An email sent by a UT Stake President about "Cancel Culture"

[jfro18]

Saw this on Reddit and it's absolutely insane... the irony is so thick...



My favorite line is this: "Lies, if told often enough and with enough energy, especially if it is a big lie, will eventually be accepted and believed as truth."

Mormonism is the original cancel culture.

[deacon blues]

Talking about the mote and the beam.

I imagined a satirical example, Boyd Packer: "Some parts of history are not faith promoting and should be erased."

[Mackman]

Generally speaking I try not to lie but I make exceptions for a large organization that does not seek the truth like the church they are not interested in the truth !!!

[Not Buying It]

No stake president has any business pushing their political opinions on the ward (although, granted, at least 90% probably agree with him). If that was my stake, I'd send the entire stake Book of Mormon quotes about how the wickedness of leaders causes wickedness in nation and be very clear I was referring to the President of the U.S.

When a local Church leader pushes this or that political view, they alienate those of a different political persuasion, and it frankly calls B.S. on all of the Church's "political neutrality" nonsense. That was one of the things that was hardest about attending Church as a non-believer, was having to listen to leaders spout their political opinions as though they position in the Church gave those opinions added weight.

[Angel]

What was in the rest of the email? Did it mention how the Lamanites had more loving families "their husbands love their wives, and their wives love their husbands" and in the end the Nephites were raping people and practicing horrific forms of cannibalism?

Really disturbing

[MoPag]

Holy sh!t snacks, this is horrible.

Let's just look at this gem of a sentence, shall we?

"False accusation of racism and blame and perceived wrongs by even the inspired founding fathers is fostering hate and anger and a desire to pull down and destroy as never before."

Grammatically speaking, he has packed 5 "ands" into 1 sentence and refused to use a single comma. He needs to cancel his a$$ back to even the 4th grade.

This is also technically a dangling modifier. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dangling_modifier
He doesn't have the balls to directly call out the people making the accusations, so it sounds like the founding fathers are the ones making the false accusations.

It is really, really sad and really, really, Mormon of him to blindly defend a group of men he looks up to. But the phrase "as never before" is quite puzzling. Can he actually not think of a period in history that was more destructive than the one we are in right now. Like really? Nothing?

[Mormorrisey]

No stake president has any business pushing their political opinions on the ward (although, granted, at least 90% probably agree with him). If that was my stake, I'd send the entire stake Book of Mormon quotes about how the wickedness of leaders causes wickedness in nation and be very clear I was referring to the President of the U.S.

When a local Church leader pushes this or that political view, they alienate those of a different political persuasion, and it frankly calls B.S. on all of the Church's "political neutrality" nonsense. That was one of the things that was hardest about attending Church as a non-believer, was having to listen to leaders spout their political opinions as though they position in the Church gave those opinions added weight.

100% this. Man, if I lived in that stake, I'd have no compunction in sending an email to this clown and tell him to keep his political opinions to himself. Like NBI, I've heard political opinions in SS classes and priesthood classes, but this is so blatant for a leader to push their personal agenda, I wouldn't be able to help myself. That's crazy. Sometimes I feel very grateful I was raised Mormon in a place far, far away from the Morridor. On those days I don't feel mad I was raised Mormon at all.

[nibbler]

Ugh. If my SP sent a letter like that out to my stake I'd be tempted to "cancel" my membership.

[nibbler]

Let's just look at this gem of a sentence, shall we?

"False accusation of racism and blame and perceived wrongs by even the inspired founding fathers is fostering hate and anger and a desire to pull down and destroy as never before."

Grammatically speaking, he has packed 5 "ands" into 1 sentence and refused to use a single comma. He needs to cancel his a$$ back to even the 4th grade.

Maybe he meant false accusations of racism levied against the founding fathers? The way it reads it sounds like he's saying that even the founding fathers made false accusations of racism.

[jfro18]

Let's just look at this gem of a sentence, shall we?

"False accusation of racism and blame and perceived wrongs by even the inspired founding fathers is fostering hate and anger and a desire to pull down and destroy as never before."

Grammatically speaking, he has packed 5 "ands" into 1 sentence and refused to use a single comma. He needs to cancel his a$$ back to even the 4th grade.

Maybe he meant false accusations of racism levied against the founding fathers? The way it reads it sounds like he's saying that even the founding fathers made false accusations of racism.

I think that's what he's saying... *even* the founding fathers are being canceled in all of this.

This isn't a belief that's unique to Mormonism, of course, but you don't see most trying to tie their scriptures to it AND ignoring the amazingly irony of their own church having canceled so many who have tried to speak out about their truth claims along with energetically telling their lies until you believe them.

