NOM

So, my wife just found out that I have not paid any tithing this year. She alternates between stoicism and crying. She won't talk to me. I don't know why this bothers me so much. She told me years ago that she does not love me and probably never will. She has not touched me on purpose in years, either. I alternate between feeling like the kid who got caught stealing a cookie and feeling like a defiant teenager. I guess I'm not being an adult either. I am not looking for any advice. I just need to write this down, tell somebody. Ugh.

I know you're not looking for advice but here's a thought: Latter-day Saints are taught tithing is "fire insurance" and your spouse may simply see it as placing her physical/spiritual person in danger. Simply put: nothing was going to happen as long as you were paying in.

Rhetoric of the institutional church really has tithing in a financially comfortable position. If someone stops paying tithing then you get worried, hushed discussion of blessings and protection that you are now not receiving. But no one looks askance at the blessings of tithing falling short when some faithful, tithe-paying family suffers some calamity.

blazerb wrote: ↑Thu Dec 28, 2017 1:29 pm She told me years ago that she does not love me and probably never will. She has not touched me on purpose in years, either.

This made me super sad. Everyone has their reasons for staying but I wish better for you my friend--and for all of us in these situations (whether short term or long term). Hopefully someday you'll be in a relationship where you are valued.

So, my wife just found out that I have not paid any tithing this year. She alternates between stoicism and crying. She won't talk to me. I don't know why this bothers me so much. She told me years ago that she does not love me and probably never will. She has not touched me on purpose in years, either. I alternate between feeling like the kid who got caught stealing a cookie and feeling like a defiant teenager. I guess I'm not being an adult either. I am not looking for any advice. I just need to write this down, tell somebody. Ugh.

Everyone deserves a relationship where he or she is valued, loved, and appreciated. If she doesn't love you and sees you only as a meal ticket or as a tithing payer, then it is time to re-evaluate the relationship. I know you're not looking for advice, but just as my opinion, this is a sad situation for you, so I send my support and hope for an improved life somehow.

The church uses tithing as kind of a spiritual shakedown or spiritual protection racket. You better pay up, or something might happen to you. In order to receive God's blessings, you have to fork over money. If a mafia gangster talked to us like this, we would strongly object, but somehow, the church is allowed to continue to blackmail us in this way.

One thought is that if your wife wants to pay tithing on her behalf, then perhaps she could find a job and pay tithing on her income. Or, if you are the sole wage earner for the family and you two split your income, then she could pay tithing on her portion of the income. I think that if she wants to pay tithing, then she should step up and do it, rather than shaming, crying, or giving you the cold shoulder.

I know that's a lot of advice that you didn't ask for, but I am so sorry that you are in this sad situation. Take care, and best wishes to you, from Wndr.

Anon70 wrote: ↑Thu Dec 28, 2017 4:52 pm

blazerb wrote: ↑Thu Dec 28, 2017 1:29 pm She told me years ago that she does not love me and probably never will. She has not touched me on purpose in years, either.

This made me super sad. Everyone has their reasons for staying but I wish better for you my friend--and for all of us in these situations (whether short term or long term). Hopefully someday you'll be in a relationship where you are valued.

Amen to this. It's time to start taking a little better care of yourself, in many ways.

And stick to your guns about tithing. The church doesn't need your money and doesn't deserve it. Maybe compromise by contributing to a different charity instead ("Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.")

blazerb wrote: ↑Thu Dec 28, 2017 1:29 pm So, my wife just found out that I have not paid any tithing this year. She alternates between stoicism and crying. She won't talk to me. I don't know why this bothers me so much. She told me years ago that she does not love me and probably never will. She has not touched me on purpose in years, either. I alternate between feeling like the kid who got caught stealing a cookie and feeling like a defiant teenager. I guess I'm not being an adult either. I am not looking for any advice. I just need to write this down, tell somebody. Ugh.

I told Spouseman a couple weeks ago that I haven't increased our tithing in years, that it's somewhere between net and surplus now. He was fine with it, to my surprise, I expected some drama. It's so hard to predict which way things like this will go, and I'm sad it went badly for you.

The bit about the state of your union is worrisome. My heart goes out to you. Years ago I worked with a woman in a pretty rough marriage who said that she made love to her husband every night, because, "at the end of the day, he deserves to get laid, and so do I." I can't say I'm as great at that, putting aside anything else that may be going on, but I remember it and I think there's some truth to it.

