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Biggest shelf item: biblical literalism
Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2016 3:46 pm
by Spicy McHaggis
Flacker Man posted this on youtube. I thought it was excellent. As I went through my faith transition, the requirement in mormonism to take the bible literally was probably my biggest shelf item.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yOoSCWuK1Ok&app=desktop
Re: Biggest shelf item: biblical literalism
Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:28 pm
by GoodBoy
Me too. This actually precipitated my entire faith crisis. There is just no way the earth is 6000 years old. There is just no way that the global flood thing happened. The assumptions required for those to be true are completely ridiculous. If they are wrong about those things... what else could they be wrong about? Turns out quite a bit.
Re: Biggest shelf item: biblical literalism
Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2016 8:10 am
by deacon blues
That is a well presented you tube video. Sadly, virtually every TBM I know would be offended by it. They would be uncomfortable if they did watch it, and if I invite them to watch it, they would be uncomfortable with me. They are happy with the view that I am a pretty good guy who has gone off the deep end and will probably go to the terrestrial kingdom, if I'm lucky. If I'm unlucky I'll be in outer darkness for denying the faith.
Strangely, many would probably admit that the mortal world is older than 6 thousand years, but if one showed them D&C 77 they would go back into denial. I don't think they would take Joseph Fielding Smith's stance
but they would rationalize something in their mind that they were comfortable with.
Re: Biggest shelf item: biblical literalism
Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2016 8:24 am
by Hagoth
That was a very nice summary by FlackerMan.
This made my day:
Re: Biggest shelf item: biblical literalism
Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2016 8:41 am
by document
One of my favorite moments in my religious life was when I sat down with our priest and just asked her a few questions. I struggled continually because I felt I didn't fit in because I don't take the bible literally. She just laughed and said, "You'll do well here. Here you can believe in dinosaurs and you don't have to check your brains at the door". It turns out she was quoting Robin Williams.
It was such a massive relief to know that I was among people who didn't take the bible literally. I found out later that nobody takes the Old Testament literally and many of us don't take the New Testament literally as well. I felt right at home, and the shelf that was existent in Mormonism is completely gone.
Re: Biggest shelf item: biblical literalism
Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2016 8:58 am
by deacon blues
Hagoth wrote:That was a very nice summary by FlackerMan.
This made my day:
The Poster is good........it could even be used in a Sunday school class if the sarcasm was removed. I'm reminded of Spencer Kimball saying that Eve being created from Adam's rib was a metaphor. Using that to analyze other verses, like "is the serpent a metaphor for Satan?" could be helpful in prying open some closed minds.
Re: Biggest shelf item: biblical literalism
Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2016 4:23 pm
by Hagoth
deacon blues wrote:I'm reminded of Spencer Kimball saying that Eve being created from Adam's rib was a metaphor. Using that to analyze other verses, like "is the serpent a metaphor for Satan?" could be helpful in prying open some closed minds.
And might Satan be a metaphor for the capacity we all have to do evil?
I know I've mentioned this about five times before but I still get a chuckle out of it. My GD teacher was dead serious when he shared a piece of sacred knowledge he learned on the internet. God gave us a coded a message to tell us how Eve was created:
Deoxy
ribonecleic Acid
Re: Biggest shelf item: biblical literalism
Posted: Sat Dec 24, 2016 9:28 am
by Ghost
This was indirectly the most significant part of my questioning as well. For me, it wasn't as much about some passages in the biblical books being contradictory or implausible, but at one point I asked myself why I accept any of the supernatural stories in the biblical record as historical in the first place. Kind of like the point that this guy makes at the very end of his video.
There are some fun Brigham Young quotes out there regarding stories in Genesis:
Supposing that Adam was formed actually out of clay, out of the same kind of material from which bricks are formed; that with this matter God made the pattern of a man, and breathed into it the breath of life, and left it there, in that state of supposed perfection. He would have been an adobe to this day. . . . You believe Adam was made of the dust of this earth. This I do not believe, though it is supposed that it is so written in the Bible; but it is not, to my understanding. . . . I do not believe that portion of the Bible as the Christian world do. I never did, and I never want to. What is the reason I do not? Because I have come to understanding, and banished from my mind all the baby stories my mother taught me when I was a child.
(Journal of Discourses, 2:6)
I do not know anything to the contrary of my ribs being equal on both sides. The Lord knows if I lost a rib for each wife I have, I should have had none left long ago. . . . As for the Lord taking a rib out of Adam’s side to make a woman of, He took one out of my side just as much. "But Brother Brigham, would you make it appear that Moses did not tell the truth?" No, not a particle more than I would that your mother did not tell you that little Billy came from a hollow toad stool.
(The Essential Brigham Young, 95)
Re: Biggest shelf item: biblical literalism
Posted: Sat Dec 24, 2016 10:40 am
by Hagoth
I do not believe that portion of the Bible as the Christian world do.
I've noticed that on several occasions Brigham pointed out the difference between Christians and Mormons. Another fundamental that the church is desperately trying to shed.
No, not a particle more than I would that your mother did not tell you that little Billy came from a hollow toad stool.
Oh, man, there goes my last shred of testimony. I was really clinging to the Billy-toad stool doctrine.