Lineal Melchizedek priesthood

Discussions toward a better understanding of LDS doctrine, history, and culture. Discussion of Christianity, religion, and faith in general is welcome.
Post Reply
User avatar
Palerider
Posts: 858
Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2016 8:44 am

Lineal Melchizedek priesthood

Post by Palerider » Fri Sep 14, 2018 5:24 pm

Didn't want to threadjack the topic on Joseph and Sarah Whitney but this really popped out at me:

"Sarah Ann Whitney’s sealing to Joseph Smith was also singular in that a revelation, dated July 27, 1842, specifically outlined the words Sarah’s father, Bishop Newell K. Whitney, was to use in performing the ceremony:

Verily thus saith the Lord unto my se[r]vant N. K. Whitney the thing that my se[r]vant Joseph Smith has made known unto you and your Famely [Family] and which you have agreed upon is right in mine eyes and shall be crowned upon your heads with honor and immortality and eternal life to all your house both old & young because of the lineage of my Preast [Pirest] Hood saith the Lord it shall be upon you and upon your children after you from generation to generation By virtue of the Holy promise which I now make unto you saith the Lord.

these are the words which you shall pronounce upon my se[r]vant Joseph [Smith] and your Daughter S. A. [Sarah Ann] Whitney. They shall take each other by the hand and you shall say:

you both mutu[al]ly agree calling them by name to be each others companion so long as you both shall live presser[v]ing yourselv[es] for each other and from all others and also through [o]ut all eternity reserving only those rights which have been given to my servant Joseph [Smith] by revelation and commandment and by legal Authority in times passed [past].

“If you both agree to covenant and do this, then I give you S. A. [Sarah Ann] Whitney my Daughter to Joseph Smith to be his wife to observe all the rights betwe[e]n you both that belong to that condition. I do it in my own name and in the name of my wife your mother and in the name of my Holy Progenitors by the right of birth which is of Priest Hood vested in me by revelation and commandment and promise of the living God obtained by the Holy Melchizedek Gethrow [Jethro] and other of the Holy Fathers commanding in the name of the Lord all those powers to concentrate in you and through to your po[s]terity for ever

all these things I do in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ that through this order he may be glorified [glorified] and [that] through the power of anointing Davied [David] may reign King over Iseral [Israel] which shall hereafter be revealed let immortality and eternal life henc[e]forth be sealed upon your heads forever and ever."

I know early in the church there was some doctrine given (probably purged now) regarding the lineage of the Melchizedek priesthood. (Which isn't supposed to be lineal)

The wording for Joseph and Sarah's ceremony seems to be loaded with it.

I'm thinking that seldom heard doctrine that Joseph was a descendent of Melchisedek, Jethro, King David and Christ, has to be where this concept comes from. Which would explain why Christ had to have been married and had a posterity (in the minds of church leadership).

When Joseph writes:

"...that through the power of anointing Davied [David] may reign King over Iseral [Israel] which shall hereafter be revealed."


I think he's writing about himself. I don't think he's writing about Christ.


Is this lineal High Priesthood why some of the early leadership considered themselves rightful heirs to the Melchizedek priesthood by virtue of being blood descendents of Christ?
"There is but one straight course, and that is to seek truth and pursue it steadily."

"Truth will ultimately prevail where there is pains to bring it to light."

George Washington

User avatar
Not Buying It
Posts: 700
Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2016 12:29 pm

Re: Lineal Melchizedek priesthood

Post by Not Buying It » Sat Sep 15, 2018 9:31 am

...eternal life to all your house both old & young because of the lineage of my Preast [Pirest] Hood saith the Lord

Nice that they don’t have to worry about righteous living or keeping commandments anymore - just give your daughter to the prophet and you are set for the eternities.
"The truth is elegantly simple. The lie needs complex apologia. 4 simple words: Joe made it up. It answers everything with the perfect simplicity of Occam's Razor. Every convoluted excuse withers." - Some guy on Reddit called disposazelph

