Dehlin Alternate Reality

[MoPag]

I was listening to the latest Mormon Stories podcast when I heard John Dehlin describe to his guest that NOM no longer exists.

In a way he is right. If you consider a NOM to be a believer that has a very nuanced, cafiteria style of Mormonism, then they have been slowly been removed from the church.

I really need to write more precisely. Dehlin was talking about the NOM message board. He was saying it no longer exists, as in it went away and never came back.

Like the old board? Maybe someone should tell him we have this one now. Or maybe not.

[Not Buying It]

I was listening to the latest Mormon Stories podcast when I heard John Dehlin describe to his guest that NOM no longer exists.

In a way he is right. If you consider a NOM to be a believer that has a very nuanced, cafiteria style of Mormonism, then they have been slowly been removed from the church.

I really need to write more precisely. Dehlin was talking about the NOM message board. He was saying it no longer exists, as in it went away and never came back.

Well it would have taken about two seconds to do a Google search and find there is still a NOM message board.

But I am perfectly OK with it if he never finds it.

[Cnsl1]

I also listened to the podcast where Dehlin said that, and thought it was odd. This discussion forum obviously exists. I think Dehlin is just ignorant of it, or didn't want to give us any love.

I'm not sure what to think about Dehlin. I enjoy a lot of his podcasts, but I don't think he is a great interviewer. He's usually ok, but sometimes gets in his guests way, IMO. Ok, but not great. His co-host seems nice, but her voice inflections get irritating. I've heard about a few questionable things he's done, but I don't expect people to be perfect, and I don't know enough about the situations to really know. A postmo friend of mine who met him didn't seem to care for him for a very specific reason related to their visit. But again.. I really don't know.

I greatly appreciate much of the work he's done. He indicated on a podcast that he started the StayLDS forum. That forum was a big blessing to me at a time I needed to understand that I was not alone. That my concerns and doubts were shared by literally hundreds of others. I found the forum through a NOM website and for whatever reason, the staylds discussion board was the one I needed at that time. I needed support in staying LDS. This was over a decade ago.. before the CES letter, but just after prop8. Eventually I migrated here, and NOM has become my Sunday Sanctuary so to speak. I greatly appreciate this group of souls who take time to express their thoughts on this religion that was and for some still is a major factor in their lives. Sharing helps us heal and DEAL with the ongoing trials of being kinda Mormon, or raised Mormon.

Dehlin also spoke of the middle way disappearing and being no longer tenable. I see efforts from the big tent church that supports that belief. For some people.. yeah. Probably not. But we're talking about beliefs here, which tend to be pretty idiosyncratic even though the church tries hard to get us to all believe the same stuff. But it's s big doctrinal and cultural buffet, and the dishes kinda mix together to where it's difficult for everyone to come to a consensus as to what you have to believe and what you can dismiss as silly culture or tradition, so people end up filling their plates with what works for them, what their family has interpreted for them to be essential, and what they believe to be essential based on their personal experience being Mormon. So by the time we sit to dine, not everyone is eating the same stuff anyway. So, IMO, we're all buffet Mormons, and there's a continuum on what you're willing or able to digest. Obviously, the church pushes the categorical ideas--true or not true.. and there's the testimony basics-- that God lives, that Jesus lives and is the savior, that Joseph saw them and is a prophet, and that we have modern prophets, BUT there are more nuanced thinkers than just those in this forum, and taking a categorical approach to thinking there's no place for another thought seems ignorant, which maybe comes from not having been in the buffet line for many years.

Another factor that makes me think diversity and middle ways will always be tenable relates to the variability of the local situations. Leadership roulette, if you will. I told my wife a long time ago that I was one bad leader away from not going back (which supports the erroneous Mormon notion that we leave because we're offended). But we know it's not about getting offended by a person, it's more about tolerance of offensive doctrine and practices. So long as I can be in the church but not completely of the church, I can find a place. Because for me, I have friends there. They genuinely care about me and me for them. We have mourned and cheered together. I have served them and they have served me. It's a community of kind people who try to be better people, and I still want to be a part of that, even if I do not believe exactly as they do. When I look closely at their plates, it's pretty clear they're not eating all the same stuff.

[moksha]

So, IMO, we're all buffet Mormons, ...

I like the term Buffet Mormonism. Jesus invited us all to come to the great buffet, whether through the grand arch or the narrow pathway around back. Said to forget your business attire and come as you are.

[stealthbishop]

I do have to say that in JD's defense, I thought that NOM had imploded for a while and he may still have been living in that reality when NOM 1.0 was lost. He's obviously become extremely consumed with his own brand (THRIVE) as well as the evolution of MS and therefore has not been paying much attention to when or if the NOM board was resurrected.

But I for one was so happy to see NOM back and then TBH it took me a while to come back and hang out again. As my DW started going through a severe faith crisis/transition of her own this is the place that I came to for my own well being and to process it.

[moksha]