Sunday Logistics

Discussions toward a better understanding of LDS doctrine, history, and culture. Discussion of Christianity, religion, and faith in general is welcome.
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foolmeonce
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Sunday Logistics

Post by foolmeonce » Tue Feb 12, 2019 7:08 am

I haven't attended in a few years, but I can't help but be curious. Not curious enough to go check it out mind you, just curious enough to pop on here every now and again to see what's up.

So tell me if you please, how do Sunday logistics work these days? With the combined HPG and EQ, 2 hour block, etc.; what got killed, what stayed? What does home study supposedly replace? Does the 2 hour block still feel like all day like the 3 hour? With the time duration change and ministering replacing home teaching, are there less time sinks or is it repackaging the same time sinks?
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hiding in plain sight
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Re: Sunday Logistics

Post by hiding in plain sight » Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:57 am

sacrament meeting every week for one hour.

A ten minute break to change places.

a 50 minute sunday school lesson one week.

The other week a 50 minute RS/Priesthood meeting

Every week has a 50 minute primary for the kids.

It actually goes very fast and I love it given that I will continue to be attending for the forseeable future.

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slavereeno
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Re: Sunday Logistics

Post by slavereeno » Tue Feb 12, 2019 9:09 am

It does feel shorter, better.

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Linked
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Re: Sunday Logistics

Post by Linked » Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:49 am

2 hour church is way better. I brought up how much better 2 hour church is at a family gathering and all my siblings ignored me, but my 18 year old nephew loudly agreed.

Part of me would prefer 4 hour church, so I could point to how awful it is because that's better for my long term goals, but 2 hour church is better in the moment.
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Just This Guy
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Re: Sunday Logistics

Post by Just This Guy » Tue Feb 12, 2019 11:07 am

Is primary combined sharing time, or is it individual classes for each age group?
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slavereeno
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Re: Sunday Logistics

Post by slavereeno » Tue Feb 12, 2019 11:51 am

Linked wrote:
Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:49 am
2 hour church is way better. I brought up how much better 2 hour church is at a family gathering and all my siblings ignored me, but my 18 year old nephew loudly agreed.

Part of me would prefer 4 hour church, so I could point to how awful it is because that's better for my long term goals, but 2 hour church is better in the moment.
Agreed. I was thinking recently about the fall of the Soviet Union. There was intense dysfunction in the USSR as Gorbachev took power. His solution was to "soften" the hard line communism through Glasnost (Openness and transparency) and Perestroika (restructuring). This backfired somewhat and many believe it eventually led to the dissolution of the USSR and the fall of the Berlin Wall.

Is RMN the Gorbachev of Mormonism? Will members start to see the man behind the curtain? Will members ask why LESS church is making them happier, and how far does the less church making me happier go?

So I haven't decided if the new changes help or hurt as a retention strategy.

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2bizE
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Re: Sunday Logistics

Post by 2bizE » Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:51 pm

I’m ready for one hour church already...but two hour church feels about 7 hours shorter than 3 hour church. I used to feel sooooo exhausted after 3 hours.
~2bizE

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græy
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Re: Sunday Logistics

Post by græy » Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:58 pm

Just This Guy wrote:
Tue Feb 12, 2019 11:07 am
Is primary combined sharing time, or is it individual classes for each age group?
Most wards in our neck of the woods have followed direction to combine Jr and Sr primaries for 20 minute singing time, and then splitting up for ~20 minutes of individual class time.

At least one ward has found that "default option" unworkable and has reverted to separate Jr/Sr primaries. One has 20 minutes of singing while the other group is in classes, then they swap for the last 20 minutes.

We may make this change ourselves soon. The music leaders just cannot effectively teach songs to large groups of ~70 children ranging from 3 to 11 years old. Who woulda thunk it?
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Linked
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Re: Sunday Logistics

Post by Linked » Tue Feb 12, 2019 3:09 pm

græy wrote:
Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:58 pm
Just This Guy wrote:
Tue Feb 12, 2019 11:07 am
Is primary combined sharing time, or is it individual classes for each age group?
Most wards in our neck of the woods have followed direction to combine Jr and Sr primaries for 20 minute singing time, and then splitting up for ~20 minutes of individual class time.

At least one ward has found that "default option" unworkable and has reverted to separate Jr/Sr primaries. One has 20 minutes of singing while the other group is in classes, then they swap for the last 20 minutes.

We may make this change ourselves soon. The music leaders just cannot effectively teach songs to large groups of ~70 children ranging from 3 to 11 years old. Who woulda thunk it?
I didn't know the "default" was combining Jr/Sr primaries, that sounds like a zoo in wards with very large primaries. My ward has a small primary (we have one class for all kids older than 7), and the new primary methods have been good. Taking out the sharing time lesson was smart, those were unworkable with that many kids. The songs are as awful as ever though, so much indoctrination. As a primary teacher I would prefer a few more minutes for class time because we can't really get anything in before time is up, but it's a small price to pay for the shorter church.
"I would write about life. Every person would be exactly as important as any other. All facts would also be given equal weightiness. Nothing would be left out. Let others bring order to chaos. I would bring chaos to order" - Kurt Vonnegut

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nibbler
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Re: Sunday Logistics

Post by nibbler » Tue Feb 12, 2019 9:40 pm

In my corner of the vineyard what Primary does is no different than what they did before, it has just been condensed down from two hours to one hour. Instead of the groups swapping out who does sharing time and who does classes after an hour they swap out after 30 minutes.

IMO sacrament meeting is a lot better. Before our SM was always 75-80 minutes. I was worried they couldn't pull it off but so far we've kept it to about 65 minutes.

1st & 3rd Sundays = Sunday School. I believe the instruction is to launch right in, no opening prayer (but there is a closing prayer). In my ward we still do the opening prayer out of pure habit though. The end result is SS running about 20 minutes longer than it used to. In the past SM would eat into the SS hour and there would be about 30 minutes for SS. Now there's about 50 minutes.

2nd & 4th Sundays = PH/RS. Same deal with the instruction not to pray to open and there are no PH opening exercises. The adults go directly to the EQ class and the youth go directly to their classes. I was shocked that our ward was able to follow the instruction to reduce announcements. In the past, after PH opening exercises and the two layers of announcements (once in PH opening exercises and again when everyone went to their quorum) it left 20 minutes or less for instruction, now it's similar to SS, there's about 45-50 minutes.

The instruction is that PH/RS should study from general conference talks. It's the biggest bore I know.

5th Sunday = combined. I haven't been to one yet, but I suspect it will be the same. Leadership will show up on Sunday, realize it's 5th Sunday halfway into SM, then toss something together last minute. :D

So quick comparison.
Before: SM 75 minutes; SS 30 minutes; PH 20 minutes; total 125 minutes.
Now: SM 60 minutes; 2nd hour 50 minutes; total 110 minutes.

So if we're talking class time, we really didn't lose all that much, we just trimmed lots of fat off.
foolmeonce wrote:
Tue Feb 12, 2019 7:08 am
What does home study supposedly replace?
They introduced it at the same time they got rid of the 3rd hour, but it's not really a replacement to the 3rd hour. If you strip it of the label of "home church" and all the formality they're trying to apply to it, it's just an attempt to get people to read the SS lessons at home so they'll be prepared for SS.
foolmeonce wrote:
Tue Feb 12, 2019 7:08 am
Does the 2 hour block still feel like all day like the 3 hour?
Nope. Loads better. Especially now that SM doesn't go an hour an a half.
foolmeonce wrote:
Tue Feb 12, 2019 7:08 am
With the time duration change and ministering replacing home teaching, are there less time sinks or is it repackaging the same time sinks?
Every ward is going to be different but it's been my experience that ministering is the same thing as home teaching but with PPIs every 3 months instead of reporting numbers at the end of each month. I think most wards have a relaxed ministering program but I still hear units where leaders insist that families be visited in their homes and a message be taught to them by the end of the month. IOW, no different at all.
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moksha
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Re: Sunday Logistics

Post by moksha » Wed Feb 13, 2019 6:27 am

I've been curious how the 2-hour block has affected those who drive a considerable distance to Church.
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crossmyheart
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Re: Sunday Logistics

Post by crossmyheart » Wed Feb 13, 2019 9:16 am

2 hour church has made me grumpier than 3 hour church.

In the past- I could leave after sacrament and get my weekly grocery shopping done and a starbucks or something and make it back to the parking lot just in time for the end of 3rd hour.

Now there is not enough time to fit in even a quick errand. So I am stuck in the parking lot and have to get my grocery shopping done some other time. :cry:

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FiveFingerMnemonic
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Re: Sunday Logistics

Post by FiveFingerMnemonic » Wed Feb 13, 2019 10:50 am

crossmyheart wrote:2 hour church has made me grumpier than 3 hour church.

In the past- I could leave after sacrament and get my weekly grocery shopping done and a starbucks or something and make it back to the parking lot just in time for the end of 3rd hour.

Now there is not enough time to fit in even a quick errand. So I am stuck in the parking lot and have to get my grocery shopping done some other time. :cry:
This!! I lost an extra hour of Sunday "do whatever the hell I want" free time, while the kids and wife are being indoctrinated.

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oliblish
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Re: Sunday Logistics

Post by oliblish » Wed Feb 13, 2019 2:09 pm

FiveFingerMnemonic wrote:
crossmyheart wrote:2 hour church has made me grumpier than 3 hour church.

In the past- I could leave after sacrament and get my weekly grocery shopping done and a starbucks or something and make it back to the parking lot just in time for the end of 3rd hour.

Now there is not enough time to fit in even a quick errand. So I am stuck in the parking lot and have to get my grocery shopping done some other time. :cry:
This!! I lost an extra hour of Sunday "do whatever the hell I want" free time, while the kids and wife are being indoctrinated.
Me too!


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Newme
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Re: Sunday Logistics

Post by Newme » Thu Feb 14, 2019 6:47 am

crossmyheart wrote:
Wed Feb 13, 2019 9:16 am
2 hour church has made me grumpier than 3 hour church.

In the past- I could leave after sacrament and get my weekly grocery shopping done and a starbucks or something and make it back to the parking lot just in time for the end of 3rd hour.

Now there is not enough time to fit in even a quick errand. So I am stuck in the parking lot and have to get my grocery shopping done some other time. :cry:
:lol: I don’t mean to laugh at your misfortune but that’s hillarious - & I needed the laugh, so thank you. A friend from out of town was visiting very Mormon area on Sunday and thought something serious had happened and he missed the news - because that Sunday stores, streets etc were empty and it looked like a ghost town. Shopping on Sundays is pretty nice.

And I also love the time to myself, coming home before everyone else.

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Hagoth
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Re: Sunday Logistics

Post by Hagoth » Thu Feb 14, 2019 11:03 am

It's been a bit of a letdown for me. I go to sacrament meeting once or twice a month and then I leave. Now I'm only sneaking out of one meeting instead of two. I have been robbed of half of the satisfaction of playing hooky.
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misterfake371
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Re: Sunday Logistics

Post by misterfake371 » Sat Feb 16, 2019 9:33 pm

It feels a lot shorter. I've been teaching a Primary class for the past 5 years, so I don't ever go to Elder's Quorum or Sunday School. I'm not really sure how that stuff works, but I don't need to know. I hope I stay in Primary forever. I like it there. I never prepared much for my Primary lessons, and now I prepare even less.
Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep His commandments, for this is the whole duty of man. Ecclesiastes 12:13

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MerrieMiss
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Re: Sunday Logistics

Post by MerrieMiss » Sun Feb 17, 2019 9:40 am

It does feel shorter. My in-laws are complaining that wards are overlapping in their building so people can get out before 5 pm. Thankfully, our building has each ward start 90 minutes after the last so the last ward gets out of there by 1:30. And like others have said, it's too short now for me to enjoy my Sunday alone time during RS.

There are downsides. Our ward or stake (not sure which) decided no more intermediate hymns and only one youth speaker - so we still have to hear people talk for a terribly long time. One hour of Sunday school is way too long and because they dropped GP it's crowded - my husband hasn't gone twice because he refuses to climb over people to get a seat.

Primary is terrible. The stake decided no more snacks for Nursery because two-year olds need more time for doctrine. No more singing happy birthday to the kids because they need more time for doctrine. No more fun songs because they only have time for doctrinal songs. I wish I were joking.
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slavereeno
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Re: Sunday Logistics

Post by slavereeno » Tue Feb 19, 2019 10:57 am

MerrieMiss wrote:
Sun Feb 17, 2019 9:40 am
Primary is terrible. The stake decided no more snacks for Nursery because two-year olds need more time for doctrine. No more singing happy birthday to the kids because they need more time for doctrine. No more fun songs because they only have time for doctrinal songs. I wish I were joking.
:roll:

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Linked
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Re: Sunday Logistics

Post by Linked » Tue Feb 19, 2019 1:31 pm

MerrieMiss wrote:
Sun Feb 17, 2019 9:40 am
Primary is terrible. The stake decided no more snacks for Nursery because two-year olds need more time for doctrine. No more singing happy birthday to the kids because they need more time for doctrine. No more fun songs because they only have time for doctrinal songs. I wish I were joking.
That is awful. Nursery and Primary need more understanding that they are dealing with children and less pushing of doctrine.

I have been fortunate in my ward, the primary leadership has kept the balance with fun songs and the music leader has really kept the kids engaged. Although, better church is not necessarily what I am looking for...
"I would write about life. Every person would be exactly as important as any other. All facts would also be given equal weightiness. Nothing would be left out. Let others bring order to chaos. I would bring chaos to order" - Kurt Vonnegut

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