hiding in plain sight » Tue Aug 07, 2018 3:33 pm

I will be curious of Quentin's answer will be anything different than this.

1) We don't know everything and you just need to have faith until the Lord reveals more, in his due time.
2) Questions are good. Doubt is bad. Just trust our answers, even if we don't have any good ones.
3) This is a great time of sifting and you have to be careful what you read and make sure Satan doesn't deceive you.
4) Read the scriptures. Pray every day. Pay your tithing. Obey the prophets. This is the only true path to have "real" faith. Everything else is counterfeit.
5) Translate means inspiration. Steel means obsidian laced clubs. Up means down.

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Not Buying It
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Re: Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

Post by Not Buying It » Tue Aug 07, 2018 4:21 pm

He doesn’t have any answers to give. The hard questions will not be the ones he addresses. There will be vague references to past Church leaders being fallible. And then lots of testimony bearing. He will give them just enough to satisfy those who don’t care enough to want hard answers to tough questions.

Keep in mind this event isn’t directed at us - it’s directed at those who will be satisfied with his non-answers. It’s designed to keep those who are still in the boat in the boat, not to get those of us who got out of the boat back in it.
"The truth is elegantly simple. The lie needs complex apologia. 4 simple words: Joe made it up. It answers everything with the perfect simplicity of Occam's Razor. Every convoluted excuse withers." - Some guy on Reddit called disposazelph

Reuben
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Re: Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

Post by Reuben » Tue Aug 07, 2018 5:05 pm

hiding in plain sight wrote:
Tue Aug 07, 2018 3:33 pm
I will be curious of Quentin's answer will be anything different than this.

1) We don't know everything and you just need to have faith until the Lord reveals more, in his due time.
2) Questions are good. Doubt is bad. Just trust our answers, even if we don't have any good ones.
3) This is a great time of sifting and you have to be careful what you read and make sure Satan doesn't deceive you.
4) Read the scriptures. Pray every day. Pay your tithing. Obey the prophets. This is the only true path to have "real" faith. Everything else is counterfeit.
5) Translate means inspiration. Steel means obsidian laced clubs. Up means down.
Looks like you've covered all the bases. What you've got there is a fine recipe for nonconsensual faith.

You probably shouldn't make a drinking game out of this list.
Grieve. It's your right and inheritance as a human being.

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FiveFingerMnemonic
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Re: Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

Post by FiveFingerMnemonic » Tue Aug 07, 2018 5:12 pm

Has anyone asked the church history question about Quentin's involvement in California Healthcare Systems theft of public property yet?

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Archimedes
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Re: Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

Post by Archimedes » Tue Aug 07, 2018 6:09 pm

This will be completely scripted and rehearsed. The PR and Legal departments have both weighed in. There will be no free exchange and the questions will be pre selected. Photo opportunities available later for a reasonable donation.
"She never loved you; she loved the church, her one true love. She used you to marry the church by proxy."

-- unknown reddit poster

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jfro18
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Re: Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

Post by jfro18 » Tue Aug 07, 2018 6:59 pm

This is going to be so incredibly pre-screened and scripted... nothing is going to come out of this beyond what was well prepared in advanced.

And they are muting/blocking any really pointed questions on Facebook/Twitter, so they are already making sure they keep the lid on what other members will see just in the social media posts. Pretty remarkable, really, how hard they work to make sure people can't see the questions being asked.

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moksha
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Re: Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

Post by moksha » Tue Aug 07, 2018 7:17 pm

Softball questions and faith-promoting answers.

Perhaps Elder Cook could employ a Greek chorus to help provide answers: A designated representative from the Church PR department (AKA the Newsroom), one of the Kirton McConkie lawyers, and Dr. Daniel C. Peterson armed with a dowsing seer rod. Hopefully, Elder Cook and his stalwart chorus could answer all the softball questions posed by singing the answers to the tunes from Gilbert & Sullivan's HMS Pinafore. That would be worth listening to!

ELDER COOK. — When I was a lad I served my term
As office boy to an Attorney's firm.
I cleaned the windows and I swept the floor,
And I polished up the handle of the big front door.
I polished up the handle made of birch
And now I am an Apostle of the Mormon Church!

CHORUS. — He polished up the handle made of birch
And now he is an Apostle in the Mormon Church!

ELDER COOK. — Now members all, whoever you may be,
If you want to rise to the Kingdoms three,
If your soul isn't fettered by questioning stool,
Be careful what you ask by this golden rule —
Obey your leaders whatever they may say,
And you'll all be exalted on the appointed day!

CHORUS. — Obey your leaders whatever they may say,
And you'll all be exalted on the appointed day!
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

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Hagoth
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Re: Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

Post by Hagoth » Tue Aug 07, 2018 7:30 pm

None of those questions will make the final cut. I but we'll hear softball versions like, "I'm a bit confused by the multiple versions of the First Vision. How can I better strengthen my testimony about this wondrous event?"
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain

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Sheamus Moore
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Re: Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

Post by Sheamus Moore » Tue Aug 07, 2018 7:39 pm

...Yes, a cocophany of platitudes and doublespeak delivered at a painfully slow cadence that will leave some dazed and confused and others gleefully satiated.