[RubinHighlander]

No stake president has any business pushing their political opinions on the ward (although, granted, at least 90% probably agree with him).

Thing is, a lot of SPs are already or headed toward the church broke crony category, grooming up for a mission then on to potential selection for the next level. So their narcissistic pious position makes them believe they are in the favor of their white haired old man in the sky. If anyone challenged them on their opinion they would just write them off as some kind of anti-jebus. The LDS tribal world view is the most powerful pair of glasses these corporate cronies perceive everything through. As we all know from experience, arguing logic with TBMs goes nowhere; at SP or higher level, it's worse in most cases. All their dogma is true to them for no other reason than they believe it is and they could never possibly be deceived!

[Random]

I for one am sick of how politically correct we have all become. I grew up in a white nationalist home. I am still very conservative but my sisters have moved on and are the epitome of liberalism. And guess what? We get along just fine. We know that we won't agree on politics so we dont talk about it. My favorite pastry shop is ran by two married female couple and come hell or high water I will be at their shop twice a week buying their caramel flan. I dont care for my step-daughters LGBTQ lifestyle but she still refers me to work on her friends homes and I hope that I give them their full moneys worth. When will we ever figure out that we will be a lot better off if we just minded our own business, kept our opinions to ourselves and stop expecting, no, demanding everyone else to believe exactly as we do?

Exactly! We can all get along even with the myriad of differences we have.

[Not Buying It]

I for one am sick of how politically correct we have all become. I grew up in a white nationalist home. I am still very conservative but my sisters have moved on and are the epitome of liberalism. And guess what? We get along just fine. We know that we won't agree on politics so we dont talk about it. My favorite pastry shop is ran by two married female couple and come hell or high water I will be at their shop twice a week buying their caramel flan. I dont care for my step-daughters LGBTQ lifestyle but she still refers me to work on her friends homes and I hope that I give them their full moneys worth. When will we ever figure out that we will be a lot better off if we just minded our own business, kept our opinions to ourselves and stop expecting, no, demanding everyone else to believe exactly as we do?

Exactly! We can all get along even with the myriad of differences we have.

"Political correctness" isn't always a bad thing. Sometimes when people say they hate "political correctness" what they really mean is that they want to keep using language that demeans other people due to their race, sex, gender, sexual orientation, religion, or what have you. Surely when you say you are "sick of how politically correct we have all become", that isn't what you mean to say?

[Random]

"Political correctness" isn't always a bad thing. Sometimes when people say they hate "political correctness" what they really mean is that they want to keep using language that demeans other people due to their race, sex, gender, sexual orientation, religion, or what have you. Surely when you say you are "sick of how politically correct we have all become", that isn't what you mean to say?

No. What I mean, and what I took the other poster to mean, is that there's an incredible amount of hate in groups whether they be lgbt or those who hate lgbt, white and black, this religion or that religion, etc. Each group hates the opposite group with a purple passion. That is what I've seen a lot of.

I think we should all accept each other no matter what our orientation, color, race, religion (or lack thereof), etc. There's far too much fighting and hate going on.

It's good to be black. It's good to be white. It's good to be Mexican or Native American or Chinese or English or Scandinavian or . . . .

People should not be attacked (verbally or otherwise) for being straight, gay, bi, and so forth.

That's what I mean.

[alas]

Exactly! We can all get along even with the myriad of differences we have.

"Political correctness" isn't always a bad thing. Sometimes when people say they hate "political correctness" what they really mean is that they want to keep using language that demeans other people due to their race, sex, gender, sexual orientation, religion, or what have you. Surely when you say you are "sick of how politically correct we have all become", that isn't what you mean to say?

It means that I should be able to believe whatever I choose to. As I posted before, I do not agree with nor understand the LGBTQ lifestyle. So because I choose to follow a different belief system am I automatically a bigot? Because I will not attend a "Pride Festival" parade at my step-daughters request am I a bigot? I attended every other function she had from age four but this stuff I do not support. Her girlfriend is more than welcome in my home but I will not put a rainbow sticker on my car. If my wife invited my step-daughter to attend church with us and she declined because she is opposed to the church even more than I am would that make her as much of a bigot as I am? We have different views and beliefs but we still get along just fine. We keep our opposing views to ourselves when together. She tells my little girls that what she does is fine and then I have to teach them why I believe that their older sister is in error. I dont expect anyone to believe how I do and I dont mock or belittle those who dont. I developed my standards and ideals through my experience in life as everyone does and I nor anyone else should demand that those whose views differ conform.

As long as you disagree politely, then you are “politically correct”. Political correctness isn’t about everybody agreeing or being exactly alike. It is not using racial slurs or calling your step daughter a LBGT slur. It is about keeping your mouth shut when you visit your relatives home and they have a family picture up that shows the lesbian wife of a child, like my sister in law didn’t about my child. It is making you child’s partner welcome in your home, like same SIL didn’t with her child. It is not disowning a child for an interracial marriage like some friends of ours did.