User avatar
Corsair
Posts: 2195
Joined: Fri Oct 14, 2016 9:58 am
Location: Phoenix

Re: Lineal Melchizedek priesthood

Post by Corsair » Sat Sep 15, 2018 3:23 pm

Not Buying It wrote:
Sat Sep 15, 2018 9:31 am
...eternal life to all your house both old & young because of the lineage of my Preast [Pirest] Hood saith the Lord
Nice that they don’t have to worry about righteous living or keeping commandments anymore - just give your daughter to the prophet and you are set for the eternities.
I am entirely with you on this point. Personal consecration and the values in the Sermon on the Mount seem irrelevant as long as you come from the correct family line. The authority of the priesthood is probably the biggest thing that the modern LDS church clings to in support of their relevance. None of Joseph Smith's theological innovations are particularly welcome, especially in light of the connections with plural marriage. It all comes back to authority, and not to actual righteousness.

I will grant that the modern church is repeatedly told to be righteous to call upon the powers of heaven, but when someone is obviously not living righteously enough to warrant having authority, the ordinance is still considered valid. Apostle Richard Lyman and his 20 year affair seems to be the top exhibit in the decision. Richard Lyman surely must be in so many priesthood lines of authority at this point. It would be exceedingly difficult to undo or redo his ordinances and and time he conferred the priesthood on someone.

User avatar
Palerider
Posts: 858
Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2016 8:44 am

Re: Lineal Melchizedek priesthood

Post by Palerider » Sat Sep 15, 2018 5:06 pm

Corsair wrote:
Sat Sep 15, 2018 3:23 pm
Richard Lyman surely must be in so many priesthood lines of authority at this point. It would be exceedingly difficult to undo or redo his ordinances and and time he conferred the priesthood on someone.
Right, except the lines of authority we're speaking of here aren't the kind you get as a list on a peice of paper given by whoever ordains you to be an elder or high priest.

The kind we're talking about here come by being a literal blood relative of the Savior.

In which case you wouldn't necessarily have to be ordained to the priesthood because you were born possessing it through birthright.

It almost makes me wonder if this was going to be Joseph's authority solution if the Peter, James and John story didn't pan out...?

Was he concocting two different authority scenarios and running them at the same time?
"There is but one straight course, and that is to seek truth and pursue it steadily."

"Truth will ultimately prevail where there is pains to bring it to light."

George Washington

User avatar
moksha
Posts: 1919
Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2016 4:22 am

Re: Lineal Melchizedek priesthood

Post by moksha » Sun Sep 16, 2018 10:45 am

I think Heber C. Kimball also received the Celestial Warranty covering himself, his wife and all his posterity in exchange for his daughter, Helen Marr Kimball. Too bad Esau did not hold out for this warranty as well as the mess of pottage in exchange for his birthright. A bowl of either lentil or split pea soup hardly seems a fair exchange.

At Starbucks, this warranty plus a five dollar bill will get you a tall Cinnamon Dolce Latte.
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

User avatar
Hagoth
Posts: 2255
Joined: Fri Oct 14, 2016 1:13 pm

Re: Lineal Melchizedek priesthood

Post by Hagoth » Sun Sep 16, 2018 7:21 pm

Thanks for that Palerider. Do you have a citation for where that revelation can be found?
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain

User avatar
Palerider
Posts: 858
Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2016 8:44 am

Re: Lineal Melchizedek priesthood

Post by Palerider » Sun Sep 16, 2018 9:51 pm

Hagoth wrote:
Sun Sep 16, 2018 7:21 pm
Thanks for that Palerider. Do you have a citation for where that revelation can be found?
This will get you started. It's been awhile since I've studied this "doctrine". I'll see if I can find more.

https://atom.lib.byu.edu/smh/24552/


And for some extremely interesting reading try this if it will work as a link.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... iQ097WZ8iN
"There is but one straight course, and that is to seek truth and pursue it steadily."

"Truth will ultimately prevail where there is pains to bring it to light."

George Washington

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests