“God given” talents?

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Red Ryder
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“God given” talents?

Post by Red Ryder » Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:15 am

What do you think about the idea of God given talents? Is this just a quick and easy way for human’s to label their phenomenal ability to do something very well with little effort? Or did God truly bless some while leaving others to struggle? Or is this just another nurture vs. nature conversation?

And just for fun, what are your god given talents?
Those who do not move do not notice their chains. —Rosa Luxemburg

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Angel
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Re: “God given” talents?

Post by Angel » Wed Jun 26, 2019 11:25 am

I think there are quite a few genetically inherited talents - yes, can't think of anything I know that cannot be traced to nurture and nature.

I will say our son has a talent for being a goofball that he did not learn from his responsible and serious sister... I guess there are a few things showing up in the kids that I'm not sure of the origins for :D
When it is dark enough, you can see the stars. ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson

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RubinHighlander
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Re: “God given” talents?

Post by RubinHighlander » Wed Jun 26, 2019 2:23 pm

Well...in my case, universe given talents and therefore evolution and genetics. Since I stopped attributing so much of my life to some magical flying spaghetti monster I don't consider myself any more special than other homo sapiens, but luck and good fortune has provided a pretty awesome existence compared to the billions of life forms that have gone before me; and for that I am grateful.

Genetically I'm in good health, am not predisposed to addiction, (like about 10% of our population), no depression, and I don't suffer from any serious mental issues. Carpe Diem!
“Sir,' I said to the universe, 'I exist.' 'That,' said the universe, 'creates no sense of obligation in me whatsoever.”
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wtfluff
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Re: “God given” talents?

Post by wtfluff » Wed Jun 26, 2019 3:30 pm

Which god are we typing bout here that's handing out the talents?

Image
Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus

Keep the company of those who seek the truth - run from those who have found it -Václav Havel

Brilliant.

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Linked
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Re: “God given” talents?

Post by Linked » Fri Jun 28, 2019 2:14 pm

I'm not sure what you are asking here RR, I suspect that theists will have one view and deists/athiests with have a different view. Both views are pretty predictable and there's not a ton of room for discussion. Or maybe I missed the point of the question?
"I would write about life. Every person would be exactly as important as any other. All facts would also be given equal weightiness. Nothing would be left out. Let others bring order to chaos. I would bring chaos to order" - Kurt Vonnegut

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Red Ryder
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Re: “God given” talents?

Post by Red Ryder » Fri Jun 28, 2019 3:28 pm

I was kicking around a thought to explain why some people are naturally good at certain things compared from others. Athletics, intellect, business decisions, etc. My natural faithful response is that they were blessed with God given talents.

My new improved way of thinking tells me that genetics, hard work, opportunity, and luck probably play into success more than any God given talent.

I guess it’s more of a couplet or saying then true belief that God blesses certain people over others. But then also flies directly in the face of Mormonism as well as all of the prosperity gospels out there.

In short, I was trying to reconcile a dumb saying with dumb beliefs.

Fluffy’s Meme is the right answer! Which God are we talking about?
Those who do not move do not notice their chains. —Rosa Luxemburg

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Linked
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Re: “God given” talents?

Post by Linked » Fri Jun 28, 2019 3:53 pm

Red Ryder wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 3:28 pm
I was kicking around a thought to explain why some people are naturally good at certain things compared from others. Athletics, intellect, business decisions, etc. My natural faithful response is that they were blessed with God given talents.

My new improved way of thinking tells me that genetics, hard work, opportunity, and luck probably play into success more than any God given talent.

I guess it’s more of a couplet or saying then true belief that God blesses certain people over others. But then also flies directly in the face of Mormonism as well as all of the prosperity gospels out there.

In short, I was trying to reconcile a dumb saying with dumb beliefs.

Fluffy’s Meme is the right answer! Which God are we talking about?
Ah, gotcha. It's interesting to think about where our talents come from. What if a few quarks were formed a little further to the left during the big bang? Or I had less neanderthal dna? Or if my parents hadn't thrown me in the pool when I was 2?
"I would write about life. Every person would be exactly as important as any other. All facts would also be given equal weightiness. Nothing would be left out. Let others bring order to chaos. I would bring chaos to order" - Kurt Vonnegut

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moksha
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Re: “God given” talents?

Post by moksha » Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:09 pm

That so-called "Illustration" pictured the Buddha twice and left off Mohammed and Joseph Smith!
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

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wtfluff
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Re: “God given” talents?

Post by wtfluff » Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:49 pm

moksha wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:09 pm
That so-called "Illustration" pictured the Buddha twice and left off Mohammed and Joseph Smith!
Well... Images of Mohamed can cause problems, but Joe? I have REALLY crappy editing skills, but what the heck...

