RFM and Peter Bleakley

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Hagoth
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RFM and Peter Bleakley

Post by Hagoth » Sat Dec 26, 2020 2:18 pm

I'm really enjoying RFM's interview with Peter Bleakley.

This is a guy who cuts through the BS better than anyone I have heard, while still loving some things about the church and maintaining a vision of how it could be a really good thing for many people if not for the narrowminded men in charge (who he labels Pharisees). He is pretty much the opposite of an apologist and wants to fix the church rather than defend its bad behavior, so I'm sure he will be excommunicated soon.

I give it 6 out of 5 stars. He also has a series of discussions on Facebook called Christians vs. Pharisees, which I haven't listened to. If you are familiar with these please chime in.
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain

Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."

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moksha
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Re: RFM and Peter Bleakley

Post by moksha » Sat Dec 26, 2020 4:07 pm

Good faith does not require evidence, but it also does not turn a blind eye to that evidence. Otherwise, it becomes misplaced faith.
-- Moksha

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2bizE
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Re: RFM and Peter Bleakley

Post by 2bizE » Sat Dec 26, 2020 8:12 pm

I listened to this and it was not only wonderful, it was extremely educational. Peter is brilliant and really understands the church better than just about anyone.
~2bizE

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Hagoth
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Re: RFM and Peter Bleakley

Post by Hagoth » Sun Dec 27, 2020 10:26 am

One of my favorite observations he made, among many, was about committees. He reminded us that a couple of decades ago the church constantly held up the existence of creeds like the Nicene Creed ad the go-to evidence that all other churches are in apostasy; they form committees to decide doctrine, we get revelation. But he gave a couple of examples of current church leaders praising all of these committees and teams of lawyers hammering out doctrine and policy, and even proclaiming that the decisions of those committees IS revelation.
“The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.” -Mark Twain

Jesus: "The Kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha: "Be your own light."

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oliblish
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Re: RFM and Peter Bleakley

Post by oliblish » Sun Dec 27, 2020 3:44 pm

Here are his original recordings that are now on YouTube. I started listening to them and a lot of the content is also talked about on the RFM interview...


Christians vs Pharisees part 01: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AoS7WoQJgAw
Christians vs Pharisees part 02: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fCSPVFlK48o
Christians vs Pharisees part 03: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1pl0_DlUydE
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w2mz
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Re: RFM and Peter Bleakley

Post by w2mz » Sun Dec 27, 2020 9:15 pm

oliblish wrote:
Sun Dec 27, 2020 3:44 pm
Here are his original recordings that are now on YouTube. I started listening to them and a lot of the content is also talked about on the RFM interview...


Christians vs Pharisees part 01: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AoS7WoQJgAw
Christians vs Pharisees part 02: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fCSPVFlK48o
Christians vs Pharisees part 03: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1pl0_DlUydE
Thank you oblish. I don’t use Facebook but I wanted to listen to these in addition to the RFM podcast.

Honestly, this one with RFM was one of my all-time favorites. He is so elegant in dissecting the problems the church is turning a blind eye to. That said, I’m not sure the q15 think that pandering to the old generation is a bad strategy. I know in my DWs extended family (very large) the Boomers and GenXer’s are all still uber faithful and oblivious to any “problems”. I keep hoping that someone else will see through the sham, but no such luck. They are all seemingly true believers to the core. To their thinking, the church is growing at an unprecedented pace and the q15 are infallible. This is the facade the church leaders want to keep in place, so they retain power and authority.

I teach gospel doctrine every other week as an atheist, and it’s befuddling to see so many grown ass adults subscribe wholly to this crazy myth.
The church has engineered your eternal family into a commodity that can be purchased with an annual fee. The fact that full tithing payment is a requirement for saving ordinances is the biggest red flag imaginable. Hagoth

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Angel
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Re: RFM and Peter Bleakley

Post by Angel » Mon Dec 28, 2020 5:59 pm

Hagoth wrote:
Sat Dec 26, 2020 2:18 pm
He ... wants to fix the church rather than defend its bad behavior, so I'm sure he will be excommunicated soon.
Yup, that is the first phase of leaving - the false hope the church can be changed from within. I do attribute quite a few of the new policies in place to people like Sam Young bringing issues to the forefront, so change can be forced on organizations, but you will not be labeled a hero for it.
“You have learned something...That always feels at first as if you have lost something.” George Bernard Shaw
When it is dark enough, you can see the stars. ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson

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Corsair
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Re: RFM and Peter Bleakley

Post by Corsair » Tue Dec 29, 2020 11:52 am

This was a gratifying podcast. It was comforting to hear from someone who saw the problems without just heading for the exit. I have complete sympathy for people that do walk out the door. I'm still someone who is on the inside while arousing less suspicion than Brother Bleakley.

I am enjoying the unique point of view of Brother Bleakley because it is some validation of what I have seen. I have a lot of respect for his attempts to bring attention to the problems and I fear for his membership status as a result. All I can do is keep the popcorn handy for the inevitable fireworks.

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1smartdodog
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Re: RFM and Peter Bleakley

Post by 1smartdodog » Tue Dec 29, 2020 1:22 pm

This podcast reinforced my belief the church could be an agent of hope and help. Whether it is true or not it is in a position to make good things happen.

I also blame the leaders. They have taken a once vibrant community and turned it into a dull by the numbers march into boredom. They lie and obfuscate. The will not expose themselves to any real questions. They hide in their own ivory tower with their claims of divine prophesy. They refuse to change the status quo to maintain control. They have usurped the power of the members, and claim it as their own. They have their reward.




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Exiled
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Re: RFM and Peter Bleakley

Post by Exiled » Wed Dec 30, 2020 10:28 am

I am almost done with the podcast now. I don't think Mr. Bleakley will be satisfied in his quest to change the leaders from the inside. Only outside pressure changes these bozos. I feel for him. He seems really sincere, wanting to make reasonable changes that give more power to the members. I agree that American Exceptionalism is a cancer on a worldwide church and must change. However, the leaders worship America and the Utah cultural version of it. They have also decidedly moved into the obedience first camp for some time in response to the church's historical claims being exposed. Pointing out that obedience first is satan's plan, that they are liars, racist, sexist, and homophobic, won't make any friends with the SLC clowns. He will be approached and then disciplined if he gets a movement going. If he doesn't recant or shut-up, then excommunicated.

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Culper Jr.
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Re: RFM and Peter Bleakley

Post by Culper Jr. » Thu Dec 31, 2020 7:41 pm

Absolutely fantastic interview with RFM! I also listened to his facebook recordings and they are great as well. He articulates so many of my feelings about the church so incredibly well.

One thing he was talking about on his facebook recordings that I found interesting was how the "mormon ideal" is available to so incredibly few members. Unless you are married in the temple and everyone in your family is active, the best you can hope for is RMN's "sad heaven". Unless you are part of this mormon royal elite, you'll always be "less than" and inferior in some way.

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deacon blues
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Re: RFM and Peter Bleakley

Post by deacon blues » Tue Jan 05, 2021 12:05 pm

I just finished listening and it's brilliant. Bleakley is so articulate. He mentions videos of Church leaders talking about the 100 billion dollar investments and also Kenyan tithing sermons. I do I find these?
God is Love. God is Truth

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wtfluff
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Re: RFM and Peter Bleakley

Post by wtfluff » Tue Jan 05, 2021 2:00 pm

I've been slowly getting through Bleakley's FakeBook "presentations." (YouTube links posted above.)

He's way too honest/blunt in his calling out of the top brass to remain a member "in good standing" for very long methinks.

Unless... He's had his 2nd-Anointing™ like another cohort of his from the UK in which the top brass can't "kick him out" and will just hope he quietly goes away? :roll:

It will be interesting to watch...
Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus

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Red Ryder
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Re: RFM and Peter Bleakley

Post by Red Ryder » Wed Jan 06, 2021 9:53 am

I hate it when you guys talk about great podcasts.

I have to question my self induced Mormon podcast ban I placed upon myself a few years back and make an exception to listen.

What is his end game?

To agitate for change from within?

What’s caused him to be so vocal and speak out on a known “anti Mormon” podcast?
Those who do not move do not notice their chains. —Rosa Luxemburg

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Yobispo
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Re: RFM and Peter Bleakley

Post by Yobispo » Wed Jan 06, 2021 10:18 am

Red Ryder wrote:
Wed Jan 06, 2021 9:53 am
I hate it when you guys talk about great podcasts.

I have to question my self induced Mormon podcast ban I placed upon myself a few years back and make an exception to listen.

What is his end game?

To agitate for change from within?

What’s caused him to be so vocal and speak out on a known “anti Mormon” podcast?
From what I heard, Bro. Bleakley loves his church, has given his heart & soul to it and is disgusted by how the current crop of leaders have lied, evaded, water-down and even changed the church. They have made positive changes kicking and screaming, and have increased the leader worship. It's been mentioned already, but one of his strong objections is to revelation by committee, which was exactly how the Catholics made their creeds. Leaders today explain how revelation works in terms of committee work, and I agree that is not what the church taught for a long time.

He's a breath of fresh air, and I'm a guy who headed to the exit.

ETA: He dropped episode 4 last night, so there's more to hear now.

Charlotte
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Re: RFM and Peter Bleakley

Post by Charlotte » Wed Jan 06, 2021 10:48 am

I can’t find episode 4 on YouTube. Could someone link to it? Thanks.

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Yobispo
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Re: RFM and Peter Bleakley

Post by Yobispo » Wed Jan 06, 2021 11:44 am

Charlotte wrote:
Wed Jan 06, 2021 10:48 am
I can’t find episode 4 on YouTube. Could someone link to it? Thanks.
try Peter's Facebook page

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Just This Guy
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Re: RFM and Peter Bleakley

Post by Just This Guy » Mon Jan 11, 2021 7:08 pm

I finally finished this podcast today.

One thing that was interesting was when Peter was going on about church leaders lying not getting revelation. Is it just me, or did they reach a point where Peter didn't want to dig deeper? He stated that for he thought leaders didn't want to admit that they were lying, but that begs the question of why would they be lying?

Okay, maybe it's the Quality Engineer in me, but this is a perfect root cause analysis place. Even a 5-why would be very informative. Peter, Why are church leaders lying? From there, keep the 5-why going to see where the real problems are. Peter says he wants to turn the church around. Part of fixing a problem is to truly understand the underlying causes of the problems.

I have not listened to Peters original podcast, so I can't comment on if he gets into the root problems, or not. But based on on RFM's podcast, he seams to be avoiding looking to deeper there. I don't know if that just wasn't on the agenda or if he is avoding looking too deeply into the church.
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