It doesn’t mean you have to attend a gay pride event. It is just not attending and throwing rotten tomatoes as someone did to my daughter.

It isn’t about agreeing, but about kindness while disagreeing. It is about respecting humans who are different as still being humans. The far right makes political correctness into something it isn’t because they don’t want to be kind or polite or respectful to some people, so they make fun of those calling for kindness with terms like “political correctness,” because they don’t want to face their lack of kindness, respect, or politeness.

I would say you are a bigot if you kicked your child out of the house as a teen for coming out gay, or used ugly words to them, or refused to treat their spouse as if they exist. Just not approving of their lifestyle is not a problem, I mean, I disapprove of at least one thing that each and everyone of my children/children in law are into. But I stay polite about how much they spend on X and I keep my mouth shut when it is what they allow their children or how many dogs they have, or even when it is how many dogs cats hamsters, parrots, Guinea pigs, lizards and WTH they have. We can disapprove without being unkind.

[Not Buying It]

"Political correctness" isn't always a bad thing. Sometimes when people say they hate "political correctness" what they really mean is that they want to keep using language that demeans other people due to their race, sex, gender, sexual orientation, religion, or what have you. Surely when you say you are "sick of how politically correct we have all become", that isn't what you mean to say?

It means that I should be able to believe whatever I choose to. As I posted before, I do not agree with nor understand the LGBTQ lifestyle. So because I choose to follow a different belief system am I automatically a bigot? Because I will not attend a "Pride Festival" parade at my step-daughters request am I a bigot? I attended every other function she had from age four but this stuff I do not support. Her girlfriend is more than welcome in my home but I will not put a rainbow sticker on my car. If my wife invited my step-daughter to attend church with us and she declined because she is opposed to the church even more than I am would that make her as much of a bigot as I am? We have different views and beliefs but we still get along just fine. We keep our opposing views to ourselves when together. She tells my little girls that what she does is fine and then I have to teach them why I believe that their older sister is in error. I dont expect anyone to believe how I do and I dont mock or belittle those who dont. I developed my standards and ideals through my experience in life as everyone does and I nor anyone else should demand that those whose views differ conform.

As long as you disagree politely, then you are “politically correct”. Political correctness isn’t about everybody agreeing or being exactly alike. It is not using racial slurs or calling your step daughter a LBGT slur. It is about keeping your mouth shut when you visit your relatives home and they have a family picture up that shows the lesbian wife of a child, like my sister in law didn’t about my child. It is making you child’s partner welcome in your home, like same SIL didn’t with her child. It is not disowning a child for an interracial marriage like some friends of ours did.

It doesn’t mean you have to attend a gay pride event. It is just not attending and throwing rotten tomatoes as someone did to my daughter.

It isn’t about agreeing, but about kindness while disagreeing. It is about respecting humans who are different as still being humans. The far right makes political correctness into something it isn’t because they don’t want to be kind or polite or respectful to some people, so they make fun of those calling for kindness with terms like “political correctness,” because they don’t want to face their lack of kindness, respect, or politeness.

I would say you are a bigot if you kicked your child out of the house as a teen for coming out gay, or used ugly words to them, or refused to treat their spouse as if they exist. Just not approving of their lifestyle is not a problem, I mean, I disapprove of at least one thing that each and everyone of my children/children in law are into. But I stay polite about how much they spend on X and I keep my mouth shut when it is what they allow their children or how many dogs they have, or even when it is how many dogs cats hamsters, parrots, Guinea pigs, lizards and WTH they have. We can disapprove without being unkind.

Alas said it perfectly. I really don't have anything to add.

But Blashyrkh does bring up something I have to concede - there is a paradox associated with being intolerant of someone else's intolerance. I'm not very good at articulating why, but there seems to be a natural limit to tolerance where I can't bring myself to be tolerant of, say, homophobia, or the Proud Boys or whatever, or pedophiles. Certainly not DezNat, those people are scary bigots. Tolerance isn't anything goes. But I'm not sure I can adequately explain why tolerance applies in some situations but not others - can any of you?

Blashyrkh, I am glad to hear you treat your step-daughter with respect, I have nothing at all negative to say about the way you describe the situation. I actually even admire that while you don't personally believe in that lifestyle, you are willing to set that aside and treat a family member like a human being, not everyone can do that. "I don't expect anyone to believe how I do and I don't mock or belittle those who don't" is a good credo, insofar as someone else's beliefs aren't causing harm to others.