5000-Gods-Joe.jpg
5000-Gods-Joe.jpg (230.83 KiB) Viewed 223 times

Oh, and I'm definitely in the camp that "Some people are born with it." I've participated in enough goofy hobbies over the years to witness people who have to work extremely hard and practice at things, while others just have a natural "talent" for the task at hand. Yup, it can be extremely frustrating at times. Nope, I don't attribute any of that talent to any invisible being(s) in the sky.
Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus

Keep the company of those who seek the truth - run from those who have found it -Václav Havel

Brilliant.

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moksha
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Re: “God given” talents?

Post by moksha » Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:07 pm

wtfluff wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:49 pm
Well... Images of Mohamed can cause problems, but Joe? I have REALLY crappy editing skills, but what the heck...
Excellent point, Wtfluff! Muslims might call a fatwa on the artist, but Mormons would send them a plate of cookies.
Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

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Corsair
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Re: “God given” talents?

Post by Corsair » Mon Jul 01, 2019 9:41 am

wtfluff wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:49 pm
moksha wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:09 pm
That so-called "Illustration" pictured the Buddha twice and left off Mohammed and Joseph Smith!
Well... Images of Mohamed can cause problems, but Joe? I have REALLY crappy editing skills, but what the heck...
Your edited picture is a metaphor for the larger problem of dealing with the LDS church in any larger context. As usual, adding Mormons or Joseph Smith into discussings of larger religious movements makes them stand out for all of the wrong reasons. I listened to a History of Christianity podcast that I found enjoyable and enlightening. It covered a lot of ground, across the centuries up into the early twentieth century. But the podcast overtly left out Jehovah's Witnesses, Seventh Day Adventists, and (of course) Mormons because they really don't fit.

If you ever feel down about how the institutional LDS church is ignoring your concerns, you can take some comfort knowing that the LDS church is treated by most of Christianity just like they are treating you: an apostate outlier that can't seem to get in line with orthodoxy.

I'm mostly a materialist on talents and have to acknowledge a clear genetic and cultural component in them. I suspect that if some talents are truly from God, then He is OK remaining kind of anonymous on being the source of them. Atheists seem to have no problem achieving their goals with complete indifference or disdain towards God.

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Random
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Re: “God given” talents?

Post by Random » Fri Jul 12, 2019 6:11 pm

Red Ryder wrote:
Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:15 am
What do you think about the idea of God given talents? Is this just a quick and easy way for human’s to label their phenomenal ability to do something very well with little effort? Or did God truly bless some while leaving others to struggle? Or is this just another nurture vs. nature conversation?

And just for fun, what are your god given talents?
I think they are natural gifts. For example, some people can draw incredibly well. If they are drawn to it, they get better and better at it. Beethoven had a God-given gift for music. He worked with it; made his ability better.

Some people are natural athletes.

And so on.

Just like some people have chocolate skin and other people have other shades. Some people have one hair color or a certain nose shape. The difference is that the natural gifts are not physical; they are mental/in the brain.


Then there are the savants who have something wired "wrong" in their brains and are incredible in what they can do. One man could learn a language in a week. He was taken up on it and was asked to learn a difficult language (the Lapland language, I think; it was one that was very difficult to learn) in a week. He did quite well. There are savants that have incredible mathematical computation skills, incredible sculpturing skills, and so on.

Then there are those with a photographic memory. They read something once and it's theirs forever.

I don't know that God specifically "gave" each person some talent. I think it came about by nature (we could get into all sorts of things in regards to that, especially if someone believed in living in other mortalities at other times). I think it is increased by using it. It can be stilted by hostility (teachers, parents, peers).
[They] which knew me from the beginning . . . would testify, that after the most straitest sect of our religion I lived a Pharisee.
Acts 26:5

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Emower
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Re: “God given” talents?

Post by Emower » Sat Jul 13, 2019 3:59 pm

Linked wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 3:53 pm
Red Ryder wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 3:28 pm
I was kicking around a thought to explain why some people are naturally good at certain things compared from others. Athletics, intellect, business decisions, etc. My natural faithful response is that they were blessed with God given talents.

My new improved way of thinking tells me that genetics, hard work, opportunity, and luck probably play into success more than any God given talent.

I guess it’s more of a couplet or saying then true belief that God blesses certain people over others. But then also flies directly in the face of Mormonism as well as all of the prosperity gospels out there.

In short, I was trying to reconcile a dumb saying with dumb beliefs.

Fluffy’s Meme is the right answer! Which God are we talking about?
Ah, gotcha. It's interesting to think about where our talents come from. What if a few quarks were formed a little further to the left during the big bang? Or I had less neanderthal dna? Or if my parents hadn't thrown me in the pool when I was 2?
God doesn't have a thing to do with it, but it's still a combination of nature and nurture. Genetics that contribute to making you a tall drink of water may help you play basketball, but unless there are circumstances in life that provide opportunity and practice, you will not be exceptional at basketball. You need to have them both. Except for those savant people.

I don't see that I have any special talents. I used to think I was good at public speaking, but then I changed jobs that required me to do some public speaking in challenging situations and I no longer think that.

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