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Hagoth
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Re: Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

Post by Hagoth » Tue Aug 07, 2018 7:57 pm

It wouldn't let me ask questions because I'm too old :x . I read through a lot of the questions and the vast majority have absolutely nothing to do with church history. A lot of "how do I keep Satan from putting bad thoughts into my head?," and "how can I study the scriptures more effectively?" kinds of questions.

I want to see more questions like:

1- Why did Joseph Smith change the words of God when he rewrote his Book of Commandments revelations for publication in the Doctrine and Covenants?

2-Why did so many prophets and apostles claim Pacific Islanders were descendants of Lehi when their islands weren't even settled until after Book of Mormon times?

3- When and why did the church become opaque with their finances and why did President Hinkley claim on national TV that members have access to that information? Why do they continue to not be transparent?

4- How could Joseph have been sealed to polygamous wives (as the Gospel Topic essay claims) before Elijah restored the sealing keys?

5- Why were more than 20 women sealed to Joseph before Emma? Why does D&C 132 say that she would be destroyed for not complying, even when she didn't know that he was marrying all of those other women?

6- Why was Orson Pratt threatened with expulsion from the Quorum of the 12 for not believing the Adam-God doctrine?

7- Didn't Joseph Smith start temple work for the dead so people could baptize members of their immediate family who had died before the restoration? Haven't we blown that out of proportion by trying to baptize and seal everyone? What's the difference between having everyone sealed to everyone and having no one sealed to anyone?

9- Why was it OK for Joseph and Brigham to drink alcohol?

10- Which is worse, marrying a man's wife for time or taking her from him for eternity. Joseph Smith did both. Was he sinning in one instance and not the other?

I could go on and on.
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain

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w2mz
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Re: Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

Post by w2mz » Tue Aug 07, 2018 9:37 pm

This is what I'd like to post:

1) In the Gospel Principal manual regarding honesty we read: “There are many other forms of lying. When we speak untruths, we are guilty of lying. We can also intentionally deceive others by a gesture or a look, by silence, or by telling only part of the truth. Whenever we lead people in any way to believe something that is not true, we are not being honest.” https://www.lds.org/manual/gospel-princ ... y?lang=eng
- Why are we then told that Helen Mar Kimball was “was sealed to Joseph several months before her 15th birthday” instead of being told “she was 14 years old” when he approached her to be one of his polygamist wives?
- Why have all of the church sanctioned paintings and artwork show Joseph looking directly at the gold plates when we read in the essay regarding the translation process that “Joseph placed either the interpreters or the seer stone in a hat, pressed his face into the hat to block out extraneous light, and read aloud the English words that appeared on the instrument.
https://www.lds.org/topics/book-of-morm ... old=truere

2) Why was Helen Mar Kimball’s free agency essentially denied when God commanded Joseph to take her as a wife else he be destroyed by an angel with a drawn sword? And, why would God allow Joseph to ensure the salvation of Helen and all of her posterity if she would take the step to be one of his wives?

3) Why should we assume that Joseph Smith did not have intimate relationships with his wives, when there were babies born from other polygamist marriages while he was still alive, and, each of the subsequent prophets had children with their polygamist wives?

4) Why was Emma’s agency threatened by God if she did not accept Joesph’s polygamist wives? Isn’t agency the reason we’re in this mortal sojourn?

5) Why do we not discuss and celebrate the bravery and courage of the wives of Joseph Smith, teach their names in song to our primary children, and hold them up as examples of commitment and sacrifice to the restored gospel?

6) Why was Joseph allowed to lie about his polygamist and polyandrous marriages?

7) With the mummies that contained the Book of Abraham papyri, Joseph Smith also found what he called the Book of Joseph papyri. Will President Nelson translate the Book of Joseph papyri so that we have the additional words of God from those ancient prophets?

8) Why would God allow prophets to deny the essential blessings of the temple from those of the African race for 150 years due to an incorrect policy? Were the doctrinal points as preached by Brigham Young, the first presidency statement from 1949, and the First Presidency statements to Dr. Lowery Nelson regarding the doctrine of the African race not actually doctrine?

9) Why is Elder Cook taking the assignment to respond to the questions of church history and not the prophet himself? Wouldn’t President Nelson be able to communicate directly with God to provide responses and answers to church members who are honestly seeking answers?

And about 100 others...
Last edited by w2mz on Tue Aug 07, 2018 11:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The church has engineered your eternal family into a commodity that can be purchased with an annual fee. The fact that full tithing payment is a requirement for saving ordinances is the biggest red flag imaginable. Hagoth

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Not Buying It
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Re: Elder Cook to Take on Church History Questions!

Post by Not Buying It » Tue Aug 07, 2018 9:52 pm

You have to sign into your LDS account to ask questions - how is it some of them are from “Anonymous Users”? Is there an “anonymous” option once you sign in?
"The truth is elegantly simple. The lie needs complex apologia. 4 simple words: Joe made it up. It answers everything with the perfect simplicity of Occam's Razor. Every convoluted excuse withers." - Some guy on Reddit called disposazelph

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