You do not deserve to be treated with contempt, and withholding affection from family members is abusive. I get that things happen and time goes by, but, this worries me. I don't know your details, kids, finances, reasons for staying, but --I do know that you deserve to be happy and you deserve the ability to love and be loved. Is counseling an option? Even if she won't go, just you? Is divorce an option? I can recommend a workbook, and even an online class. Something needs to change for you, so you can move forward in one way or another. Life is meant to be lived and part of that is experiencing love and acceptance. Please let me know if I can offer any resources.

blazerb wrote: ↑Thu Dec 28, 2017 1:29 pm So, my wife just found out that I have not paid any tithing this year. She alternates between stoicism and crying. She won't talk to me. I don't know why this bothers me so much. She told me years ago that she does not love me and probably never will. She has not touched me on purpose in years, either. I alternate between feeling like the kid who got caught stealing a cookie and feeling like a defiant teenager. I guess I'm not being an adult either. I am not looking for any advice. I just need to write this down, tell somebody. Ugh.

Wow bro! Are you in the marriage for the kids then? That sounds like a lot of sacrifice and pain for both of you. I hope you are figuring out an exit strategy because carpe deim! This is a pretty direct judgement on your situation without any firsthand knowledge, other than the description above, but I've lived in pain for years in a relationship out of duty to god and church and wish I had gotten out sooner.

blazerb wrote: ↑Thu Dec 28, 2017 1:29 pm So, my wife just found out that I have not paid any tithing this year. She alternates between stoicism and crying. She won't talk to me. I don't know why this bothers me so much. She told me years ago that she does not love me and probably never will. She has not touched me on purpose in years, either. I alternate between feeling like the kid who got caught stealing a cookie and feeling like a defiant teenager. I guess I'm not being an adult either. I am not looking for any advice. I just need to write this down, tell somebody. Ugh.

Thanks for sharing this. I know that getting it written down is kind of a step in accepting that it is real, and telling someone is a next step in starting to deal with things. I know you said you are not looking for advice, and I wouldn't know what to say as far as what you should do anyway. But you do deserve to be in a relationship with someone who loves you. I don't know what your wife's reasons for not loving you are, and sometimes those reasons can't be changed, but still you deserve to have someone who loves you. Your existence in a marriage like that must be terribly lonely. You deserve more.

Thanks everyone. Just to respond a little. I have totally been staying with this marriage because of our kids. I don't want to give much detail beyond that, but they are now at a point where I have started planning changes. I don't plan to give in on tithing. I may have to endure some shaming from people at church and from family if she tells everyone, but I have decided I can deal with it. Thanks once again.

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Ouch. Good luck with everything, Blazerb! I wish there was something more we could do to help. At least you have come sympathetic minds here to appreciate your dilemma.

Sorry man. You know, you only go around once. Whatever you decide to do about your marriage, make sure it isn't something you will feel like you wasted your life on when you get old. I am so sorry, that is a tough spot to be in, but wow, doesn't sound like there is much happiness in your marriage. Hope that changes in whatever way it has to. Life is short and precious, after all.

DW and i went the other day to tithing settlement. Afterwards I was expressing my disgust at the fact that our tithing money was going to a multi-billion dollar corporation who are currently (alledged) using said tithing money to buy various parcels of land all over the world. I, with little success, argued that if the church truly was headed by JC he would direct them to be doing more to help the needy than the church currently is with their token humanitarian projects. DW replied that I didn't have to pay my tithing if I didn't want to. I was shocked. Elated! Can this be happening? But alas, I didn't realize that it was a carefully set trap until I stepped right into it. "You don't have to pay, but you would be lying next time you talked to the bishop about your temple recommend. Does that make you feel better?"

Question: Is this a learned TBM behaviour? Or is it a skill my DW has acquired? I didn't fall into the Mormon cult until later in life so I missed out on all the Jedi training that my DW clearly excels at

JustHangingOn@57 wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2017 12:28 am But alas, I didn't realize that it was a carefully set trap until I stepped right into it. "You don't have to pay, but you would be lying next time you talked to the bishop about your temple recommend. Does that make you feel better?"

Question: Is this a learned TBM behaviour? Or is it a skill my DW has acquired? I didn't fall into the Mormon cult until later in life so I missed out on all the Jedi training that my DW clearly excels at

The institution sets the traps. Members don't think of them as traps, sometimes even after they're pointed out as such. But they'll happily use them that way.

Here's my favorite. There are three parts.

• To pass a temple recommend interview, you must sustain church leaders.
• The common consent vote doesn't ask whether members are "in favor" or "opposed," but whether they "sustain" or "oppose" (which are not really opposite ideas).
• Bishops are instructed to confiscate the recommends of members who they know aren't worthy. Members are not told this policy, which is in Handbook 1.

This leverages members' standing with God and standing in the community to silence dissent. It's only justifiable if you believe that the institution is God. Then it's not a trap, it's just the way things are. Members get hung up on why you would vote opposed to church leaders in the first place.

blazerb I am very sorry for your situation. I hope that you are able to build a better life when the time is right.