[alas]

It means that I should be able to believe whatever I choose to. As I posted before, I do not agree with nor understand the LGBTQ lifestyle. So because I choose to follow a different belief system am I automatically a bigot? Because I will not attend a "Pride Festival" parade at my step-daughters request am I a bigot? I attended every other function she had from age four but this stuff I do not support. Her girlfriend is more than welcome in my home but I will not put a rainbow sticker on my car. If my wife invited my step-daughter to attend church with us and she declined because she is opposed to the church even more than I am would that make her as much of a bigot as I am? We have different views and beliefs but we still get along just fine. We keep our opposing views to ourselves when together. She tells my little girls that what she does is fine and then I have to teach them why I believe that their older sister is in error. I dont expect anyone to believe how I do and I dont mock or belittle those who dont. I developed my standards and ideals through my experience in life as everyone does and I nor anyone else should demand that those whose views differ conform.

As long as you disagree politely, then you are “politically correct”. Political correctness isn’t about everybody agreeing or being exactly alike. It is not using racial slurs or calling your step daughter a LBGT slur. It is about keeping your mouth shut when you visit your relatives home and they have a family picture up that shows the lesbian wife of a child, like my sister in law didn’t about my child. It is making you child’s partner welcome in your home, like same SIL didn’t with her child. It is not disowning a child for an interracial marriage like some friends of ours did.

It doesn’t mean you have to attend a gay pride event. It is just not attending and throwing rotten tomatoes as someone did to my daughter.

It isn’t about agreeing, but about kindness while disagreeing. It is about respecting humans who are different as still being humans. The far right makes political correctness into something it isn’t because they don’t want to be kind or polite or respectful to some people, so they make fun of those calling for kindness with terms like “political correctness,” because they don’t want to face their lack of kindness, respect, or politeness.

I would say you are a bigot if you kicked your child out of the house as a teen for coming out gay, or used ugly words to them, or refused to treat their spouse as if they exist. Just not approving of their lifestyle is not a problem, I mean, I disapprove of at least one thing that each and everyone of my children/children in law are into. But I stay polite about how much they spend on X and I keep my mouth shut when it is what they allow their children or how many dogs they have, or even when it is how many dogs cats hamsters, parrots, Guinea pigs, lizards and WTH they have. We can disapprove without being unkind.

Alas said it perfectly. I really don't have anything to add.

But Blashyrkh does bring up something I have to concede - there is a paradox associated with being intolerant of someone else's intolerance. I'm not very good at articulating why, but there seems to be a natural limit to tolerance where I can't bring myself to be tolerant of, say, homophobia, or the Proud Boys or whatever, or pedophiles. Certainly not DezNat, those people are scary bigots. Tolerance isn't anything goes. But I'm not sure I can adequately explain why tolerance applies in some situations but not others - can any of you?

Blashyrkh, I am glad to hear you treat your step-daughter with respect, I have nothing at all negative to say about the way you describe the situation. I actually even admire that while you don't personally believe in that lifestyle, you are willing to set that aside and treat a family member like a human being, not everyone can do that. "I don't expect anyone to believe how I do and I don't mock or belittle those who don't" is a good credo, insofar as someone else's beliefs aren't causing harm to others.

For me tolerance ends when someone is harming someone else because they do not tolerate what ever the person is. I am perfectly willing to tolerate pedophiles, as long as they do not touch a child or promote others harming children. I tolerated my Sister in law who had her first husband leave her for a man. After years and four children with her wondering what was wrong with her that her husband did not desire her body, the final insult to her attractiveness was that the husband abandoned her and the children for a man, a fat dumpy bald man. She was devastated and because she could not understand homosexuality, she took it to mean she wasn’t a worthwhile human being, that she was t attractive as a woman, less attractive than an ugly man. She was rejected for an ugly man, and understand my sister in law at 70 is still attractive, especially for a great grandma. But she couldn’t understand why her husband couldn’t love her. 3 years struggling as a single mother of 4 kids. Enter my brother into the situation. They together have two children, then adopt 4 abused kids. Then her biological daughter (My biological niece as opposed to step and adopted children, comes out lesbian. And SIL totally rejects her. I mean, she said some horrible things about how we treat our daughter and her wife, and I could still forgive her because she had been so badly hurt by a mixed orientation marriage. But when she not only said, but did horrible intolerant things to my niece, we told the niece we were there for her if she ever needed us and stopped visiting my brother and his wife because I just could not tolerate her intolerance. Probably hurt the niece once again because she had to seek us out, and once she was kicked out of the house, she didn’t even have our phone number and because we had been the ones going to their house, she couldn’t remember how to get to our house across town. But I had to protect my own daughter, and myself.

That for me is when tolerance stops. When they are harming others.